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To: Colofornian
"Now be honest: Is that a front-and-center message churned out by Jews? (I don't think so)"

As you well know the Jews do NOT proselytize and push their message out to the masses as Christian missionaries do. It's against their belief system to do so.

They do, however, believe that Christianity is an apostate version of Judaism and when asked about it will explain it to you.

Let me see if I understand you. If all LDS missionaries were pulled back, and the apostate message was put to the back of the webpages, yet all Mormons still felt the same way, you would be less prone to dispute them? It's a matter of presentation, not belief, that annoys you?
388 posted on 05/25/2011 6:22:44 AM PDT by magritte ("There are moments, Jeeves, when one asks oneself "Do trousers matter?")
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To: magritte
It's a matter of presentation, not belief, that annoys you?

Hie thee to Kolob the Religion Forum if you want to talk about this stuff!

404 posted on 05/25/2011 6:52:14 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going)
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To: magritte; Graybeard58
front and center message

Allow me to define "front and center message" for you in a more comprehensive way so you'll understand the context.

As I look at the Jewish faith, the rejection of Jesus as the Messiah is indeed what I believe will constitute a make-or-break aspect of how Judgment Day will begin to be sorted out.

However, does the Jewish faith operate on this same single premise? That if they don't disprove the Messiahship of Jesus, it cannot justify its very existence?

(I don't think so)

In a related way, does the Jewish faith operate on the single premise that if it can't 100% undermine the very authentic existence of the Christian church, its very continued existence is at stake? (Again, I don't think so)

Therefore, the reality of the established Christian church is not the perceived single premise that makes or breaks Judaism as it has continued on.

The same cannot be said of the Mormon religion -- at least in terms of the rejection of the church of the Messiah.

Mormon leaders HAVE to somehow disprove the authentic reality of the historic Christian church or else it cannot justify its very existence!

If the historic Christian church was weakened, but was still in existence, then there was no need for a Smith "restoration." A reformation perhaps? (Of course. Reformation is ongoing). But a "restoration" as Mormons use it is always a two-pronged conceptual understanding: UNIVERSAL APOSTASY and restoration.

If no restoration from the ground floor up was needed, Smith was superflous. He was redundant.

Mormonism has never claimed to be a reformation -- a branch from Protestantism. (I can cite you chapter & verse on that from their leaders).

If the Mormon church allowed the historic Christian church to be deemed a truly authentic church alongside of it, then Smith's words in the opening Doctrine & Covenants of the Mormon church make him out to be a false prophet. There, Smith claimed that the Mormon church was the "only true and living church on the face of the earth." (D&C 1:30)

Therefore, the Mormon church rests upon this single premise: It is built upon the presumed mass graveyard of historic Christianity. That it was dead. And was in need of a Smith-led resurrection.

If you take away that single premise, that single pillar of the Mormon church, you have no Mormon church.

It's in this way that the Mormon messengers cannot be separated from the Mormon message. If the Mormon message removed the apostasy, it's also removing its very central pillar of the restoration.

So you have an epic fail here if you somehow think that Mormons could simply relocate this message of theirs "to the back of the webpages" and muzzle their missionaries.

I cannot see them putting their central pillar on its back burner.

Finally, another consideration is in order. I covered this in my last post to Graybeard58: Judaism doesn't claim to be Christianity, now does it? That can't be said of Mormonism, which does claim to be Christianity.

Let's say you were distributing a certain beer brand. And somebody else came along offering that same beer brand -- but it was a totally different product -- you wouldn't care? Or what if you were a retailer & another retailer hijacked your exact same distinctive name. Won't you risk your reputation going down the drain with the other retailer if you don't respond to at least distinguish them from you?

The latter above is happening all the time due to Mormonism.

Let's take how Mormonism has provoked liberals to take broad pot-shots at religion in general: What else do you call the Book of Mormon musical phenomenon in NY?

Have you looked @ the "anthem" that musical uses? Its title...so appalling I won't repeat it here for fear of being struck down by God! The anthem isn't just aimed at Mormonism, but the low-grade god Mormonism says it embraces! Yet, liberals don't distinguish between the Mormon god and the Christian god, now do they? (In fact, sadly, many conservative FREEPERS show their shallowness and don't either)

Peter Preston of the UK Guardian wrote a column this week that pinpoints this exact effect of Mormonism.

Even though as Preston wrote it, he was referencing Book of Mormon the stage production -- not Book of Mormon the book -- what he said actually applies to both: "When The Book of Mormon mocks one religion it – sweetly or sourly – pulls every religion down with it"
Source: Mocking the Mormons: A musical deriding Latter Day Saints – sweetly or sourly – pulls every religion down with it

The musical Book of Mormon drags all other religions down with it besides Mormonism...But you know what, so does the book the Book of Mormon: It, too, mocks all other religions as being of Satan (1 Nephi 14:9-10).

Such irony. It's as if God has said, "Mormons, with your book of Mormon, you mock my people as Satan's. He who mocks with the printed sword will themselves endure mocking. As you drag down, others also not of My Name will join your drag-down campaign."

432 posted on 05/25/2011 7:29:32 AM PDT by Colofornian (Key Q for Romney & Huntsman: Show us your spirit-birth certificate from Kolob)
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