Posted on 05/12/2015 4:21:27 PM PDT by RnMomof7
Let us begin with a church history exam question. Cardinal Robert Bellarmine (1542–1621) was a figure not to be taken lightly. He was Pope Clement VIII’s personal theologian and one of the most able figures in the Counter-Reformation movement within sixteenth-century Roman Catholicism. On one occasion, he wrote: “The greatest of all Protestant heresies is _______ .” Complete, explain, and discuss Bellarmine’s statement.
How would you answer? What is the greatest of all Protestant heresies? Perhaps justification by faith? Perhaps Scripture alone, or one of the other Reformation watchwords?
Those answers make logical sense. But none of them completes Bellarmine’s sentence. What he wrote was: “The greatest of all Protestant heresies is assurance.”
A moment’s reflection explains why. If justification is not by faith alone, in Christ alone, by grace alone — if faith needs to be completed by works; if Christ’s work is somehow repeated; if grace is not free and sovereign, then something always needs to be done, to be “added” for final justification to be ours. That is exactly the problem. If final justification is dependent on something we have to complete it is not possible to enjoy assurance of salvation. For then, theologically, final justification is contingent and uncertain, and it is impossible for anyone (apart from special revelation, Rome conceded) to be sure of salvation. But if Christ has done everything, if justification is by grace, without contributory works; it is received by faith’s empty hands — then assurance, even “full assurance” is possible for every believer.
No wonder Bellarmine thought full, free, unfettered grace was dangerous! No wonder the Reformers loved the letter to the Hebrews!
This is why, as the author of Hebrews pauses for breath at the climax of his exposition of Christ’s work (Heb. 10:18), he continues his argument with a Paul-like “therefore” (Heb. 10:19). He then urges us to “draw near … in full assurance of faith” (Heb. 10:22). We do not need to re-read the whole letter to see the logical power of his “therefore.” Christ is our High Priest; our hearts have been sprinkled clean from an evil conscience just as our bodies have been washed with pure water (v.22).
Christ has once-for-all become the sacrifice for our sins, and has been raised and vindicated in the power of an indestructible life as our representative priest. By faith in Him, we are as righteous before the throne of God as He is righteous. For we are justified in His righteousness, His justification alone is ours! And we can no more lose this justification than He can fall from heaven. Thus our justification does not need to be completed any more than does Christ’s!
With this in view, the author says, “by one offering He has perfected for all time those who come to God by him” (Heb. 10:14). The reason we can stand before God in full assurance is because we now experience our “hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and … bodies washed with pure water” (Heb. 10:22).
“Ah,” retorted Cardinal Bellarmine’s Rome, “teach this and those who believe it will live in license and antinomianism.” But listen instead to the logic of Hebrews. Enjoying this assurance leads to four things: First, an unwavering faithfulness to our confession of faith in Jesus Christ alone as our hope (v.23); second, a careful consideration of how we can encourage each other to “love and good works” (v.24); third, an ongoing communion with other Christians in worship and every aspect of our fellowship (v.25a); fourth, a life in which we exhort one another to keep looking to Christ and to be faithful to him, as the time of his return draws ever nearer (25b).
It is the good tree that produces good fruit, not the other way round. We are not saved by works; we are saved for works. In fact we are God’s workmanship at work (Eph. 2:9–10)! Thus, rather than lead to a life of moral and spiritual indifference, the once-for-all work of Jesus Christ and the full-assurance faith it produces, provides believers with the most powerful impetus to live for God’s glory and pleasure. Furthermore, this full assurance is rooted in the fact that God Himself has done all this for us. He has revealed His heart to us in Christ. The Father does not require the death of Christ to persuade Him to love us. Christ died because the Father loves us (John 3:16). He does not lurk behind His Son with sinister intent wishing He could do us ill — were it not for the sacrifice his Son had made! No, a thousand times no! — the Father Himself loves us in the love of the Son and the love of the Spirit.
Those who enjoy such assurance do not go to the saints or to Mary. Those who look only to Jesus need look nowhere else. In Him we enjoy full assurance of salvation. The greatest of all heresies? If heresy, let me enjoy this most blessed of “heresies”! For it is God’s own truth and grace!
Flattery will get you no where.
