Posted on 08/14/2017 2:18:10 PM PDT by Drew68
Jacksonville mayor says if City Council passes it, he'll consider signing bill
JACKSONVILLE, Fla. - The president of Jacksonville City Council on Monday asked several city departments conduct an inventory of all Confederate monuments, memorials and markers on public property with the intention of asking that they be removed.
"At the end of the day, I’d like to move them," President Anna Brosche said. "I’d like to make sure that we can appreciate the history and heritage of what these memorials, monuments and markers mean to city of Jacksonville. At the same time, also realize that these are symbols that evoke a significant amount of negative emotion for some in our community."
Brosche said her action comes after the "horrific and unacceptable incidents" that occurred in Charlottesville, Virginia, and follows the actions of Florida Gov. Jeb Bush and, most recently, the Florida Senate, who removed Confederate items from public places in Tallahassee.
She directed the Parks and Recreation Department and planning division's Historic Preservation Section to inventory of all Confederate monuments, memorials and markers on public property.
"Upon completion of the inventory, I intend to propose legislation to move Confederate monuments, memorials, and markers from public property to museums and educational institutions, where they can be respectfully preserved and historically contextualized," Brosche said in a statement announcing her plan. "It is important to never forget the history of our great city; and, these monuments, memorials and markers represent a time in our history that caused pain to so many."
Mayor Lenny Curry said Monday that the Virginia tragedy was awful and he respects the City Council's role in making law. If Council passes a bill removing the statues, he will review it and decide whether he will sign it.
"I respect the Council’s role in moving forward with priorities that are their priorities that may not be mine," Curry said. "Look, you can’t be all things to all people. And I’m very focused on a city that’s fighting its way out of violence because public safety was gutted."
Community efforts to have the Confederate soldier marker in Hemming Park removed, as well as similar statutes removed and Confederate Park renamed have been gathering momentum.
After Saturday's deadly violence where a car was driven into a group of people protesting a white supremacist rally in defense of a statue of Gen. Robert E. Lee on Charlottesville property, Take 'Em Down Jax held an emergency rally that night outside the Jacksonville Landing.
“This hate, we have to confront it. If we don’t, it won't go away," Wells Todd said, a member of Take 'Em Down Jax, told News4Jax earlier this summer.
Lakey Love, with the American Civil Liberties Union, agrees that the monuments should be gone.
"I stand for taking them down. They represent white supremacy, a history of racism -- internment of black and brown people," Love said. "I’m all for taking down anything that represents a historical path that marginalizes people."
There are also people in Jacksonville who oppose moving the statues.
"And even though we might not agree with what has happened in the past, I think it’s still part of history and we should not destroy it," said Brian Buschow said.
Dave Nelson, who sells Confederate historical memorabilia at his store, Uncle Davey’s Americana, supports the historical markers, but not the white nationalists who are linking themselves to Confederate history.
"As far as removing the monuments, that’s very sad because these are monuments to veterans or Confederate soldiers. The U.S. Congress said that all veterans are U.S. veterans," Nelson said.
Because most of these monuments are well over 100 years old, some, including Councilman Jim Love, have speculated that they can't be moved without breaking them.
How other Florida cities are dealing with Confederate monuments
Some other Florida cities have either removed Confederate markers or are in the process of doing so. Work removing "Old Joe" from outside the Alachua County Administration building in Gainesville began Sunday and continued Monday.
The statue is being returned to the local chapter of the United Daughters of the Confederacy, which erected it in 1904. The County officials said they did not know where the statue would go, the Gainesville Sun reported.
In June, the city of Orlando removed a statue depicts Johnny Reb -- a symbol of the Confederacy and its soldiers -- from Lake Eola Park. The statue was moved to Greenwood Cemetery, where it will be kept in a section dedicated to Confederate veterans.
In Tampa, a passer-by called 911 after seeing that paint had been tossed on and around the Confederate memorial's columns and derogatory comments were scrawled in paint, the Hillsborough County Sheriff's Office said in a news release. The site is on private property near Tampa on Florida's west coast.
Hillsborough County commissioners voted on July 19 to remove a different monument in the county, this one in downtown Tampa and on county property, after several heated meetings filled with public discussion.
