Posted on 12/14/2014 11:57:21 AM PST by ealgeone
The reason for this article is to determine if the worship/veneration given to Mary by the catholic church is justified from a Biblical perspective. This will be evaluated using the Biblical standard and not man’s standard.
Those on earth who have been born again have had their sins erased and are new creatures in Christ.
They are not called *sinners* anymore by God, and none ever claimed to be angels, but rather we are *saints* in the true Biblical sense of the word.
If both are alive in Christ (the spiritual body of Christ), then intercessory prayers of those alive in Christ in Heaven are efficacious. So, thanks for making my point for me.
Maybe the intercessory prayers of those in heaven are effective. So what? It still doesn't mean we are to pray to them for anything.
He said, venerate other saints as well, for they also hear the Word and keep It.
just asking...how does Lazarus fit into that theory??
FRoman Catholics calling non-Catholics *heretics* and calling for a return to the Inquisition, makes all FRoman Catholic FReepers look bad.
That the Holy Ghost leads us does not negate the fact that to us, Mary is the God-giver and all the saints are whom we should imitate if we ourselves want to be saved.
bttt
Obeying God’s command to give us the Savior (Luke 1:38).
“of course you wouldn’t believe it.”
If God’s Scripture taught it, I’d believe it. It doesn’t. Totally bogus, pagan teaching to make Mary into a demigod.
“http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Pius09/p9ineff.htm";
If it was taught in Scripture, it wouldn’t take a couple thousand words to try to justify it.
That papal encyclical and about $3.00 will get you a strong cup of Starbucks coffee.
“Mary is the God-giver “
Another name God never uses of Mary.
Mary did not give us God. She was chosen by God to bear Messiah. That is all. It is enough. We don’t need to make her into a demigod.
Check your church laws that were established at Trent.
http://history.hanover.edu/texts/trent/ct06.html
Canon 9. If anyone says that the sinner is justified by faith alone, meaning that nothing else is required to cooperate in order to obtain the grace of justification, and that it is not in any way necessary that he be prepared and disposed by the action of his own will, let him be anathema.
Canon 19. If anyone says that nothing besides faith is commanded in the Gospel, that other things are indifferent, neither commanded nor forbidden, but free; or that the ten commandments in no way pertain to Christians, let him be anathema.
Canon 24. If anyone says that the justice received is not preserved and also not increased before God through good works, but that those works are merely the fruits and signs of justification obtained, but not the cause of its increase, let him be anathema.
Canon 27. If anyone says that there is no mortal sin except that of unbelief, or that grace once received is not lost through any other sin however grievous and enormous except by that of unbelief, let him be anathema.
try this one....there is none, nor does the Catholic church teach that she is alive in the human sense...it does however teach that she was assumed, bodily, into Heaven...she may have died on Earth or not, doesn't really make any difference...But since she was free from original sin, she probably didn't!
There is no direct verse for that, but that is the teaching of the Holy Church. It is not dogmatic, just an opinion prevalent in Catholicism We realize that perhaps, in some exceptional circumstance one is saved without forming a strong relationship with Mary prior to coming to Christ.
If you meant to imply that since there is no verse like that in the Scripture, then it is not so, remember that the Holy Scripture is not the complete Rule of Faith. There are things the Holy Church receives from God even in our days and teaches. That is because the church, not the Scripture is the complete rule of faith. If you are of a different opinion, tell me where the Holy Scripture teaches that it is the complete rule of faith.
I will be happy to answer your questions further. I am sorry if other Catholics neglected to respond.
The full paragraph that you quote from does not place Mary above God, but asks for her help with her son, Jesus. She is at the summit next to her son in Heaven, not as a God, but as a humble servant who has pleased God. This to encourage Catholics to pray the Rosary which includes the Our Father, the Hail Mary and the Glory Be. The Rosary is about the mysteries of Jesus life and our salvation. The Ave Maria acknowledges Mary's devotion to Christ and asks for her prayers now and when we die.
The Encyclical documents how Catholics have sought out Mary as the Mother of Jesus through prayer to help defend the faith. In no way has the Church defined Mary other than a obedient servant following the will of God. Catholics can adore and pray to God, as well as venerate Mary and the saints that have led a Christian life and are now with God in Heaven.
“We constantly seek for help from Heaven — the sole means of effecting anything — that our labors and our care may obtain their wished for object. We deem that there could be no surer and more efficacious means to this end than by religion and piety to obtain the favor of the great Virgin Mary, the Mother of God, the guardian of our peace and the minister to us of heavenly grace, who is placed on the highest summit of power and glory in Heaven, in order that she may bestow the help of her patronage on men who through so many labors and dangers are striving to reach that eternal city. Now that the anniversary, therefore, of manifold and exceedingly great favors obtained by a Christian people through the devotion of the Rosary is at hand, We desire that that same devotion should be offered by the whole Catholic world with the greatest earnestness to the Blessed Virgin, that by her intercession her Divine Son may be appeased and softened in the evils which afflict us.
2. It has always been the habit of Catholics in danger and in troublous times to fly for refuge to Mary, and to seek for peace in her maternal goodness; showing that the Catholic Church has always, and with justice, put all her hope and trust in the Mother of God. And truly the Immaculate Virgin, chosen to be the Mother of God and thereby associated with Him in the work of man's salvation, has a favor and power with her Son greater than any human or angelic creature has ever obtained, or ever can gain. And, as it is her greatest pleasure to grant her help and comfort to those who seek her, it cannot be doubted that she would deign, and even be anxious, to receive the aspirations of the universal Church.
http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Leo13/l13supre.htm
You are absolutely wrong on all of your statements and you have failed to document any lies or false statements by the Catholic Church, and I believe they are completely false. May God have Mercy on you and guide you to his Truth.
If you knew the English language you would not confuse worship with veneration.
I don't, I was just pointing out that Mary could certainly have been protected from sin as was the FULLY HUMAN, CHRIST. That's all...
Mary kept Him in her womb and followed Him to the Cross. That IS hearing and keeping, both in physical and spiritual sense; hence the correction in Christ’s words.
>>He said, venerate other saints as well, for they also hear the Word and keep It<<
Where did Christ say that?
Making stuff up again.
Fine. You start.
Since you seem to think that you have a corner on the truth market.
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