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Modern culture emerged in Africa 20,000 years earlier than thought
Los Angels Times ^ | 30 July 2012 | By Thomas H. Maugh II

Posted on 08/04/2012 11:31:28 AM PDT by smokingfrog

Modern culture emerged in southern Africa at least 44,000 years ago, more than 20,000 years earlier than anthropologists had previously believed, researchers reported Monday.

That blossoming of technology and art occurred at roughly the same time that modern humans were migrating from Africa to Europe, where they soon displaced Neanderthals. Many of the characteristics of the ancient culture identified by anthropologists are still present in hunter-gatherer cultures of Africa today, such as the San culture of southern Africa, the researchers said.

The new evidence was provided by an international team of researchers excavating at an archaeological site called Border Cave in the foothills of the Lebombo Mountains on the border of KwaZulu-Natal in South Africa and Swaziland. The cave shows evidence of occupation by human ancestors going back more than 200,000 years, but the team reported in two papers in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences that they were able to accurately date their discoveries to 42,000 to 44,000 years ago, a period known as the Later Stone Age or the Upper Paleolithic Period in Europe.

(Excerpt) Read more at latimes.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: africa; bordercave; civilizations; godgravesglyphs; godsgravesglyphs; science
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1 posted on 08/04/2012 11:31:42 AM PDT by smokingfrog
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To: smokingfrog

So all the other guys are wrong and these folks are right. When are they going to admit....”We don’t know”....


2 posted on 08/04/2012 11:34:58 AM PDT by Sacajaweau
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To: smokingfrog

But it hasn’t reached Compton yet.


3 posted on 08/04/2012 11:36:10 AM PDT by Random Access
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To: smokingfrog
Once again I have to call Bull$hit. Nothing about modern culture came from Africa. Especially South Africa. Once again, name me one, just one successful subSarahan African country.
4 posted on 08/04/2012 11:37:08 AM PDT by Tupelo (TeaPartier ..... but no longer a Republican)
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To: smokingfrog
Wait a minute.Regardless of where this happened...in the Rift Valley or just west of London....I think if we're talking 44,000 years ago it's a little presumptuous to use the word “modern”.
5 posted on 08/04/2012 11:37:55 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Poor Barack.If He's Reelected,Think Of The Mess He'll Inherit!)
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To: Tupelo

South Africa and Rhodesia=- but the tribes who built those successful cultures were forced out by rasist thugs


6 posted on 08/04/2012 11:39:03 AM PDT by silverleaf (Age Takes a Toll: Please Have Exact Change)
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To: smokingfrog

Primitivism and communism -- two world views that work well together.

7 posted on 08/04/2012 11:40:42 AM PDT by ClearCase_guy (Roger Taney? Not a bad Chief Justice. John Roberts? A really awful Chief Justice.)
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To: Random Access
But it hasn’t reached Compton yet.

Of course it has.Folks in Compton can work a Blackberry as well as anyone.A report on last year's London riots says that the thugs (most of whom,IIRC,were "of color") used Blackberrys to coordinate their looting and burning.

8 posted on 08/04/2012 11:42:31 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative (Poor Barack.If He's Reelected,Think Of The Mess He'll Inherit!)
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To: smokingfrog
modern humans were migrating from Africa to Europe, where they soon displaced Neanderthals.

RACISM!

9 posted on 08/04/2012 11:44:17 AM PDT by SIDENET ("If that's your best, your best won't do." -Dee Snider)
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To: SunkenCiv

40,000 year old culture FYI

10 posted on 08/04/2012 11:48:32 AM PDT by Pollster1 (Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. - Ronald Reagan)
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To: smokingfrog

Mr. San Man...
Bring me a dream...
bom, bom, bom, bom...
11 posted on 08/04/2012 11:52:01 AM PDT by Repeal The 17th (We have met the enemy and he is us.)
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To: Pollster1

Labels for picture:

Objects found in the archaeological site called Border Cave include
a) a wooden digging stick;
b) a wooden poison applicator;
c) a bone arrow point decorated with a spiral incision filled with red pigment;
d) a bone object with four sets of notches;
e) a lump of beeswax; and
f) ostrich eggshell beads and marine shell beads used as personal ornaments.

