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If Secession Was Illegal - then How Come...?
The Patriotist ^ | 2003 | Al Benson, Jr.

Posted on 06/12/2003 5:58:28 AM PDT by Aurelius

Over the years I've heard many rail at the South for seceding from the 'glorious Union.' They claim that Jeff Davis and all Southerners were really nothing but traitors - and some of these people were born and raised in the South and should know better, but don't, thanks to their government school 'education.'

Frank Conner, in his excellent book The South Under Siege 1830-2000 deals in some detail with the question of Davis' alleged 'treason.' In referring to the Northern leaders he noted: "They believed the most logical means of justifying the North's war would be to have the federal government convict Davis of treason against the United States. Such a conviction must presuppose that the Confederate States could not have seceded from the Union; so convicting Davis would validate the war and make it morally legitimate."

Although this was the way the federal government planned to proceed, that prolific South-hater, Thaddeus Stevens, couldn't keep his mouth shut and he let the cat out of the bag. Stevens said: "The Southerners should be treated as a conquered alien enemy...This can be done without violence to the established principles only on the theory that the Southern states were severed from the Union and were an independent government de facto and an alien enemy to be dealt with according to the laws of war...No reform can be effected in the Southern States if they have never left the Union..." And, although he did not plainly say it, what Stevens really desired was that the Christian culture of the Old South be 'reformed' into something more compatible with his beliefs. No matter how you look at it, the feds tried to have it both ways - they claimed the South was in rebellion and had never been out of the Union, but then it had to do certain things to 'get back' into the Union it had never been out of. Strange, is it not, that the 'history' books never seem to pick up on this?

At any rate, the Northern government prepared to try President Davis for treason while it had him in prison. Mr. Conner has observed that: "The War Department presented its evidence for a treason trial against Davis to a famed jurist, Francis Lieber, for his analysis. Lieber pronounced 'Davis will not be found guilty and we shall stand there completely beaten'." According to Mr. Conner, U.S. Attorney General James Speed appointed a renowned attorney, John J. Clifford, as his chief prosecutor. Clifford, after studying the government's evidence against Davis, withdrew from the case. He said he had 'grave doubts' about it. Not to be undone, Speed then appointed Richard Henry Dana, a prominent maritime lawyer, to the case. Mr. Dana also withdrew. He said basically, that as long as the North had won a military victory over the South, they should just be satisfied with that. In other words - "you won the war, boys, so don't push your luck beyond that."

Mr. Conner tells us that: "In 1866 President Johnson appointed a new U.S. attorney general, Henry Stanburg. But Stanburg wouldn't touch the case either. Thus had spoken the North's best and brightest jurists re the legitimacy of the War of Northern Aggression - even though the Jefferson Davis case offered blinding fame to the prosecutor who could prove that the South had seceded unconstitutionally." None of these bright lights from the North would touch this case with a ten-foot pole. It's not that they were dumb, in fact the reverse is true. These men knew a dead horse when they saw it and were not about to climb aboard and attempt to ride it across the treacherous stream of illegal secession. They knew better. In fact, a Northerner from New York, Charles O'Connor, became the legal counsel for Jeff Davis - without charge. That, plus the celebrity jurists from the North that refused to touch the case, told the federal government that they really had no case against Davis or secession and that Davis was merely being held as a political prisoner.

Author Richard Street, writing in The Civil War back in the 1950s said exactly the same thing. Referring to Jeff Davis, Street wrote: "He was imprisoned after the war, was never brought to trial. The North didn't dare give him a trial, knowing that a trial would establish that secession was not unconstitutional, that there had been no 'rebellion' and that the South had got a raw deal." At one point the government intimated that it would be willing to offer Davis a pardon, should he ask for one. Davis refused that and he demanded that the government either give him a pardon or give him a trial, or admit that they had dealt unjustly with him. Mr. Street said: "He died 'unpardoned' by a government that was leery of giving him a public hearing." If Davis was as guilty as they claimed, why no trial???

Had the federal government had any possible chance to convict Davis and therefore declare secession unconstitutional they would have done so in a New York minute. The fact that they diddled around and finally released him without benefit of the trial he wanted proves that the North had no real case against secession. Over 600,000 boys, both North and South, were killed or maimed so the North could fight a war of conquest over something that the South did that was neither illegal or wrong. Yet they claim the moral high ground because the 'freed' the slaves, a farce at best.


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KEYWORDS: dixielist; zzzzzzz
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To: SCDogPapa
Dude, are you double-clicking when you hit 'post?'
121 posted on 06/12/2003 12:35:56 PM PDT by 1rudeboy
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To: SCDogPapa
You're welcome. You're welcome. You're welcome.
122 posted on 06/12/2003 12:36:51 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: jlogajan
No they don't try to forget it. They stridently shriek in the face of ALL fact that it never even occurred to the idiots who started the war that there were even any slaves there.

