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To: jennyp

Beyond the 'hook' of creationism in the title...and the falacy of comparing millions of intelligences competing to non-intelligence evolving...(and a certain order arising from both), Hudgin's main point is that atheists are able to be just as "moral" as believers.

In certain individual cases...externally, surely he's right. However, in the big picture, you really don't find many atheist doctors slaving away in mission hospitals in the developing world. I've never heard of an atheist (or even agnostic) Mother Theresa type character. In history, show me a truly great atheist leader.

Christian belief is certainly no guarantee of good and loving character...but look at the most sacrificially loving people in the world--and by golly there's very (very) few atheists.

Europe probably has the highest concentration of atheists in the world...and their voluntary contributions in charitable causes both within their countries and without are significantly less than places with more believers. Atheism really does seem to breed socialism and apathy...(and vica versa) and Objectivists (atheists devoted to free markets) are truly rare.

The Mother of Objectivism herself, Ayn Rand, did not exibit a morally upright lifestyle...those morals arising simply from human nature always tend to corrupt and run downhill--and good minds (like Hudgins) are easily able to rationalize away selfishness and avarice--or all kinds of evil, especially (unlike Objectivists) if they have a utopian vision. Show me someone who is convinced they are ultimately under no other authority than themselves...and I'll show you someone with serious flaws in character...every time.


347 posted on 01/26/2006 6:19:10 PM PST by AnalogReigns
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To: AnalogReigns
The Mother of Objectivism herself, Ayn Rand, did not exibit a morally upright lifestyle...those morals arising simply from human nature always tend to corrupt and run downhill--and good minds (like Hudgins) are easily able to rationalize away selfishness and avarice--or all kinds of evil, especially (unlike Objectivists) if they have a utopian vision. Show me someone who is convinced they are ultimately under no other authority than themselves...and I'll show you someone with serious flaws in character...every time.

Morality and all of those associated ideals are rooted entirely in the presupposition some higher power defines what is correct for human behavior.

Examine my statement for logic (categorical or propositional). It will test true as a syllogism or true if tested in a Venn diagram using Aristotle's logic.

Objectivists don't know how to use logic.

360 posted on 01/26/2006 6:32:54 PM PST by Sir Francis Dashwood (LET'S ROLL!)
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To: AnalogReigns
Is dissatisfaction with inevitable mortality driving ersatz secularists to seek connection with something eternal, through a Universal Truth, by constructing an idol out of their own vanity or conceit they label as morality?

Is this a self-deceptive replacement of avoiding sin with a synthetic secular morality?

Is the paganist "Big Bang" theory admission the Universe is an Immaculate Conception?

The entire foundation of evolutionary theory rests upon the so-called "Big Bang," where DNA is the biological singularity - - is this just another fanciful idolatry or Immaculate Conception?

Most Objectivists I have met are surly, arrogant, pathetic anti-Christians who really have a lot of neo-pagan, phantasmagoric fetishisms. When you call them on it, they lose their cookies.
370 posted on 01/26/2006 6:43:10 PM PST by Sir Francis Dashwood (LET'S ROLL!)
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To: AnalogReigns
The Mother of Objectivism herself, Ayn Rand, did not exibit a morally upright lifestyle...those morals arising simply from human nature always tend to corrupt and run downhill--and good minds (like Hudgins) are easily able to rationalize away selfishness and avarice--or all kinds of evil, especially (unlike Objectivists) if they have a utopian vision. Show me someone who is convinced they are ultimately under no other authority than themselves...and I'll show you someone with serious flaws in character...every time.

I'm curious. What kind of evil does Ed Hudgins rationalize, since you know him?

567 posted on 01/27/2006 12:25:25 AM PST by jennyp (WHAT I'M READING NOW: your mind)
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