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CNN says that Hawaii couldn't have verified Obama's Original B.C. last year--who's lying?
Count Us Out ^

Posted on 07/24/2009 9:32:50 PM PDT by MissTickly

CNN President Jon Klein sent an e-mail to staffers of “Lou Dobbs Tonight” just as the program went to air, informing them that CNN researchers had determined that Hawaiian officials discarded all paper documents in 2001

TVNewser has learned CNN/U.S. president Jon Klein sent an email to a handful of “Lou Dobbs Tonight” staffers last night regarding the coverage of the so-called birthers and the validity of Pres. Obama’s birth in the U.S.

In part, Klein writes, “It seems this story is dead- because anyone who still is not convinced doesn’t really have a legitimate beef.” Klein asked CNN researchers to dig into the question of why Obama couldn’t produce the original birth certificate. The researchers contacted the Hawaii Health Dept. and confirmed that paper documents were discarded in 2001 when the department went paperless. That reportedly includes Pres. Obama’s original birth certificate.

Read More Here:

http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/cnn/jon_klein_on_birthers_it_seems_this_story_is_dead_122546.asp#more

My Researcher:

October 2008, Hawaiian officials reported that they had personally verified the existence of Barack Obama’s original birth certificate: State officials say there’s no doubt Barack Obama was born in Hawaii.

Health Department Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino says she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama’s original birth certificate.

Fukino says that no state official, including Gov. Linda Lingle, ever instructed that Obama’s certificate be handled differently from any other. She says state law bars release of a certified birth certificate to anyone who does not have a tangible interest in it.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcertificate.asp

WHY ALL THE LIES? SOMETHING IS FISHY. THEY DISCARDED IT 8 YEARS AGO, YET SEEN IT IN 2008?


TOPICS: Politics
KEYWORDS: birthcertificate; certifigate; cnn; hawaii; obama
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To: MissTickly

Well, I was trying to point out that “integrity” is determined by different methodologies in a different medium. And that means when you say that a certain “methodology” is lost (in the forensics for “paper”), it’s because it does not apply in the medium of “digital”. The point of the matter is that it’s not “integrity” that is lost, but rather a “methodology of forensics” that is lost, as it *only applies* to “paper” — and it does not apply to “digital”. It has a different methodology and forensics for determination of “integrity”...


141 posted on 07/26/2009 10:49:06 AM PDT by Star Traveler (The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is a Zionist and Jerusalem is the apple of His eye.)
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To: Star Traveler

Correct, but my overall point is outside of the fact that something new and different is gained at the same time. Only that something was lost.—you call it a “methodology of forensics” call it integrity.


142 posted on 07/26/2009 11:19:02 AM PDT by MissTickly
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To: MissTickly

Well, I guess in a way some things are lost... I’m sure that there is some things about buggy whips that were lost, too..., when we all went to cars. However, I don’t think a whole lot of people are mourning the change...


143 posted on 07/26/2009 11:22:21 AM PDT by Star Traveler (The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is a Zionist and Jerusalem is the apple of His eye.)
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To: Star Traveler

Buggy whips have never really played a critical role in government though or we’d be desperate for them, too.=)


144 posted on 07/26/2009 11:25:39 PM PDT by MissTickly
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To: Star Traveler

There is a Constitutional requirement that a presidential candidate be born in the US. The reason for that requirement was to insure that no foreigner could run for president. Americans had had enough of people “governing” them an ocean away.

So, there is a “born in the USA” requirement. What there does not seem to be in place is a formal process of verifying the requirement was met. Moreover, as far as I can tell, the requirement was never an issue before since everyone running for US president was “native born”.

That being said, it does not in any way diminish, let alone remove, the Constitutional requirement.

Now, if there is a requirement there must be a device to verify the requirement is correct. That device is a birth certificate. To say that there is no requirement to produce a birth certificate is specious and/or disengenuous. INHERENT in the place of birth requirement is the requirement to PROVE place of birth—ergo produce a birth certificate.

Please don’t insult my intelligence by pretending there is no Constitutional requirement for a presidential candidate to be a native born American.


145 posted on 07/27/2009 6:29:27 AM PDT by dools007
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To: dools007

You said — Now, if there is a requirement there must be a device to verify the requirement is correct. That device is a birth certificate. To say that there is no requirement to produce a birth certificate is specious and/or disengenuous. INHERENT in the place of birth requirement is the requirement to PROVE place of birth—ergo produce a birth certificate.

Birth certificates would be one way to do it, but it’s not the only way. It’s the plain and obvious fact of the matter just from our own recent candidates in just the last decades, that there is no legal requirement for a birth certificate. You won’t find that in the Constitution either.

What you find in the Constitution is the requirements for the candidate to *be*. And that’s precisely what the candidates have sworn on an oath that they *are*. But, it does not say that a birth certificate has to be produced. That’s something in your own mind and not in the Constitution.

And it wouldn’t be in the Constitution either, because birth certificates weren’t being issued back then. I’m not saying it a bad idea, but that it’s not a legally required thing for the candidate. And that’s precisely why you see that no one has been able to *compel* the candidate to produce it.

