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The Spiritual Significance of a Traditional Church Wedding
The Atlantic ^ | 7/25/14 | Emma Green

Posted on 07/29/2014 6:22:34 AM PDT by marshmallow

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To: defconw
This is not a really good analogy. There's nothing particularly holy, let alone sacramental, about cake, or any danger in eating it. And a Nuptial Mass is not merely a "celebration" but an affirmation of the holiness of God and the gift of the Blessed Sacrament.

I suppose if you had a branch of the family that was allergic to chocolate or diabetic and couldn't eat cake, that might be more to the point. Because taking Communion when you are not in a state of grace, or when you do not believe in the Real Presence, is actually dangerous to the soul.

Most priests will explain that to the congregation. My daughter and her hubby are both Catholic, but since we were Episcopalian and converted, a ton of our friends and relatives are not Catholic. We also had in attendance everything from Conservative Jews to a Wiccan priestess, not to mention the unchurched.

Nobody was mortally offended at all. And everybody who wanted cake got it. :-)

21 posted on 07/29/2014 7:17:16 AM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ecce Crucem Domini, fugite partes adversae. Vicit Leo de Tribu Iuda, Radix David, Alleluia!)
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To: manc

No, she will miss the Catholic church


22 posted on 07/29/2014 7:17:56 AM PDT by yldstrk ( My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: AnAmericanMother
My husband was not Catholic and his family was not Catholic. My analogy that you don't like I got from a priest. So it's good enough for him, it's good enough for me. Now of course we can go through all teh Chuch Fathers, but sometimes simple is better when talking to non-Catholics. They get the point! No cake for you!

The Eucharist is a meal, it's a last supper a Sacrament, it is so initmate that it defies description. It says, you new husband, can not do this with me.

We had wedding ceremony not a Mass. My priest at the time preferred not to do Mass when both are not Catholic.

23 posted on 07/29/2014 7:36:47 AM PDT by defconw (Both parties have clearly lost their minds!)
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To: Salvation

that decision is up to me and her and so far no. We are happy


24 posted on 07/29/2014 7:41:50 AM PDT by manc (Marriage =1 man + 1 woman,when they say marriage equality then they should support polygamy)
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To: Salvation

maybe in your mind, but not hers and she knows what she is.


25 posted on 07/29/2014 7:42:21 AM PDT by manc (Marriage =1 man + 1 woman,when they say marriage equality then they should support polygamy)
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To: yldstrk

Maybe but so far she is happy after over 20 years of not being Catholic.


26 posted on 07/29/2014 7:42:52 AM PDT by manc (Marriage =1 man + 1 woman,when they say marriage equality then they should support polygamy)
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To: marshmallow
Of course, there's less zeal for the Faith among the masses of Catholics. However, I'd wager the real reason weddings are off is the cost. And I don't see that cost being pastorally well handled, though I'm not sure what the answer is.

Here on the east cost, a wedding at City Hall will probably cost a few hundred bucks. The celebration can be handled by going out to dinner with very close family and friends. Or a couple can announce they're going to Jamaica to marry and only very close friends and family will come and it will save the couple thousands and thousands of dollars.

What can't be done for professional couples is to announce they're getting married in six months at the church up the street and none of their office mates, drinking buddies, or non-immediate relatives are invited. That's social and career suicide. Having hot roast beef and a keg of beer at the local VFW is embarrassing and potentially harmful to their careers.

Couples - particularly those burdened with student loans - can't afford all that a church wedding brings with it. It's largely due to being a)local and b) announced six months in advance.

27 posted on 07/29/2014 7:45:13 AM PDT by old and tired
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To: defconw

Good for you , and my wife and I have been together for over 20 years, actually 22 years and we are just if not as happy as that first day.
We loved our wedding, and yes it was not Catholic, and if people have a problem with that then so be it. We are happy, our kids are happy , and that is all what counts in this family.


28 posted on 07/29/2014 7:46:37 AM PDT by manc (Marriage =1 man + 1 woman,when they say marriage equality then they should support polygamy)
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To: Salvation
For sacraments there is no charge.

Depends upon the parish. In Philadelphia, Catholic parishes charge between $500 and $1500 for weddings.

29 posted on 07/29/2014 7:48:17 AM PDT by old and tired
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To: yldstrk
That went through my head as well. But I had dated Catholic men. Then as you get older( I was), you start to think you are not going to get married. I was OK with that. I even explored if maybe I was supposed to be in religious life.

Out of the clear blue, I met my husband and it seemed right. He was the one I was supposed to be with. He was older than me and had never married either.

I took it to the Adoration Chapel, I spoke at length to a priest I explicitly trusted. Then I took the leap of faith. Seven years and we are good. I left it up to God that I was reading the situation the right way. I know many people get married for all kinds of reasons. I was older so I thought about it maybe more than young people do.

30 posted on 07/29/2014 7:54:23 AM PDT by defconw (Both parties have clearly lost their minds!)
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To: manc
Well I don't get into other people's faith traditions or what they believe. Which is to say, I don't judge them. Catholics I try to make sure they know what they are doing. They need to know what they are doing. It's a big deal, it affects more than just them. Pre-Cana is a must. The only thing I regret is That I can't do Pre-Cana education with the couples. My husband is not into it and I can't do it alone.
31 posted on 07/29/2014 7:59:06 AM PDT by defconw (Both parties have clearly lost their minds!)
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To: All
In 1970, there were roughly 426,000 Catholic weddings, accounting for 20 percent of all marriages in the United States that year. Beginning in 1970, however, Catholic marriages went into decades of steady decline, until the turn of the new century—when that decline started to become precipitous: Between 2000 and 2012, Church weddings dropped by 40 percent, according to new data from the Official Catholic Directory. Given other demographic trends in the denomination, this pattern is question-raising: As of 2012, there were an estimated 76.7 million Catholics in the United States, a number that has been growing for at least four decades....