**OK, then dig this: I’m retired now, but my coworkers in the Calvinist & Evangelical traditions said unto to me that if one is truly saved, then one stops sinning, especially those that are repetitive sins. God’s grace is that powerful, they maintained.**
I have never know a reformed Christian to say this, and I hang out in a Reformed circle. We always lament that the older we get the more we realize just how sinful we truly are!
Where is it that you think discussion of religious beliefs should be confined to?
I wish Catholic would realize once and for all what a revealing and sad comment that actually is. Anyone who has experienced the true indwelling of the Holy Spirit would be appalled at a notion of "free pass to commit post baptismal sin". I would strongly suggest that Catholics not use that line as it indicates a lack of experience with the indwelling influence of the Holy Spirit.
So Christ did it all but just in case He didn’t?
Actually, no - those who did all the things (cast out devils in Christ's name, etc.) were not saved... had no salvation.. but were doing all of these things and trying to say, "hey -- we did all these works, let us in!" If you hit rewind and go back to the beginning of that part of the chapter, it indicates that this was being said to the "goats" -- those unsaved at the judgment:
"The Final Judgment
“When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on his glorious throne. Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. And he will place the sheep on his right, but the goats on the left.
(Matthew 25:31-33 ESV)""
Kinda hoists the whole Roman Catholic Cult on its own petard of faith PLUS works bilge.
Hoss
The same here. But I do it out of sadness that I disappoint and do disservice to a God that has given me so much. It's my spirit side that has changed but the flesh side is still weak.
Matthew 26:41 "Keep watching and praying that you may not enter into temptation; the spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak."
If someone is saved and salvation alone is all that is necessary - they go to heaven
If someone is saved and does good works, and salvation alone is all that is necessary - they go to heaven
BUT
If someone is saved but doesn't do good works, and salvation alone isn't enough they risk going to hell.
...
I see no downside to doing good works in addition to being saved.
You can't argue that salvation alone is enough, but then say that doing good works after being saved could jeopardize your salvation. If no sins you commit after being saved can make you lose your salvation then how could doing good works jeopardize it? that makes no sense.
Who ever said that? No on that I have seen. The Catholic stance is that good works "merit" grace and salvation. True believers understand that good works are the "result" of salvation. Big difference. One gives all credit and glory to God the other gives credit to man.
Yes, it has only been refuted about 3.753 million times, but it keeps coming up. Someone didn't get the memo, and I suspect that quite possibly, never will. This will come up again.
Read Post #42 again. I think I made it as selfexplainitory as possible.
I personally do good works because I know that is what God wants me to do (independent of my salvation). I also do them because many times I benefit personally in this life in some way for doing them (the joy one gets from giving, the happier longer more fulfilled life one lives in this life when one follows Gods word, ect)
And in addition to d9ctrine (see above post) which group overall has most testified to real faith.?
And he will place the sheep on his right, but the goats on the left.
Jesus is not talking about driving out demons here, he is talking about literally giving some one who is hungry something to eat and giving some one who is thirsty a drink of water.
Kinda hoists the whole Roman Catholic Cult on its own petard of faith PLUS works bilge.>>>>>>>
Jesus is referring to us as individuals, no one will be able to hide behind any Church..
No one on this side of heaven ever stops sinning...Paul the apostle in Romans 7 addresses that situation...While we never stop sinning, we gain the desire to stop sinning...We don’t fear God...We know it hurts and grieves him when we sin
I take great comfort in Romans 7. I have often felt frustrated by the repetitiveness of my sins. Romans 7 helps me understand that by hating the sin that we do because it grieves God, we receive His love. But we can’t give up; this is what Satan wants us to do. To give up trying, to say what’s the use, I’m going to do it anyway. If we give in to this despair, it removes us from the hope, or firm assurance, of God’s love for us.
I personally do good works because I know that is what God wants me to do (independent of my salvation).
I have never know a reformed Christian to say this, and I hang out in a Reformed circle. We always lament that the older we get the more we realize just how sinful we truly are!
I agree GC, but it is not just age.. it is a gift of God to have a greater sensitivity to sin ...that I believe is the work of the Holy Spirit.. things the world would shrug it's shoulders to cut my heart .. I am reminded of a quote attributed to John Bunyan ... "There is enough sin in my best prayer to send the whole world to Hell." ~
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.