Defending The Pre-trib Rapture

Rapture Ready ^ | 28 Feb 15 | Todd Strandberg

[SkyPilot]

You do realize that Paul was telling the Thessalonians (who were falsely teaching that Christ had already returned) were wrong, and that is why he said in 2 Thessalonians 2

"1 Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to him, we ask you, brothers, 2 not to be quickly shaken in mind or alarmed, either by a spirit or a spoken word, or a letter seeming to be from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has come. 3 Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, 4 who opposes and exalts himself against every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God. 5 Do you not remember that when I was still with you I told you these things? 6 And you know what is restraining him now so that he may be revealed in his time. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work. Only he who now restrains it will do so until he is out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is by the activity of Satan with all power and false signs and wonders, 10 and with all wicked deception for those who are perishing, because they refused to love the truth and so be saved. 11 Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false, 12 in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

[Marcella]

“Great book!”

It’s a 2004 “Revised and Expanded Edition” of “Before God’s Wrath”. Do you believe in miracles? I ordered this book Thursday and it arrived the next day, Friday, yesterday. Bought it on line Thursday, got it Friday. Must have been a miracle. :o)

[editor-surveyor]

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The main point is that there is no point.

There isn’t a shred of evidence to back up the things that the author claims others say or believe.

The entire article argues a succession of absurd strawmen.
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[SkyPilot]

Plus the trumpet will be sounded by the angels in one event, and God in the other. Two separate trumps.

Exactly.

Another point the author did not mention is this:

Christ fulfilled 4 of the ancient Jewish feasts given by God. The other feasts will, I believe, be fulfilled.

1) Passover (Leviticus 23:5) – Pointed to the Messiah as our Passover lamb (1 Corinthians 5:7) whose blood would be shed for our sins. Jesus was crucified on the day of preparation for the Passover at the same hour that the lambs were being slaughtered for the Passover meal that evening (John 19:14).

2) Unleavened Bread (Leviticus 23:6) – Pointed to the Messiah's sinless life (as leaven is a picture of sin in the Bible), making Him the perfect sacrifice for our sins. Jesus' body was in the grave during the first days of this feast, like a kernel of wheat planted and waiting to burst forth as the bread of life.

3) First Fruits (Leviticus 23:10) – Pointed to the Messiah's resurrection as the first fruits of the righteous. Jesus was resurrected on this very day, which is one of the reasons that Paul refers to him in 1 Corinthians 15:20 as the "first fruits from the dead."

4) Weeks or Pentecost (Leviticus 23:16) – Occurred fifty days after the beginning of the Feast of Unleavened Bread and pointed to the great harvest of souls and the gift of the Holy Spirit for both Jew and Gentile, who would be brought into the kingdom of God during the Church Age (see Acts 2). The Church was actually established on this day when God poured out His Holy Spirit and 3,000 Jews responded to Peter's great sermon and his first proclamation of the gospel.

5) Trumpets (Leviticus 23:24) – The first of the fall feasts. Many believe this day points to the Rapture of the Church when the Messiah Jesus will appear in the heavens as He comes for His bride, the Church. The Rapture is always associated in Scripture with the blowing of a loud trumpet (1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 and 1 Corinthians 15:52).

6) Day of Atonement (Leviticus 23:27) – Many believe this prophetically points to the day of the Second Coming of Jesus when He will return to earth. That will be the Day of Atonement for the Jewish remnant when they "look upon Him whom they have pierced," repent of their sins, and receive Him as their Messiah (Zechariah 12:10 and Romans 11:1-6, 25-36).

7) Tabernacles or Booths (Leviticus 23:34) – Many scholars believe that this feast day points to the Lord's promise that He will once again “tabernacle” with His people when He returns to reign over all the world (Micah 4:1-7).

[SkyPilot]

Pinging you on this thread.

[dartuser]

There aren't a whole lot of pre-trib rapturists who see the rapture in Matt 24 ... the man has constructed the usual strawman.

Consult www.pre-trib.org if you want scholarly articles and studies defending the doctrine.

[editor-surveyor]

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Its right there in the scripture you just posted:

>> “For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction” <<

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Once you read that declaration, you have to make Paul a liar to believe that a rapture came before what he said had to first come.

[winodog]

http://newjerusalemcommunity.blogspot.com/2011/05/jewish-wedding-customs.html

At the end of the period of separation, the bridegroom came - usually (at night) to take his bride to live with him. We see this parallel in Thessalonians 5:2 ; 2 Peter 3:10. The groom, the best man, and other male escorts went to meet the bridegroom with lite torches and left the father’s house and conducted a torch-light procession to the home of the bride. Jesus uses this same parallel in Matthew 25:1 “Then the kingdom of heaven shall be likened to ten virgins who took their lamps and went out to meet the bridegroom.

Although the bride was expecting her groom to come for her, she did not know the time of his coming. As a result, the groom’s arrival was preceded by a shout, which announced his departure to be gathered with him. Those on the street, ...knowing that a groom was coming to claim his bride, would begin to shout out ‘Behold the bridegroom comes! Behold the bridegroom comes !’. We see in scripture references to both the shouting and the shofar blast taking place as Christ the bridegroom comes for his bride.
(1 Thessalonians 4:1617)

[winodog]

http://www.opendoorministrieswv.org/ancientjewishwedding.html

http://focusonjerusalem.com/jewishwedtrad2.html

[editor-surveyor]

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>> “Funny this thread was put up while I’m reading this book. I was Pretrib most of my life but I think that is incorrect and believe the Bible supports Prewrath.” <<

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You are correct.

