For the record let us review a few recent posts from DU members WilliamPitt and benburch on May 17, 2005 (the WilliamPitt posts are of course lengthy, but bear with me):
WilliamPitt Donating member (1000+ posts)
Tue May-17-05 01:02 PM
Original message
I'm pretty upset right now, and I need an explanation
Edited on Tue May-17-05 01:09 PM by WilliamPitt
As you all know, I was one of the people who took point on raising money for Andy. I wrote about it for truthout two or three times, and convinced the crew at Progressive Democrats of America as well that we needed to raise a call for help.
This is what I wrote for truthout on May 3rd:
"A few weeks ago, Andy was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer, one of the more dangerous varieties of the disease. His doctors told him he needed a Whipple procedure to get at the tumor, and only a few hospitals in America can perform this complicated procedure with the required competence. To compound the problem, Andy shares the plight of millions of others in our disgusting for-profit health care system and does not have health insurance."
This is what I wrote on the PDA blog, in our call for help, on April 29th:
"Several weeks ago, Andy was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer. He was recently told that he must undergo what is called a Whipple Procedure. This is a very serious surgery that few hospitals in America are skilled enough to perform well, and requires significant time for recovery. Fortunately, some friends managed to get Andy a slot at Johns Hopkins Medical Center, one of the premier hospitals for this type of procedure. He is slated for the procedure in the second week of May. Unfortunately, the hospital requires a $25,000 down-payment before they assent to doing the Whipple, and requires another $25,000 once the procedure is done. They are expecting the down-payment immediately."
The basis for this started way back in February. On the 29th, I posted this truthout blog entry, which I reposted here on the first and fifteenth of every month to help raise money:
"For the last several weeks, Andy has been suffering through a bout of Hepatitis. The word came down yesterday, however, that his situation is far more serious. 'I apparently have a tumor growing around the bile duct where it passes through my pancreas," he wrote. "The tissue sample was consistent with malignancy; it could be benign but I am planning for the worst.'"
Note that here it says 'tumor.' In subsequent weeks I was told that it was pancreatic cancer requiring a Whipple. Note also that the fundraising for Andy did not start a week or so ago, but started three months ago.
I woke up today to this DU thread, in which it was reported:
"fyi: it is a tumour on the duct, not the pancreas themselves. it looks to not have spread at all. it is not pancreatic cancer as others have posted, but if it was not caught early enough, it would have certainly spread there."
"...as others have posted..."
I am one of those "others" who posted it was pancreatic cancer, requiring a Whipple. I posted it here, on truthout, and on PDA. I did so because that is what I was told was the diagnosis, repeatedly, by both Andy and others.
Now that it turns out not to be the case, I have some questions:
1. If it was not the very serious pancreatic cancer, why did the surgery need to be done at Johns Hopkins?
2. If a Whipple was not required, why was $25,000 and then $50,000 needed for this surgery? Andy could have gotten this far-less-serious procedure done back in Seattle for a hell of a lot less money.
3. Why was I personally told this was pancreatic cancer? Why was I allowed to repeat this now-inaccurate diagnosis many times without anyone correcting me?
Understand: I believe Andy has a tumor of some kind, and this requires medical attention. I do not think this entire situation was fabricated from nothing.
But the 400 people who will come into this thread with "Andy doesn't need this stress" can hold your water. Andy is apparently a hell of a lot less ill than I and others were led to believe, and I need some answers. I put my reputation, the reputation of truthout, the reputation of PDA, and the reputations of all the people who work for those organizations on the line not once, not twice, but every day for weeks on this. I have a huge, huge responsibility here, and I am not going to just let that drop.
I have a personal reason for asking these questions over and above everything else. A great and good friend of PDA, activist Damu Smith, was recently diagnosed with advanced colon cancer. There is no ambiguity about this diagnosis. But because I was told Andy had pancreatic cancer requiring a $50,000 Whipple in the best hospital on the Eastern seaboard, I talked PDA into diverting time and resources towards Andy. This wound up diverting time and resources away from Damu.
I would like some answers. No wait and see. I have spent time with Andy, worked with him, thought I knew him well enough to vouch for him in a time of crisis. I am feeling personally betrayed right now, and furthermore I have put far more than my own feelings and standing on the line here.
If you think I'm a bastard for asking, I will live with that. But if this is not explained to a degree I find satisfactory, there is going to be hell to pay.
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WilliamPitt
Tue May-17-05 03:29 PM
Original message
'Need an explanation' Thread II
This is thread one, which is getting pretty huge:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
First of all, I'm not going to apologize for asking these questions. Something is not right about all this. Let's be clear:
The very-publicly-proclaimed diagnosis of pancreatic cancer, which I was personally told of, was changed to a thread-buried diagnosis of pancreatitis. The first is deadly dangerous, the second is very much not.
An enormous amount of money was raised in rapid fashion based on the aforementioned first diagnosis. For those who say 'Big deal' about the money raised, understand that it isn't about the money itself, nor is it about 'my ego.'
The organizations I work for, plus a whole bunch of organizations I have never heard of, took 'pancreatic cancer' and raised it to the rooftops. I am getting frightened PMs and emails from representatives of these organizations.
