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Scientists Vie To Break Junk DNA's Secret Code
The Telegraph (UK) ^ | Roger Highfield

Posted on 10/06/2003 4:34:06 PM PDT by blam

Scientists vie to break junk DNA's secret code

By Roger Highfield, Science Editor
(Filed: 06/10/2003)

Huge tracts of human DNA, previously written off as meaningless junk, have been found to contain a hitherto unrecognised "genetic grammar", making the language of our genes much more complex than previously thought.

The discovery is of potentially huge significance, since it could lead to an entirely new explanation for certain diseases and symptoms. A race is now on among teams of scientists worldwide to investigate this cryptic code.

While the genetic recipe of a human being is spelt out with three billion letters of DNA code, only about two per cent of these correspond to the genes - the DNA that describes the proteins that build and operate bodies.

In the latest issue of the journal Science, Prof Stylianos Antonarakis of the University of Geneva Medical School, Dr Ewen Kirkness of the Institute of Genomic Research, Maryland, and colleagues have reported compelling evidence that up to three per cent of our genetic material has a crucial role that is not understood.

They made the unexpected discovery that some DNA regions of humans, dogs and species as distant as elephant and wallaby are nearly identical. These regions of what were once called junk have been dubbed "conserved non-genic sequences", or CNGs, a reference to how they are not conventional genes.

Prof Antonarakis said: "I suspect that mutations in CNGs may contribute to numerous genetic disorders." Defects in CNGs could result in illness while the symptoms of Down's syndrome, caused by an extra copy of a chromosome, might be linked to the presence of additional CNGs.

"Many laboratories are now working on identifying pathogenic mutations," he said.


TOPICS: Heated Discussion
KEYWORDS: crevolist; geneticgrammar; godsgravesglyphs; helixmakemineadouble; junkdna
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To: Alamo-Girl
Hi. Rest assured I was thinking about you, but you can best state your own position. It is, I think, a variation on position three. The approximation of 6000 years was based on human genealogy. The approximation of 4 billion+ years assumes a span of time prior to humans. Merely shifting time perspectives doesn't erase this difference, unless you wish to express one of your time dimensions as a hyperbolic function. But that would be engaging in hyperbole. ;^)
561 posted on 10/09/2003 9:03:55 PM PDT by js1138
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To: Doctor Stochastic
I'm having an epiphany.
562 posted on 10/09/2003 9:05:20 PM PDT by js1138
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To: Ogmios
Thank you so much! I'm glad you like it! Here's a link to a Jewish Physicist who sees it that:

Gerald Schroeder

And here are links to the ins and outs of my worldview and interpretation of Genesis and the Patriarchs:

Evolution Through the Back Door

Origins and Scripture


563 posted on 10/09/2003 9:09:27 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Ogmios
wow - for a newbie, you sound pretty seasoned at this ;)

I rarely get involved in crevo discussions because of the very reasons you've cited.

Every now and then I gotta put my $0.02 in, though

564 posted on 10/09/2003 9:11:57 PM PDT by PurVirgo (What would you do if FR was no more?? Please support FR!!!)
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To: Ogmios
I was amazed how when I joined these threads how the Creationist bunch kept asking me my religion,

Can you point out those posts? I have checked throughout this forum from the date of your joining it and found nary one question to you about your religion. You did, however, bring up the Holy Warrior epithet at post 98 on this thread. Can you clear up the mystery?

565 posted on 10/09/2003 9:13:52 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: PurVirgo
The use of restriction enzymes is pretty specific, and you can "cut out" the introns, which is how recombinant DNA technology works. E. coli, as a prokaryote, can be engineered to produce HgH, Factor VIII, and other human gene products. But the question remains - How does that information refute evolution?

It refutes it due to your example with insulin. If you split a gene, to make the proteins it made before you have to add the system that takes out the introns and splices it back at the correct place. As you said, it is very specific to each gene so you would need to have a very specific system set up for each split gene, impossible.

Have you ever indulged the theory about mitochondria?

Mitochondria has its own DNA, can replicate independently of the eukaryotic cell, is absent from prokaryotic cells.

Yet, it's DNA is circular, remarkably similar to prokaryotic DNA.

I have a few problems with what evolutionists say about mitochondria. First of all it has a different DNA code from the rest of living things - including prokaryotes and plants. Prokaryotes and plants had to have come first so calling them 'most ancient' is false. Yet, they clearly because of the different DNA code could not have descended from either. My view is that there is a very specific reason for the different DNA code and for the way it works. The work of the mytochondria is essential to animal life, it provides all the energy for life. The process by which it does it is extremely involved and may have required the specific code it has.

566 posted on 10/09/2003 9:26:06 PM PDT by gore3000 ("To say dogs, mice, and humans are all products of slime plus time is a mystery religion.")
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To: gore3000
You all are behaving like a bunch of thugs and savages, not like conservatives who believe in free speech, free discussion and a FreeRepublic.

Of course, this is no big surprise to some of us. :)

I'm still waiting for A2K's coming out party.

567 posted on 10/09/2003 9:26:07 PM PDT by Michael_Michaelangelo
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To: js1138
Thank you so much for your reply! Indeed, I figured you were expecting me to add my twist to the list. LOL!

The approximation of 6000 years was based on human genealogy. The approximation of 4 billion+ years assumes a span of time prior to humans. Merely shifting time perspectives doesn't erase this difference, unless you wish to express one of your time dimensions as a hyperbolic function. But that would be engaging in hyperbole.