Matthew 24 lays it out, as does the Revelation, and Paul’s epistles to the Corinthians and the Thessalonians.

The man of sin comes first, then Satan’s tribulation of the saints, then the first resurrection, then the bowls of the wrath of God.

There just isn’t a stitch of squirm room for the pre-trib rapture.
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[SkyPilot]

Did you even read the article posted?

I'll re-paste it here for you:

The Restrainer In 2 Thessalonians the Apostle Paul speaks of a "he" that will restrain the advent of the Antichrist. The restrainer's removal is required before the Antichrist can be revealed.

2 Thessalonians 2:6-8, "And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming."

A debate has erupted over the identity of the Restrainer because if this "he" is the Holy Ghost, the only real explanation for his removal would be the rapture of the Church, which is indwelled by him. The strongest argument offered against the Holy Spirit being the Restrainer is the belief that if God's Spirit was ever removed from the earth, no one could then be saved. The removal of the Holy Ghost does not have to be an all or nothing proposition. I believe his being "taken out of the way" will only be a degree of removal.

Before the Church Age, people were able to find salvation, which obviously meant the Holy Spirit was at work on earth. When the outpouring of the Holy Ghost occurred at Pentecost, we didn't have a second Holy Spirit come to earth. His removal at the rapture will only be a reversal or ending of the Pentecostal outpouring.

[editor-surveyor]

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You should have finished the parable of the virgins!

It demolishes the pre-trib foolishness.

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[Marcella]

“It’s more like it’s an idea that was interesting for a while, and then everyone smartened up and dropped it ... :-) ...”

If you are referring to “Before God’s Wrath”, perhaps you don’t care to study anymore to rightly divide the word of truth as your mind is made up.
“2 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.”

I posted about this book in case there was someone on the thread who might want to read about a prewrath rapture, comparing that timing with pretrib and posttrib, according to Bible scripture. I didn’t come here to argue - just provide information and I have done that.

[SkyPilot]

You should have finished the parable of the virgins! It demolishes the pre-trib foolishness.

Really? How?

Perhaps you are one of the virgins who are not looking for His imminent return, and therefore without oil.

[winodog]

There are more then one “first resurrections”
First one was when Christ took Paradise to Heaven. (first fruits)
Next one is at the rapture. (main harvest)
Last one is those killed during the trib (gleanings and corners)

Second resurrection is after the 1,000 year reign of Christ on earth.

[winodog]

What does it have to do with the rapture?

Jesus used parables to “point fingers” at and denigrate the Pharisees and Sadducees. Even the Apostles had no idea what they meant

[Iscool]

1Co_10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

Mat_24:19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!

Going to be some tough choices during the Tribulation...You either take the mark of the beast and go to hell or refuse the mark of the beast and starve while you watch your kids starve...No medicine...No medical care...No job...No housing...No manna...

There will be no way to escape the temptation of taking the mark of the beast except for death...

All Christians, if they are to go into the Great Tribulation will go to hell by taking the mark of the beast or they will die...

I don't believe any Christians will go into the tribulation...

[CynicalBear]

>>Its right there in the scripture you just posted:<<

No it isn't.

2 Thessalonians 2:1 Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers and sisters, 2 not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by the teaching allegedly from us--whether by a prophecy or by word of mouth or by letter--asserting that the day of the Lord has already come.

The day of the Lord throughout scripture is talking about the tribulation period culminating in the battle of Armageddon. Paul knew they would think with the problems the Jews were going through that the "day of the Lord" was present and that they had missed the rapture. He goes on in verse three telling them that the rapture will happen before the "man of lawlessness is revealed".

Rather than be afraid the tribulation had already started they should know that it cannot start until the "departure" comes. Then the "man of lawlessness" will be revealed.

2 Thessalonians2:3 Don't let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the departure occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction.

So he was telling them not to worry that the day of the Lord (the tribulation period) had already begun because the "catching up" or "departure" or "rapture" had to happen before that could happen.

[Star Traveler]

People who are interested would be better served by Dr. Thomas Ice’s Pre-Trib Research Center with their studies and research of almost 25 years of meetings, involving many well-known pastors in the Christian community.

Pre-Trib Research Center
http://www.pre-trib.org

Someone else referenced it for you earlier. They have a lot of the research papers that have been presented in the past, on that site. Dr. Thomas Ice is considered one of the foremost and experienced authorities in this field. I would agree with that assessment.

ANYONE would be well-served with that site and the information there. Then one can “take off” from that point and followup on all those other researchers/pastors there and their own work.

[Star Traveler]

You said, “I don’t believe any Christians will go into the tribulation... “

— — —

TRUE! Any Christians before the Tribulaion ... will be gone at the start of the Tribulation.

BUT THEN ... there will be people who are saved during the Tribulation and they will have to contend with these things.

HOWEVER, there will be those who will not take the mark and will still be alive during the Tribulation, because Jesus talks about those who are there when he returns and they go into His Kingdom. That means they didn’t take the mark and they stayed alive all through the Tribulation. In other words not all who do not take the mark will be killed.