What you’re arguing about is what you *want* to have done. But, there is no legal requirement for it to be done.

And there has been a method in place for a candidate running for office of the President of the United States. It’s what they’re doing now. The candidates sign a sworn oath that they *are* what the Constitution says they must *be* (the three qualifications) and that’s exactly what the candidates have done.

Now, the easy solution is very simply to put into place that state legislation that will require candidates to produce a birth certificate or else they will not be placed on the ballot of that statte. That’s what three states have been working on (including mine, although for mine, it will take next session to get it done).


146 posted on 07/27/2009 8:24:40 AM PDT by Star Traveler (The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is a Zionist and Jerusalem is the apple of His eye.)
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To: Star Traveler

First, you need to reread what I wrote. I said INHERENT in the Constitution’s “native born” requirement is a requirement that it is proven. I never said the Constitution required a Birth Certificate, per se, to be produced. Of course, I’m assuming you know what INHERENT means.

Secondly, no presidential candidate’s “birth” qualification has ever been challenged to my knowledge. But, if McCain had challenged Onada, how would he prove he was born on American soil? Yep, birth certificate. So the issue may be offuscated this and that way, but all roads lead back to the potential need for a birth certificate.

Thirdly, you are quite right that in the past presidential candidates merely affirmed, under oath, that they were qualified to be president of the US. But that was back in the day when politicians were Americans first, supported the Consitution as it is written and retained a modicum of honor.

The Marxist Onada, of course, is the antitithesis of each and very one of those things. In fact, Onada swore to “uphold and defend” a Constitution that he has publicly is flawed. Therefore, as a minimum, he has lied and should be impeachable on that basis alone.

So, now that the Dear Leader and the Demrat Party have attacked the Constitution (that Onada swore to uphold), a mechanism must be put in place to close the loop hole. Hopefully, the states will ultimately take care of it.


147 posted on 07/27/2009 1:30:10 PM PDT by dools007
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To: dools007

The inherent method is the sworn oaths that candidates give. And that’s a valid method because if any candidate lies under oath, per the qualifications, all that needs to be done — to stop that candidate from continuing — is to show that he lied under oath in regards to any of those three requirements and that’s the end of that candidate... he’s over...

As far as McCain was concerned, he did look into it and determined that there was not anything there to challenge and thus, he and his campaign did not pursue it. I can provide the recent article that said that. It was in the last couple of days or more.

So, McCain did follow it up and he and his staff determined — “nope” ... no challenge. That pretty much says that there’s nothing there to challenge (to put a “fine point” on it, at least there was nothing to challenge as far as McCain and his staff are concerned). If he could have done something else, he would have, in order to disqualify the other person and win. And I say *that* because I do believe that McCain believes that those three qualifications given in the Constitution *must be upheld*.

I agree with a mechanism being put into place. And that’s what I’m proposing, too. But, let me say something about the idea of a “flawed document”... For one thing, keep in mind, that while the Constitution is the law of the land, it’s far from perfect. One does not put forth “Amendments” to a document that is perfect. So, it’s definitely not perfect. In fact, the Constitution was determined by the Supreme Court to allow slavery. That took a Constitutional Amendment to change that “understanding” of that document. And also, there’s the initial Amendments, the Bill of Rights. We all recognize those as absolutely essential. But, at one point in time, they were not there. And later, they were the first ten Amendments to be made. Now, we’re up to, ummm... about 27 Amendments, I think.

It goes without saying that the Constitution is not a perfect document, but it’s the law of the land and if we don’t like what one part says, we change it by an Amendment. I wouldn’t try to make it into a perfect document, but one that is the law of the land, one that we go by, one that we follow — and if we need to make an Amendment, then we will.


148 posted on 07/27/2009 1:55:32 PM PDT by Star Traveler (The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is a Zionist and Jerusalem is the apple of His eye.)
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To: Star Traveler

McCain did not challenge The Marxist Onada because Onada is black. McCain did not have to the courage to do what was required of him. The same goes for the RINO-led GOP.

The fact remains that all this speculation goes away if The Dear Leader simply produces some record documenting his place of birth. He has not done that. Common sense tells me that if he had such a document he would produce it. Common sense tells me that if he had such a document he would not have produced, for all practical purposes, a gaggle of perhaps legitimate or fake documents that prove nothing with regard to his place of birth.

In any case, I’m happy that you and I are in agreement that a formal vetting process should be put in place to insure this does not happen again. The current crop of RINO and demrat politicians are devoid of honor, patriotism and moral cognizance.


149 posted on 07/28/2009 6:33:06 AM PDT by dools007
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To: dools007

You said — The fact remains that all this speculation goes away if The Dear Leader simply produces some record documenting his place of birth. He has not done that. Common sense tells me that if he had such a document he would produce it. Common sense tells me that if he had such a document he would not have produced, for all practical purposes, a gaggle of perhaps legitimate or fake documents that prove nothing with regard to his place of birth.

There’s no good reason from Obama’s side of things for this to be released. It’s like a FReeper said the other day. He said that no matter what Obama showed, had printed in newspapers, shown on TV or websites, had experts examined, had others testify to — he would *never* believe *anything*.

