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To: SWAMPSNIPER

Sorry not proof, but does lead toward it.

Gun Runner was not Fast And Furious just as Wide Receiver was not. There may be documents that do link the GR with FF or POTUS with FF but this presser does not do that, which it did though.


8 posted on 06/20/2012 2:50:51 PM PDT by Bidimus1
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To: Bidimus1

correction WISH it did


11 posted on 06/20/2012 2:52:59 PM PDT by Bidimus1
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To: Bidimus1; SWAMPSNIPER
F&F and WR were sub-sets of Gunrunner:

This (below) from Wiki.

(BTW, The ridiculous and superfluous “thanks” given by each speaker to Obama reminds me of terrorists beginning each statement with “By the will and grace of the all-powerful and merciful Allah, we today announce that we have killed......)

WIKI:

“ATF Project Gunrunner has a stated official objective to stop the sale and export of guns from the United States into Mexico in order to deny Mexican drug cartels the firearms considered “tools of the trade”.[20] However, since 2006 under Operation Fast and Furious, Operation Wide Receiver and others, it did the opposite by permitting, encouraging and facilitating ‘straw purchase’ firearm sales to traffickers, and allowing the guns to ‘walk’ and be transported to Mexico. This has resulted in the death of US border agent Brian Terry and considerable controversy.[2][21][22][23]

Senator Charles E. Grassley (R-IA) initiated an investigation with a letter to ATF on 27 January 2011,[24] and again on 31 January 2011. ATF responded through the Department of Justice by denying all allegations.[25] Senator Grassley responded with specific documentation supporting the allegations in letters to U.S. Attorney General Holder on 9 Feb 2011[26] and 16 Feb 2011.[27] ATF refused to answer specific questions in a formal briefing to Senator Grassley on 10 Feb 2011.

In October 2011, documents were released that indicated Holder was sent memos in regards to Operation Fast and Furious in 2010, contradicting Holder's sworn testimony before the House Judiciary Committee in which he said he was unaware of Operation Fast and Furious until April 2011. In response, Lamar Smith, the chairman of the Judiciary Committee, sent a letter to President Obama, requesting the appointment of an independent special counsel to investigate whether Holder committed perjury by lying to the committee while under oath.[28]

Indictments filed in federal court, documentation obtained by Senator Grassley, and statements of ATF agents obtained by Senator Grassley and CBS News, show that the ATF Phoenix Field Division allowed and facilitated the sale of over 2,500 firearms (AK-47 rifles, FN 5.7mm pistols, AK-47 pistols, and .50 caliber rifles) in ‘straw man purchases’ destined for Mexico.[21][29][30][31][32][33] According to ATF agents, Mexican officials were not notified, and ATF agents operating in Mexico were instructed not to alert Mexican authorities about the operation.[34] Some ATF agents and supervisors strongly objected, and gun dealers (who were cooperating with ATF) protested the sales, but were asked by ATF to complete the transactions to expose the supply chain and gather intelligence.[21][35] However, there are accusations that the ATF was attempting to boost statistics to ‘prove’ that American guns are arming the Mexican drug cartels and to further budget and political objectives.[36] It has been established that this operation violated long-established ATF policies and practices and that it is not a recognized investigative technique.[37]

Many of these same guns are being recovered from crime scenes in Arizona[38] and throughout Mexico,[39] which is artificially inflating ATF’s eTrace statistics of U.S. origin guns seized in Mexico. Two of these guns recovered at the crime scene are linked to the murder of Customs and Border Protection Agent Brian Terry on December 14, 2010.”

16 posted on 06/20/2012 2:58:25 PM PDT by MindBender26 (America can survive 4 years of Romney. She cannot survive another 4 years of an unfettered Obama!)
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To: Bidimus1; SWAMPSNIPER
F&F and WR were sub-sets of Gunrunner:

This (below) from Wiki.

(BTW, The ridiculous and superfluous “thanks” given by each speaker to Obama reminds me of terrorists beginning each statement with “By the will and grace of the all-powerful and merciful Allah, we today announce that we have killed......)

