Are our law enforcement employees so poorly trained that they shoot anyone who moves?
I have used their training devices. They are better trained than this.
When you are trying to take someone alive, you leave them no chance to escape. I saw the armored vehicles at this place. Why didn’t law enforcement have one there and drive in and close off any chance for escape from the front?
In an ambush, you don’t have your own people in the line of fire. That way you avoid shooting your own people.
I leave it to you to decide.
At the roadblock, did they shut down all the escape routes or did they have clear fields of fire because the pursuit vehicles were not pursuing.
Remember, this was a planned grab. Law enforcement decided where to take these people.
My Father in law is a retired policeman. I have had friends in law enforcement my whole life. I don’t take any pleasure in showing how this was a failed operation.
But it was a failed operation. There is no denying that. They were to be taken alive and one of them is dead. The standard is 100% alive. They didn’t meet the standard. They failed.
If they can’t do that, then they should go into another line of work. Making correct split second decisions is a requirement for law enforcement.
These law enforcement personnel are probably great guys with loving families. I don’t care. They get paid to succeed. They didn’t.
Covering up incompetence isn’t loyalty, it’s accessory.
Agreed, but not so sure the goal was no kills. Two men shooting at Finicum. Shooting randomly at the occupied vehicle. Nahhh, this stinks to high heaven. It’s not like they were chasing Bonnie and Clyde. Just some very angry men who were protesting the unjust imprisonment of fellow ranchers and yet another land grab by the Feds. This happened in Nevada at the Bundy ranch, and that is why they are in sympathy with the Hammonds. That was in the summer when more people could get out there in support. Dead of winter in east Oregon...hardly anyone even knows what happened or why.
I believe they are generally trained better than the cowboys in the video. There doesn't appear to be any identifying markers usually worn by legitimate LEOs. Have the shooters actually been identified as members of specific LEO's?
I ask that because my concern rests not in the 'who struck John' distraction but as others have already pointed out we are watching an out of control administration getting increasingly arrogant in the actions it chooses to take against those who question the right of the political elite to make up their rules as they go along and discard our Constitution as they see fit.
As for the shooting site, there was a lot of blacktop between the site of the first stop and the road block. Was it necessary to set up behind a curve in the road when the snow could have been used as a tool almost anywhere along Rt 395 to impede any attempt to go around a road block.
How likely would a crazed fugitive seeking to escape federal arrest for criminal charges as serious as the Finicum party believed they were facing put his brakes on when suddenly facing a road block?
Yet, anyone watching the video can see the truck's brake lights go on almost immediately when the driver sees the vehicles blocking the road ahead making it less likely that the maneuver into the snow on the left side of the road was an effort to go around the road block than it was to avoid a crash.
Your observation about not putting your people in the line of fire was one that popped into my mind real quick and I'm sure into the minds of most viewers with any firearm use experience.
That shooting looked like it was modeled after the opening sequence of the Wild Bunch movie. So yes, indeed, if that wasn't a planned killing, it's going to take a whole lot of explaining how things got so far out of control so fast and why two Oregon senators and assorted federal bureaucrats got so furious they felt the need to launch a half-assed operation on a group of concerned civic minded citizens who only appeared to be threat to no one but an increasingly shaky political elite.
Just two more cents from me.