Actually, you have hit the proverbial nail on the head. The genealogy of ensouled man banished to mortality (earth) begins with Adam in Genesis 4. That is the source of the 6000 year approximation. It's the interpretation of the previous three chapters of Genesis that remains in dispute.

And yes, space/time is relative. Here's a great link with animation for Lurkers interested in getting the feel of it:

The Space/Time Wheel


568 posted on 10/09/2003 9:27:18 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: AndrewC
I have checked throughout this forum from the date of your joining it ...

Retentive tonight on the old camp ground.

569 posted on 10/09/2003 9:33:16 PM PDT by js1138
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To: Alamo-Girl
Thank you AlamoGirl, I will take a look at the links.

570 posted on 10/09/2003 9:47:55 PM PDT by Ogmios (Who is John Galt?)
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To: Ogmios
Great! I look forward to your comments!
571 posted on 10/09/2003 9:49:46 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: PurVirgo
A newbie to this forum, yes, but forums in general, no, I have been on forums, or BBS's since before there was an internet, and usenet, which could get pretty crazy at times, this forum is tame compared to that, then again, it's a freeforall. I don't Usenet much anymore.

Yes, it can be irritating, frustrating, and downright froghtening sometimes, but again, it's only a forum.
572 posted on 10/09/2003 9:49:51 PM PDT by Ogmios (Who is John Galt?)
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To: js1138
Retentive tonight on the old camp ground.

I research claims. He made a claim. I called him on it. "Holy Warriors" was his epithet on this thread. Now there has been a thread pulled, so he can reasonably claim that it was on that thread, but he does so at the risk of someone having a copy of the thread which might prove to belie such a claim. I do not know, but I find it odd that no one has asked him about his religion on the extant threads.

573 posted on 10/09/2003 9:50:44 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: AndrewC
Look for Jesseshuron, I think was his nick, and you will find it, not sure how to find that post or I would link it for you. He asked me all kinds of questions, as did Dittojed2, and goodseedhomeschool I think it was.

I am sure that you are much more familiar with this forum software then I am.

And yes, and I explained why in that post as well.
574 posted on 10/09/2003 9:52:16 PM PDT by Ogmios (Who is John Galt?)
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To: gore3000
As you said, it is very specific to each gene...

No, restriction enzymes are specific, but not gene specific - only code specific

For example: A-T-G-G-*-*-* Binds With: C-T-C-*-*-*

C-C-G-A-G -*-*-*

It doesn't matter what gene, or even what organism - just that base pairing rules are followed.

But that example doesn't refute evolution, not to me, anyways.

What refutes evolution, in my book, is the lack of "randomness" that purists embrace.

I have a few problems with what evolutionists say about mitochondria. First of all it has a different DNA code from the rest of living things

Every organism's DNA is unique, not just mitochondrial DNA. I never said it was most ancient, though. Just that it bears striking resemblance to bacteria. Could it not, over time, have evolved to it's very specific purpose of providing the life energy of ATP?

Here's another example of similarity - the Heme group in Hemoglobin (which binds Oxygen), and the structure, is uncannily similar to porphyrin rings that exist in plants - the "light capturing" unit that lends itself to photosynthesis.

The point of this is, we, as humankind, simply do not know. Nor will we ever (I don't think). But it is fascinating to develop ideas of our origins, based on similarities between us (man) and our environment.

To speculate is not to deny our Divine origins (as many evo-purists believe). To me, it promotes solidarity and comfort in the thought that we (all life) are God's creation, each to be treasured and admired in both similarities and differences.

575 posted on 10/09/2003 9:53:51 PM PDT by PurVirgo (What would you do if FR was no more?? Please support FR!!!)
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To: Michael_Michaelangelo
Well, you'll be waiting an awfully long time.
576 posted on 10/09/2003 9:54:10 PM PDT by Ogmios (Who is John Galt?)
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To: Ogmios
oh, I remember those!!! hehe, I was only 10 or so when my uncle taught me how to use a BBS!!

I'm reminiscing now - old games (MUDs), FTP before it was FTP.

haha - 12 years later, nothing's changed, only the size and scope. Oh yeah, and being able to talk on the phone at the same time.

I used to do the alt-dot newsgroups, too!!

577 posted on 10/09/2003 9:58:00 PM PDT by PurVirgo (What would you do if FR was no more?? Please support FR!!!)
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To: AndrewC
The thread has not been pulled, I don't believe, I do not have time right now to learn how to find it. I will be more then happy to try it later, but my forum is probably almost recovered from it's latest crash and burn, so I need to get back to it.
578 posted on 10/09/2003 10:00:02 PM PDT by Ogmios (Who is John Galt?)
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To: Ogmios
That is exactly what I was warning Gore3000 about, his generalities are what kills his credibility. His absolutes are just unbelievable, his conviction to trying to destroy evolution is downright scary.

oj blood evidence science ... keep golfing - self scoring --- all your balls are hole in ones - aces !

579 posted on 10/09/2003 10:01:20 PM PDT by f.Christian (evolution vs intelligent design ... science3000 ... designeduniverse.com --- * architecture * !)
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To: gore3000
sorry bout the formatting - the gene sequence didn't come out how I planned - but the info is the same - code specific, not gene
580 posted on 10/09/2003 10:08:51 PM PDT by PurVirgo (What would you do if FR was no more?? Please support FR!!!)
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