Posted on 04/07/2015 11:37:31 AM PDT by RnMomof7
Thank you for your kind words and attitude. I appreciate them.
You are correct that we should test beliefs, and if they are found wanting, reject them. The same is true if we find a minister of the Church in some sort of error (with charity).
When people make the claim the Church strayed from Scripture, it often may indicate the claimant disagrees with the interpretation given by the Church, for example, John 6 and the teaching of the Real Presence.
Others make the claim of Sola Scriptura, which in itself is non-Biblical, and features circular logic.
I agree with you, that as believers in Christ, it is our duty to bring as many souls to Christ as possible, by our example, and our teaching. It starts with love. When non-Christians see Christians serving not only each other, but non-Christians as well, they will recognize we walk the talk.
Should a jihadist convert to belief in Jesus Christ because he heard a Pentecostal preacher, good for both of them!
At its core, religious disagreement expresses our inability to truly understand the infinite, omnipotent, and omnipresence of the Divine Creator.
May His peace fill your days, and His Divine Mercy your life.
are you sure that it was a Catholic who brought up this asinine subject......oh wait a minute....she used to be one
it figures
Revolutionary...."reformers" reform from within...revolutionaries set up their own erroneous concepts of what they consider the truth.....nonsense.
to head her household, to provide for them, (no democrat ebt cards then), for protection, for respect from others....Joseph was, as far as I know , MUCH older than Mary...perhaps he was beyond the age....perhaps, because she was probably 14-15, he was uncomfortable with the age difference....perhaps it is none of our business...
I'll buy that one!!
The Catholic church IS the fold...and only they determine what heresy is....not the fallen away churches of what's happening now.
I would love to be able to check your credibility as an authority on Catholic dogma....heresy, you say, ...wow, pretty serious a charge for a member of a PROTESTANT "denomination" which willingly left the true church of Christ (Catholicism)
another brilliant interpretation...gee, thanks!
it was a fallen away Catholic who made a bad decision who brought up the subject.
Well, thank you for that official Roman tripe. The "reformers" certainly reformed from within, within the actual gathering of Jesus. They brought the true 1st cent. gatherings back to the clear biblical truths of the good news of Jesus Christ and exposed much (but not all) of the demonic doctrines of Rome.
Joseph was, as far as I know , MUCH older than Mary...perhaps he was beyond the age....perhaps, because she was probably 14-15, he was uncomfortable with the age difference.
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Joseph was much older ??? You mean too old to provide for the family ??? too old to protect the house and family ??? too old to be an active father to Jesus ??? Abraham was 100 years old...God didn’t consider him to be too old..
didn’t Mary have respect before she married Joseph ??? was she or her family disrespectful that she needed the virtue of Joseph to hide or save her ???
beyond the age ??? age for what ?? again I give you Abraham..and does that mean Mary would have if Joseph was able ???
There was no law too stop an old man from marrying a young girl...again I give you Abraham..Joseph was not uncomfortable with the law or he would never have believed the angel and married Mary knowing that a great law giver, Isaiah was the one who said a virgin would give birth...Josaeph was quite comfortable with the law..his family for generations had followed the law of Moses...
God and His Word is my business...
Her kid was God...how much more fruitful would you like her to be???
I had NO idea that Father Martin Luther taught this late in history...oh well, see what happens when you make up your own rules...
Mrs. Lincoln....always be polite!
AMAZING....and after only 1,600 years of Catholicism did these wizards of truth spring forward to set the world straight...Holy Cow, how could we get along without them????..........easily.
Many of the Marian doctrines were not officially declared, though they had been universally held.
For example, Perpetual Virginity was defended, in at least in 383 AD (http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/3007.htm) a long, but interesting read.
From antiquity:
Irenaeus (c.130 – c.202) taught perpetual virginity, along with other Marian themes.[32] However, wider support for the doctrine began to appear within the next century.
By the 4th century, the doctrine of perpetual virginity had been well attested.[43] For example, references can be found in the 3rd century writings of Hippolytus of Rome, who called Mary “the tabernacle exempt from defilement and corruption,” [44] and the 4th century works of Athanasius,[45] Epiphanius,[46] Hilary,[47] Didymus,[48] Ambrose,[49] Jerome,[50] and Siricius[51] continued the attestations to perpetual virginity – a trend that gathered pace in the next century.[4][5]
Then at the Reformation:
Martin Luther believed that Mary did not have other children and did not have any marital relations with Joseph. The Latin text of the 1537 Smalcald Articles, written by Martin Luther, used the term “Ever Virgin” to refer to Mary.[69] The perpetual virginity of Mary was Luther’s lifelong belief, even after he rejected other Marian doctrines.[69][72][73]
Huldrych Zwingli directly supported perpetual virginity and wrote: “I firmly believe that [Mary], ... forever remained a pure, intact Virgin.”[74] Like Zwingli, the English reformers also supported the concept of perpetual virginity, but often varied on their reasons for the support.[70] Luther and Zwingli’s support of perpetual virginity was endorsed by Heinrich Bullinger and was included in the 1566 Second Helvetic Confession.[75]
The Anglican reformers of the 16th and 17th century supported perpetual virginity “on the basis of ancient Christian authority”.[69] In the 18th century, John Wesley, one of the founders of Methodism, also supported the doctrine and wrote that: “... born of the blessed Virgin Mary, who, as well after as before she brought Him forth, continued a pure and unspotted virgin.”[69][78][79]
Regarding the Immaculate Conception of Mary: Although the belief that Mary was sinless and conceived immaculate has been widely held since Late Antiquity, the doctrine was not dogmatically defined until 1854, by Pope Pius IX in his papal bull Ineffabilis Deus.
Finally, the Assumption of Mary was declared in 1950: Although the Assumption (Latin: assumptio, “a taking”) was only relatively recently defined as infallible dogma by the Catholic Church, and in spite of a statement by Saint Epiphanius of Salamis in AD 377 that no one knew whether Mary had died or not,[7] apocryphal accounts of the assumption of Mary into heaven have circulated since at least the 4th century. The Catholic Church itself interprets chapter 12 of the Book of Revelation as referring to it.[8] The earliest known narrative is the so-called Liber Requiei Mariae (The Book of Mary’s Repose), which survives intact only in an Ethiopic translation.[9][10][11] Probably composed by the 4th century, this Christian apocryphal narrative may be as early as the 3rd century. Also quite early are the very different traditions of the “Six Books” Dormition narratives.[12] The earliest versions of this apocryphon are preserved by several Syriac manuscripts of the 5th and 6th centuries, although the text itself probably belongs to the 4th century.[13][14][15]
So, Marian doctrines go way, way back.
It is not.
Pay real close attention now..............the discussion was on SEX....maybe.....just maybe......a slight chance that......without viagra.....well, you know the rest......(I Think)!!
Your interpretation is based upon a modern understanding, and not the period artistic devices.
The paintings you refer to were intended to demonstrate the majesty and divinity of the child Jesus. An infant conveys the sense of innocence. It also conveys the true, human nature of Jesus. Think Lamb of God, innocent like a lamb, that sort of thing.
As to the crucifixes, there were times when people didn’t believe Jesus actually suffered and died on the cross as a man. The depictions were meant to be graphic, as to also convey the greatness of His sacrifice.
it figures
LOL, TC, there you go again. We all know the only true church in the whole world, is the First United Colorado Springs Church of the Navigators, established sometime in the distant past. 😎😃😂😇🙈🙉🙊 Els, what was that little story you told, like "Mary, are you asleep? 😜😝😱
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