....If there are so many American Catholics, why aren't they getting married?

There's a whole lot of assumptions crammed into that one word "if"....

"....studies of the 2004 results identified a new hardcore vote of roughly 16 percent of Catholics (nearly 10 million people) who attend church more than once a week and identify as ideologically “conservative”. George Bush targetted these people and increased his percentage of the conservative Catholic vote...."
-- from the thread America's conservative Catholics are on the warpath. Republicans should be courting them.
...let me once again share the four-pronged typology that a veteran priest here in Washington, D.C., gave me a few years ago. There are, he said, four kinds of Catholics in this country and, thus, four “Catholic votes” on almost any issue. Any news report that lumps these groups together isn’t worth very much.

* Ex-Catholics. Solid for the Democrats. Cultural conservatives have no chance.

* Cultural Catholics who may go to church a few times a year. This may be one of those all-important “undecided voters” depending on what’s happening with the economy, foreign policy, etc. Leans to Democrats.

* Sunday-morning American Catholics. This voter is a regular in the pew and may even play some leadership role in the parish. This is the Catholic voter that is really up for grabs, the true swing voter that the candidates are after.

* The “sweats the details” Roman Catholic who goes to confession. Is active in the full sacramental life of the parish and almost always backs the Vatican, when it comes to matters of faith and practice. This is a very small slice of the American Catholic pie.
-- From the thread Those consistently complex “Catholic voters”

Related threads:
Bare Minimum Catholicism
Those consistently complex “Catholic voters”
When It Comes to Church Membership Numbers, the Devil's in the Details
32 posted on 07/29/2014 8:05:57 AM PDT by Alex Murphy ("the defacto Leader of the FR Calvinist Protestant Brigades")
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To: old and tired

Even if you belong to the Parish? WOW! The Church was free, we paid the music director and the altar server, made a donation to the church for Father’s time and that was it.


33 posted on 07/29/2014 8:07:45 AM PDT by defconw (Both parties have clearly lost their minds!)
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To: Salvation
I would add that I'm sure if cost is a hardship for faithful people desiring a sacrament, most pastors would waive the fee. However, there is a cost in most Philadelphia parishes for weddings and funerals. And even faithful, practicing couples desire marriage at a parish other than their own will not have that fee waived come Hell or high water.

Here is the list of costs for a wedding at our Cathedral. It's a whopping $2500 offering. http://www.cathedralphila.org/sacraments/holy-matrimony

I knew a couple where the husband was given orders to ship out to Afghanistan and so they upped their wedding date by three months. Their church was booked for the new date and so they began looking for alternate places for their ceremony. Not one single pastor was willing to waive the fee. It left a bad taste.

34 posted on 07/29/2014 8:14:10 AM PDT by old and tired
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To: defconw

Yep. I do know that some pastors will waive the fee for faithful couples and faithful departed. Otherwise, nope. There’s a fee for weddings and funerals completely separate from the altar servers and musicians.


35 posted on 07/29/2014 8:15:48 AM PDT by old and tired
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To: TexasFreeper2009; marshmallow

That is a part of it. I know of one young couple who did not have a church wedding because they didn’t want to spend the money on a 30 minute ceremony. That and they preferred to be “married” outside the law, and the pastor wouldn’t do it without a valid marriage license.

Also, there is the fact that marriage doesn’t mean much to most these days. Between the rampant divorce culture, the “shacking up/Hooking up” culture, to the celebration of bastards, many are asking why spend the money and time on a church marriage when I can have all the fun and none of the cost?

Marriage in short, is becoming a luxury good in the classic sense. Many want it, all say it is nice, but it is viewed as a cost and not a benefit.


36 posted on 07/29/2014 8:24:56 AM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: cloudmountain
"finding meaning" means that people are making their own rules about life, religion and God." That doesn't lead to God's path.

Amen!

37 posted on 07/29/2014 8:56:20 AM PDT by Albion Wilde ("The commenters are plenty but the thinkers are few." -- Walid Shoebat)
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To: defconw
I can see the problem when both are not Catholic - that puts everybody (including the priest) in a tough spot.

My husband converted before we were married (to the Episcopal church). Then we both converted to Catholicism after the Episcopalians lost their minds. But - particularly once we had children - it was important to be singing from the same page. And, more importantly, it matters what you believe, and if it matters, you need to stand by it. Even if somebody gets offended.

I know somebody whose dad was Jewish, mom Catholic. They were married in a Christian/Disciples of Christ church, then became Unitarians. She became a pagan priestess. Same thing happened to another girl whose father was a howling atheist, mother agnostic. Not sure what that means, other than that it's difficult to rebel against your parents when you're not sure what you're rebelling against . . .

38 posted on 07/29/2014 9:30:16 AM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ecce Crucem Domini, fugite partes adversae. Vicit Leo de Tribu Iuda, Radix David, Alleluia!)
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To: old and tired
Dang, that's pretty rough.

Our parish has a very pretty church, and they charge a hefty fee for non-parishioners to be married there. But for us, it was a flat fee of $250, plus we gave an honorarium to the priest, and the altar boy got a nice gratuity.

It was the reception at a local restaurant that killed us! But it was very nice.

39 posted on 07/29/2014 9:33:35 AM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ecce Crucem Domini, fugite partes adversae. Vicit Leo de Tribu Iuda, Radix David, Alleluia!)
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To: AnAmericanMother

Oh My! I guess you join the Tea Party! LOL


40 posted on 07/29/2014 10:04:45 AM PDT by defconw (Both parties have clearly lost their minds!)
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