The 60-foot-tall granite column, topped by a bronze statue of a Confederate soldier, has been in Jacksonville's Hemming Plaza for nearly 120 years. It’s the site of a monument to Women of the Confederacy that was dedicated in 1915 and a historical marker placed by the Sons of Confederate Veterans to commemorate the May 1914 national reunion of Confederate veterans that took place in Jacksonville.
In March, the Jacksonville City Council Neighborhoods Committee asked the full council to withdraw a bill to designate Hemming Park’s confederate monument as a historical landmark.
Others markers in parks and public areas around the city include a tribute to the women of the Confederacy in Confederate Park and the Gen. Joseph Finnegan grave monument in Jacksonville's Old City Cemetery.
THE Universities are hopeless, students lack even an interest in studying any of these Civil War era figures. Those commies in Charlottesville don’t know the first thing about R.E. Lee.
The best outcome is to get the removed monuments moved out of the Communist-infested cities to a new location.
“With malice toward none, with charity for all, with firmness in the right as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in, to bind up the nation’s wounds, to care for him who shall have borne the battle and for his widow and his orphan, to do all which may achieve and cherish a just and lasting peace among ourselves and with all nations.”
bind up the nation’s wounds? It is the LEFT that is rejecting Lincoln’s America.
I don’t know whether to laugh at you or feel sorry for you. This has been explained to you numerous times on this forum. The southern slaveocracy didn’t like the results of an election and started a rebellion to form their own country. Whether the soldier’s care about slavery or not their government sure did. So much so that when the “black” republican was elected they rebelled.
Now I do agree with you that there is a natural right to rebellion/revolution. However, when you appeal to force of arms as the confederacy did you better make damn sure you can win.
We also have the right to determine if a rebellion/revolution is for a good reason(s) or not. The southern rebellion was started for horrible reasons and should be judged as bad as the Bolshevik and Iranian revolutions. Luckily it didn’t succeed.
The same talking points have been parroted to me over and over, yes.
The southern slaveocracy didn’t like the results of an election and started a rebellion to form their own country.
But this point makes it sound like they weren't still going to have a slaveocracy if they had remained in the Union. In other words, it is a complete distortion of the relevant point.
The Union was okay with a slaveocracy that they controlled. They were not okay with a slaveocracy they didn't control. The point here is that it wasn't about the slaves, it was about who was going to control the money they created.
It is dishonest to claim credit for eradicating a condition that you would have continued had control remained in your hands.
Whether the soldier’s care about slavery or not their government sure did.
The Union government cared about the money the South would produce that wouldn't go through their hands. The Southern produced commerce from Europe was paying for 70-80% of all the Federal taxes in the Union in 1860. It was also pushing 238 million dollars through the New York economy. Virtually the entire shipping industry of the United States was tied up in shipping Southern products to Europe.
Now I do agree with you that there is a natural right to rebellion/revolution. However, when you appeal to force of arms as the confederacy did you better make damn sure you can win.
When you have been told that a fleet of Ships has been sent to attack you, would you wait for them to show up and fire at you? You could either run away with your tail between your legs, or you could neutralize the threat to your back before the threat to your front arrives to fire at you.
We also have the right to determine if a rebellion/revolution is for a good reason(s) or not.
The British did not think we had good reasons to throw off the allegiance of the King. I would say "good reasons" are in the eye of the beholder.
The southern rebellion was started for horrible reasons and should be judged as bad as the Bolshevik and Iranian revolutions. Luckily it didn’t succeed.
And yet the Southern continued participation in the Union complete with it's slaveocracy was the default condition. Horrible if the South has independence, but completely tolerable if the North retains control of Southern commerce.
Now why is it horrible for the South to be independent, but completely acceptable if they remained in the Union?
How do you deal with such cognitive dissonance on such a fundamental question?
there was a reconciliation and the states were re-admitted. And Reconstruction.
R.E. Lee supported President Johnson’s plan of Presidential Reconstruction that took effect in 1865–66.
On May 29, 1865, President Andrew Johnson issued a Proclamation of Amnesty and Pardon to persons who had participated in the rebellion against the United States.
Jeff Davis was among a committee of 13 U.S. senators who attempted to find a suitable compromise after South Carolina left the Union in December 1860
Davis: His U.S. citizenship wasn’t restored until 1978
That's rather amusing. It means that so far as the US Government was concerned, he really did gain independence from the US. So for 117 years, he was a Citizen of the CSA. :)
And after all that trouble Lincoln went to to refuse to admit they ever left.
