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To: jmacusa
I call you a "Johnny Reb" because you obviously are a supporter of the Confederacy.

No, just someone recognize that there right to leave was morally superior to every other argument put forth against it.

I think slavery is immoral, and that it always was. It is contrary to Christian principles, and it should never have been allowed to take root in this nation.

My argument is that the right of people to leave the Union is not contingent upon them exhibiting the proper sort of morality, especially as perceived by modern eyes.

386 posted on 01/29/2016 9:59:36 AM PST by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
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To: DiogenesLamp
From the London Spectator, in its October 11, 1862 issue:

"The principle [of the Proclamation] is not that a human being cannot justly own another, but that he cannot own him unless he is loyal to the United States."

D@mned English socialists always pointing stuff out!

387 posted on 01/29/2016 10:25:48 AM PST by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
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To: DiogenesLamp

Yeah and America would have been a Balkanized nation of God knows what. Along with defending slavery it’s this that pisses the sh!t out of me about you Rebs. America is the greatest nation on Earth because it is a united country as in The United States of America! But that isn’t good enough for types like your and those of your ilk. The Civil War ended one hundred and fifty years ago and your side LOST! Academic debate about it’s causes/after affects in one thing but going on about secession is something else and it’s a pretty damn stupid idea as the Southerners of nearly two centuries ago found out.


389 posted on 01/29/2016 1:32:01 PM PST by jmacusa ("Dats all I can stands 'cuz I can't stands no more!''-- Popeye The Sailorman.)
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To: DiogenesLamp; jmacusa
DiogenesLamp: "My argument is that the right of people to leave the Union is not contingent upon them exhibiting the proper sort of morality, especially as perceived by modern eyes."

But the "right to leave" was restricted by our Founders' intentions in forming the new Constitution.
They intended that it should be by "mutual consent" or from some "usurpation" or "oppression" having that same effect.

Since those conditions did not exist in late 1860, Deep South Fire-Eaters declared secession "at pleasure", which our Founders did not consider lawful.

Regardless, it was not some legal debate which started Civil War, it was the Confederate military assault on Union troops in Fort Sumter that started Civil War.

396 posted on 01/29/2016 4:35:18 PM PST by BroJoeK (a little historical perspective...)
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