WIKI:

“ATF Project Gunrunner has a stated official objective to stop the sale and export of guns from the United States into Mexico in order to deny Mexican drug cartels the firearms considered “tools of the trade”.[20] However, since 2006 under Operation Fast and Furious, Operation Wide Receiver and others, it did the opposite by permitting, encouraging and facilitating ‘straw purchase’ firearm sales to traffickers, and allowing the guns to ‘walk’ and be transported to Mexico. This has resulted in the death of US border agent Brian Terry and considerable controversy.[2][21][22][23]

Senator Charles E. Grassley (R-IA) initiated an investigation with a letter to ATF on 27 January 2011,[24] and again on 31 January 2011. ATF responded through the Department of Justice by denying all allegations.[25] Senator Grassley responded with specific documentation supporting the allegations in letters to U.S. Attorney General Holder on 9 Feb 2011[26] and 16 Feb 2011.[27] ATF refused to answer specific questions in a formal briefing to Senator Grassley on 10 Feb 2011.

In October 2011, documents were released that indicated Holder was sent memos in regards to Operation Fast and Furious in 2010, contradicting Holder's sworn testimony before the House Judiciary Committee in which he said he was unaware of Operation Fast and Furious until April 2011. In response, Lamar Smith, the chairman of the Judiciary Committee, sent a letter to President Obama, requesting the appointment of an independent special counsel to investigate whether Holder committed perjury by lying to the committee while under oath.[28]

Indictments filed in federal court, documentation obtained by Senator Grassley, and statements of ATF agents obtained by Senator Grassley and CBS News, show that the ATF Phoenix Field Division allowed and facilitated the sale of over 2,500 firearms (AK-47 rifles, FN 5.7mm pistols, AK-47 pistols, and .50 caliber rifles) in ‘straw man purchases’ destined for Mexico.[21][29][30][31][32][33] According to ATF agents, Mexican officials were not notified, and ATF agents operating in Mexico were instructed not to alert Mexican authorities about the operation.[34] Some ATF agents and supervisors strongly objected, and gun dealers (who were cooperating with ATF) protested the sales, but were asked by ATF to complete the transactions to expose the supply chain and gather intelligence.[21][35] However, there are accusations that the ATF was attempting to boost statistics to ‘prove’ that American guns are arming the Mexican drug cartels and to further budget and political objectives.[36] It has been established that this operation violated long-established ATF policies and practices and that it is not a recognized investigative technique.[37]

Many of these same guns are being recovered from crime scenes in Arizona[38] and throughout Mexico,[39] which is artificially inflating ATF’s eTrace statistics of U.S. origin guns seized in Mexico. Two of these guns recovered at the crime scene are linked to the murder of Customs and Border Protection Agent Brian Terry on December 14, 2010.”

17 posted on 06/20/2012 2:58:43 PM PDT by MindBender26 (America can survive 4 years of Romney. She cannot survive another 4 years of an unfettered Obama!)
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To: Bidimus1
Sorry not proof, but does lead toward it. Gun Runner was not Fast And Furious just as Wide Receiver was not.

Uh, this was back in 2009. Do ya think that maybe, just maybe, they hadn't come up with a neat name like F&F yet, and used the name for the Bush program they were building off of? Ya think?

Oh, and note that they're talking about a program the president is very interested in, Gun Runner. When since this all broke, they've claimed F&F was started by the Bush administration, and is all their fault. No proof? Give it a break.

30 posted on 06/20/2012 3:15:08 PM PDT by bcsco
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To: Bidimus1
Project Gunrunner was the agency-wide program. F&F was part of Project Gunrunner out of the Tucson ATF office just as Operation Castaway, which ran guns to Honduras out of the Tampa ATF office, was a part of Project Gunrunner. One of the guns used to kill ICE Agent Jaime Zapata was "walked" from a Texas gun shop so that would have been a different ATF operation than F&F too but still part of Project Gunrunner.
59 posted on 06/20/2012 5:19:18 PM PDT by TigersEye (Life is about choices. Your choices. Make good ones.)
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