Something drastic must be done. These schools are nothing but anti-American training grounds for radical leftists with the sensibility of Hitleresque or Stalinist-Leninist street thugs.
Robert E. Lee is an odd hero for the Klan and Neo-confederates.
he generally opposed slavery
he opposed secession
he supported the reconciliation and reconstruction and did much to bring the Union back together
which is why he was revered in the North and the South
He opposed the Klan and supported equality of the races after the war
The stars and stripes were his flag after the war. Not the Confederate flag
The Stars and Stripes are our only flag. The lefties have their rainbow flag. McAulliffe and company have more in common with the Radical Republicans bent on vengeance.
William Tecumseh Sherman belongs on the UVA campus
It is not clear Lincoln was fighting to destroy slavery. Maybe he was.
If he was, he was fighting to overthrow the U.S. constitution with violence - the constitution he twice took an oath to protect and defend as president.
This will be a surprise to many, but slavery was enshrined in the U.S. constitution from the beginning by an affirmative vote of New York, New Jersey, New Hampshire, Connecticut, Pennsylvania, Massachusetts, Delaware, Rhode Island and Maryland.
And, oh yes, Virginia, North and South Carolina, and Georgia.
Jefferson Davis could have been convicted of treason upon “the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.”
History shows this was too high a standard for the prosecution to meet so the trumped-up charges against Davis were dropped.
And a good thing too. If Davis had been subjected to Victors' Justice, I don't think the South would have been so quick to forgive and forget the war crimes of Lincoln, Sherman, and others.
It takes a peculiar sort of feller to so completely turn rhyme and reason on its head - but you are certainly are peculiar.
Only someone like you could purport that turning ones back on the constitution and breaking the pact that drew this nation together could ever possibly be a constitutional act. Or that a person who fought to defend the constitution from sedition and insurrection could ever possibly be considered attempting to “overthrow the U.S. constitution”.
Or that a constitution “enshrines” a peculiarity that it doesn’t even identify be name. Ridiculous? Of course. Perverse? You bet. Par for the course? Unfortunately yea.
Yea - like they've done so well to get over losing.
No, it means that he was a man without a country for all those years.
Does that mean all the CA Liberals pushing for Calexit are Traitors too?
If so, why hasn’t the Federal Government (The Union) arrested them, charged them and put them in Prison?
Just making conversation. LOL
“If Davis had been subjected to Victors’ Justice, I don’t think the South would have been so quick to forgive and forget the war crimes of Lincoln, Sherman, and others”
I don’t are how you feel about Lincoln’s decision to kill 600,000 Americans, that right there is funny.
Note to file: The word “are” should have been “care” in my previous post.
Fixing one F-up doesn’t fix your central F-up.
My position is that the Foundation document of this country proclaims that people have a right to Independence if they wish it, and that this right come from "Nature and Nature's God..."
I just take the position that the founders meant what they said when they formed this nation based on that principle.
GD Civil War BS still causing trouble. Ugh. Democrats and Democrats fighting over statues of Democrats and they blame the Republican President.
With so many young people having grown up completely ignorant about American history, especially Civil War history it’s no wonder that people equate the Confederate flag and symbols as being...RACIST and Politically Incorrect for our era without having the once recognized perspective and even respect (though they were wrong) for the South.
This is called (what we are slowly losing) tolerance and reason, the foundation of this Union and why the Civil War was fought in the first place!
The great bogey man of our era is not following Orwellian Newspeak or ThoughtPolice agendas and going with the anti-intellectual, anti-Democratic and very Fascist-like immediate object to be ridiculed and destroyed for the sake of the Liberal masses.
That they have deemed these long honored symbols as modern machinations of evil, something that must be torn down and destroyed without understanding the implication spells disaster for this country.
Even as a Yankee, I recognize the huge contribution of the South, her fighters and her Generals. The great conflict ended and it took more than 100 years to heal.
We thought we were making great progress since 1964 only to now see a major reversal. Only now it’s all turned on it’s head. The Anti_fascists are now the Fascists they condemn and they know it, yet they keep on agitation because somebody not to their liking was elected President.
Much of this upheaval was spawned by the previous President with his reverse-racial discrimination agendas and disrespect for the nation he led.
We are only now beginning to see the built up hatred and resentment he planted now bearing fruit.
This is not President Trumps fault but his predecessor.
WWI, WWII, Korean War and the Viet Nam War Memorials are next!
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