It isn't about the money. It is about the ability of these organizations to fundraise for important causes we all believe in. If this situation is not on the level, the ability for those organizations to do their good work is now imperiled. That hurts each and every one of us.
I believe Andy is sick, and I believe he needs treatment. I believe the compassion showed by DUers and others in rallying to his aid was and remains one of the most remarkable things I have ever seen.
But, based on the aforementioned concerns, I need to know why we were allowed to yell 'pancreatic cancer' and 'Whipple' and 'impending death' from the rooftops for weeks. I need to know why $50,000 was raised for a procedure at Johns Hopkins, when it appears now the diagnosed ailment could have been treated on the cheap in Seattle.
I need to know why I've been allowed to believe Andy was dying, why I was not told that this wasn't the case. Hell, a part of me is massively relieved...but the rest of me is badly hurt and deeply confused. I have called Andy my friend. Friends usually tell friends when they are no longer dying. I never heard that, and had to read it buried in a thread. If you need a personal impetus for my posts, you can have that.
This could all be a vast miscommunication. If so, if all this is on the up-and-up and it is just a matter of a bunch of wires getting crossed, then I will take whatever rap is coming for stirring up a hornet's nest. But I am not going to apologize. Anyone who thinks this is just about me does not appreciate the scope of the issue here. Hundreds of people, a bunch of important organizations and dozens of important causes are on the hook with this.
To answer the question of why I didn't talk to Andy, all I can say is this. I did talk to Andy. Dozens of times. It was from him first that I got the pancreatic cancer/Whipple/Johns Hopkins thing. It was from him first that I got the death-is-impending messages. Dozens of times. It was talking to Andy that started this, and right now, I am not at all comfortable going to Andy for confirmation of anything.
The pancreatic cancer diagnosis, the death-is-impending statements, the need to have all that money and the need for Johns Hopkins were all very publicly proclaimed. The hysteria to get it done was propelled in no small part by threads and posts from Andy himself. Therefore, a demand for an accounting of the vast discrepancies must also be public.
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benburch (1000+ posts) Tue May-17-05 06:25 PMResponse to Original message
165. Hi! Umm...
Edited on Tue May-17-05 06:26 PM by benburch I am not sure where to start with this.I certainly didn't mean to unleash a firestorm. Now it seems that we are in a situation in which there is no resolution without somebody I respected getting hurt.I only was asking if he was OK, and hoping he was not in pain. I didn't want to magnify his troubles or damage anybody's reputation at all. And I have to note that we still don't have anything that would stand up to legal tests of fact on either side of this issue. This is a message board on the Internet, not an organ of public record, after all.To quote the famous line for "Easy Rider" - "What we have here is a failure to communicate."Andy, or one of his caregivers needs to come up with a couple of bits of data that would settle this whole mess if provided;- What is Andy's exact diagnosis?- What tests support that?- How much money, exactly, was raised? (A printout of the History log from PayPal would be a good start, or the bank records that the money finally cleared through.)Provide those and I think we can put this behind us.I regret any pain I may have caused you, Andy, and I continue to hope for your swift and complete recovery.And on behalf of myself and my website I apologize to everybody at DU for having lit the match to this powder keg.
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benburch (1000+ posts) Tue May-17-05 06:50 PMResponse to Reply #180
233. I agree, Will.
When I hear "Pancreatic Cancer" I think of the fact that everybody I ever knew who had it died very quickly.I wasn't looking for the big picture I guess, just trying to ascertain the immediate facts.Either he is sick, or he isn't.Either he is as sick as he said, or he isn't.Either he collected $50K, or he collected a whole lot more.And honestly, I cannot see that we could sort out the difference between these points without full disclosure.Will, much as I hate to suggest this, perhaps now would be a good time to involve legal council?
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Does anyone see any similarity between the questions raised by 2 longtime members of DU and the questions raised here at FR? I certainly do. And yet we are heartless and "mean-spirited" "graveyard rats" for daring to ask. What does that make WilliamPitt and benburch?
But the questions raised by DU members and others remain unanswered. And certain DU members have resorted to intimidation tactics in an attempt to quell any further inquiry. Now that is very difficult to understand, because the intimidation tactics only apply to non-members of DU. But what is the difference between their very reasonable questions regarding a public fund-raising event and ours?
Maybe Xaos will return as Xaos_3 and explain it all.
Yes, I read that benburch BS at mistys. Maybe he should start doing his psuedo-hacker tricks on DU members, who like himself have questions about the very public fund-raising efforts of Andy&Friends.
I do not understand their hostility towards anyone who asks the same questions as they have. And those questions remained unanswered.
I can distill all of the questions about the ASS (Andy Stephenson Situation) into one, clear and simple.
1. How much money was raised and how was it spent?
Certainly anyone concerned with open and honest elections would have a similar concern for open and honest fund-raising.
But to this day, not one single mention of the answer to that question. The other stuff is debatable, but an exact accounting of the money isn't. The donors deserve to know. But DU won't allow them to ask.
And so, as a public service to the DUmmies, we will ask for them.
This is true. Democratic Underground is NOT an anomaly.