And Obama knows that, so there’s no good reason on his side to show anything other than an official statement from Hawaii. That official statement will be sufficient for many. But, producing all sorts of things and experts and witnesses will *not be sufficient* for many that are seeking it here (exemplified from a FReeper post that I just told you about...).


150 posted on 07/28/2009 8:26:21 AM PDT by Star Traveler (The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is a Zionist and Jerusalem is the apple of His eye.)
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To: MissTickly

That was a quote from the source not my words....the link and my quotes before showed that. I have no dog in the fight.


151 posted on 07/28/2009 5:06:52 PM PDT by fight_truth_decay
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To: Brytani

I am quoting from:

That was all it was..did not suggest I was taking the side of that article.

Personally I doubt this will ever change the fact that Obama is President. Much of this research was done much too late and should have been an issue months before his election. You could say the MSM was on Obama’s side but you had Fox and Rush and Hannity etc and they didn’t find it necessary to research said subject.

McCain had much the same issue as not “a natural born” but a citizen.

Don’t know any of these bloggers.


152 posted on 07/28/2009 5:17:01 PM PDT by fight_truth_decay
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To: Star Traveler
Lou has said (controversy surrounded him too—in misquotes) that he believes Obama is a citizen. However, the gist of it was, as he clearly said, why didn't they try to just produce his BC and medical history and would put all the said blogger innuendos to rest.

Clinton never released his medical. Mrs. Clinton could have requested as well vs Obama. But Obama is President. The people spoke. Has been no government call to do so. Now if a Repub, would have committees set up to call for investigation, but the Democrats won, so will not be. The way the game is played.

What is best for the country ( I know, tongue in cheek ) like Nixon leaving under the same slogan.

The chaos would be International.

A cart with no horse is what this is.

153 posted on 07/28/2009 5:26:43 PM PDT by fight_truth_decay
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To: Star Traveler

That’s about as ********—well, I’m not going to say it.

That’s like saying that NASA should just “admit” that the moon landings did not happen simply because some people believe it was staged right here on terre firma. Or, it’s like saying that the Holocaust should be written off as a Jewish fabrication simply because some people believe it didn’t happen.

That’s like saying all crime should be decriminalized because the laws and sanctions against it have not achieved a crimeless society.

Your logic appears to be as specious as your politics.


154 posted on 07/29/2009 6:39:59 AM PDT by dools007
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To: dools007

Well... you’re saying that — not me... I’m saying something different...

I’m saying that there are realities going on here not “your wishes”... and those “realities” are what governs what happens and not what you think is the best thing for a political opponent to do.

One clear reality is that there is no legal requirement for any candidate to release their birth certificate. And then when people realize that, then I see some say well he *should* release it to make all this go away.

Well, they’re missing *another reality* in saying that. One thing I don’t think from Obama’s side that he figures that it’s in his benefit to release it. AND... that’s actually *obvious* to any thinking person.

And actually, this is even being *stated* by the White House Press guy, himself. Even *he* says it’s not in Obama’s benefit to release it. He says it plain as day.

But, I still see some posters here who persist in thinking that a candidate should be *required to do* — what they are plainly not required to do. And then I see some posters here saying then that he “should do” what *they* think he should do, saying that it’s in his benefit to do it, when the White House itself has made it clear that it’s not in his benefit.

I think a lot of people are just to far out of touch with “reality” to realize what is going on...

That’s why I say the most *reality-based thing* to do is to get a state law which requires the candidate to produce his birth certificate or else they cannot be on the ballot.

But, apparently, that’s just *way too simple* for some people to follow through with...


155 posted on 07/29/2009 6:51:18 AM PDT by Star Traveler (The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob is a Zionist and Jerusalem is the apple of His eye.)
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To: Star Traveler

Hawaii maintains original, paper-copy, birth certificates.


156 posted on 02/16/2010 5:18:49 AM PST by Beckwith (A "natural born citizen" -- two American citizen parents and born in the USA.)
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To: Beckwith
I said up above ...

All they do when someone wants their certified copy of their birth certificate is that they print out their high resolution image original stamp and certify it and you’ve got your certified birth certificate. Nothing is lost and/or changed, except the fact of “going digital”...

Then you replied ...

Hawaii maintains original, paper-copy, birth certificates.


I know where the "copies" come from that are certified as copies of the original... they come from the digital version. They just push a computer-key and "out comes the copy" ... :-)

157 posted on 02/16/2010 7:28:42 AM PST by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: Star Traveler

I said up above ...

All they do when someone wants their certified copy of their birth certificate is that they print out their high resolution image original stamp and certify it and you’ve got your certified birth certificate. Nothing is lost and/or changed, except the fact of “going digital”...
Then you replied ...

Hawaii maintains original, paper-copy, birth certificates.


I know where the “copies” come from that are certified as copies of the original... they come from the digital version. They just push a computer-key and “out comes the copy” ... :-)


I have no quarrel with your post.

They still have the paper ones. Take it to the bank.


158 posted on 02/16/2010 11:29:49 AM PST by Beckwith (A "natural born citizen" -- two American citizen parents and born in the USA.)
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