Our D.S.s all say "Slaves? What slaves? That is all a Yankee myth. It was all about tariffs, state rights, making the Mint Julip the National Drink." Anything but the obvious.
123 posted on 06/12/2003 12:37:06 PM PDT by justshutupandtakeit (RATS will use any means to denigrate George Bush's Victory.)
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To: bk1000
While the Slaverocracy was every bit as Evil as advertised the North was not Noble. It was forced to fight the war against the wishes of the Northern DemocRATS. Those northerns were just as evil as the slavers.
124 posted on 06/12/2003 12:39:33 PM PDT by justshutupandtakeit (RATS will use any means to denigrate George Bush's Victory.)
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To: azhenfud
A state has no right to tell the US Army what it can and can't do. What bizarre interpretation of the Constitution gave you THAT idea.
125 posted on 06/12/2003 12:41:45 PM PDT by justshutupandtakeit (RATS will use any means to denigrate George Bush's Victory.)
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To: justshutupandtakeit; bk1000
I wouldn't go so far as to call the northern Democrats evil, but during the Civil War millions of them sided with the southern Democrats of the Confederacy. At the same time, the blacks and white Unionists of the South sided with the United States Government. As I explain in my book, the Civil War was nearly as much between the Republican Party and the Democratic Party as it was between North and South.
126 posted on 06/12/2003 12:44:54 PM PDT by Grand Old Partisan (You can read about my history of the GOP at www.republicanbasics.com)
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To: mdmathis6
You don't expect the desparate defenders of the Slaverocracy to accept those truths do you?

They won't since their hatred of the United States knows no bounds. Amazing irrationality and gullibility abounds with that bunch.

Every fact is disdained as a product of "government schools." Any lie is acceptable as long as it supports their neurosis. Every distortion of fact is fine.

No matter how many times the lies are exposed they are reposted as though nothing happened whenever this ridiculous subject is brought up again.
127 posted on 06/12/2003 12:46:28 PM PDT by justshutupandtakeit (RATS will use any means to denigrate George Bush's Victory.)
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To: Aurelius
Other than among the D.S.s it is difficult to find those fluent in Gibberish.

Since you posted it as worthy of our consideration I thought perhaps you might be able to explain where there was any truth or logic within it. Guess I was wrong.
128 posted on 06/12/2003 12:53:19 PM PDT by justshutupandtakeit (RATS will use any means to denigrate George Bush's Victory.)
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To: justshutupandtakeit
I would answer the question had it originated from a serious person. But I have encountered you before and know that you don't fit in that category.
129 posted on 06/12/2003 1:01:33 PM PDT by Aurelius
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To: Aurelius
Obviously you can't handle a serious person, particularly one who easily punctures the fanatasies you prefer to dwell upon.

I still await the pointing out of any point of truth within the original post.
130 posted on 06/12/2003 1:11:08 PM PDT by justshutupandtakeit (RATS will use any means to denigrate George Bush's Victory.)
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To: Grand Old Partisan
Had Jackson been president during the Civil War I would bet every penny I have or will have that Davis and others would have been hung.
131 posted on 06/12/2003 1:13:32 PM PDT by justshutupandtakeit (RATS will use any means to denigrate George Bush's Victory.)
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To: justshutupandtakeit
Damned right!
132 posted on 06/12/2003 1:20:45 PM PDT by Grand Old Partisan (You can read about my history of the GOP at www.republicanbasics.com)
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To: justshutupandtakeit
What part of "I'm not going to waste my time on you." can't you understand?
133 posted on 06/12/2003 1:21:07 PM PDT by Aurelius
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To: Aurelius
All of it. It is IMPOSSIBLE for YOU to waste your time on ME. Inhaling my flatulence would not be a waste of YOUR time.
134 posted on 06/12/2003 1:27:02 PM PDT by justshutupandtakeit (RATS will use any means to denigrate George Bush's Victory.)
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To: justshutupandtakeit
Thanks for helping to prove my point. I guess you are capable of some positive contribution, only not when you intend or what you intend.
135 posted on 06/12/2003 1:46:02 PM PDT by Aurelius
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To: Aurelius
Thanks for post-D##n YANKEES haven't a clue
136 posted on 06/12/2003 2:28:09 PM PDT by y2k_free_radical (i)
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To: y2k_free_radical
"D##n YANKEES haven't a clue"

You can say that again!

137 posted on 06/12/2003 2:30:40 PM PDT by Aurelius
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To: archy
AGREE-FORGET HELL-I'M SAVING MY DIXIE CUPS
138 posted on 06/12/2003 2:37:48 PM PDT by y2k_free_radical (i)
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To: jlogajan
If you took a laxative SIR,you would self destruct---the war was over STATES RIGHTS including the right to buy from EUROPE without paying the onerous duties imposed by the NORTHERN INDUSTIALISTS
139 posted on 06/12/2003 2:42:47 PM PDT by y2k_free_radical (i)
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To: bk1000
THE TRUTH
140 posted on 06/12/2003 2:44:31 PM PDT by y2k_free_radical (i)
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