(Francesco d’Errico and Lucinda Backwell / July 30, 2012)


12 posted on 08/04/2012 11:52:06 AM PDT by Pollster1 (Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. - Ronald Reagan)
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To: Gay State Conservative

http://blogs.gartner.com/jenny-sussin/files/2012/05/cave-man-social-media-mashable-comic-640.jpg


13 posted on 08/04/2012 11:56:57 AM PDT by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open (<o> ---)
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To: Tupelo
Once again, name me one, just one successful subSarahan African country.

Rhodesia.

When it was "Rhodesia".

14 posted on 08/04/2012 11:56:57 AM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: smokingfrog

“Modern culture emerged in southern Africa at least 44,000 years ago”

I thought we were still waiting...


15 posted on 08/04/2012 12:04:54 PM PDT by babygene (Figures don't lie, but liars can figure...)
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To: smokingfrog
"Modern culture emerged in southern Africa"

ARCHITECTURE THROUGH THE AGES

Roman Architecture 27 AD

African Architecture 2012 AD


16 posted on 08/04/2012 12:05:58 PM PDT by Iron Munro ("Jiggle the Handle for Barry!")
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To: smokingfrog
The antediluvian civilization was global. Most traces of it are under 400 feet of water today.
17 posted on 08/04/2012 12:06:19 PM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: Tupelo

Just because there are no successful cultures in sub-Saharan Africa now does not mean that some kind of society did not arise there 44,000 years ago. Societies rise and fall based on their predominant philosophical ideas which change over time.


18 posted on 08/04/2012 12:07:56 PM PDT by albionin (A gawn fit's aye gettin.)
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To: smokingfrog

Right and witness how far they’ve come with flash mobs, molestation and killing of whites by black mobs, our increased black populations in prison, their disgustingly high rate of dropouts in high school, their clinging to only one type of political persuasion, etc.

They’ve come a long, long way. What a bunch of nonsense!


19 posted on 08/04/2012 12:12:28 PM PDT by laweeks
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To: Tupelo
Once again, name me one, just one successful subSarahan African country.

Atlanta?
Camden?
Chicago?
Detroit?
Gary?
Newark?
Oakland?
Washington, DC?
Well - they feel like different countries.....


20 posted on 08/04/2012 12:15:22 PM PDT by Iron Munro ("Jiggle the Handle for Barry!")
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To: smokingfrog

” Modern culture emerged in southern Africa at least 44,000 years ago,”

And the slave trade started 43,999 years ago.

Evil white Europeans.


21 posted on 08/04/2012 12:31:34 PM PDT by moovova (Chic-fil-A is good...and right.)
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To: Gay State Conservative

Well, A socierty that has survived into modern times. Many of those formerly called primitive, show signs of great development. Recall the “iceman” whose body was found virtually intact in Switzerland. He lived in a society of great sophistication, and that was at least 10,000 years ago.


22 posted on 08/04/2012 12:36:36 PM PDT by RobbyS (Christus rex.)
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To: Iron Munro

And you forgot the round thatched huts that were Celtic...and the rough log cabins that were Scots-Irish, etc. etc.

And L always thought roman architecture stank. It was a rip-off from Greece, it was grandiose and heavy and the expression of a one-party state.

Your comparison is mindless.


23 posted on 08/04/2012 12:38:27 PM PDT by squarebarb
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To: Iron Munro

And you forgot the round thatched huts that were Celtic...and the rough log cabins that were Scots-Irish, etc. etc.

And I always thought roman architecture stank. It was a rip-off from Greece, it was grandiose and heavy and the expression of a one-party state.

Your comparison is mindless.


24 posted on 08/04/2012 12:39:22 PM PDT by squarebarb
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To: BenLurkin

You will be laughed at for at for using “antediluvian,” but one thing is certain. Human culture goes back a long,long way and even minimal honesty demands that they accept that most of the evidence remains unburied.


25 posted on 08/04/2012 12:42:49 PM PDT by RobbyS (Christus rex.)
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To: Pollster1

All those stones with perfectly round holes look like they were used as the bearing block for bow drills, and used completely.


26 posted on 08/04/2012 12:45:05 PM PDT by meadsjn (Sarah 2012, or sooner)
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To: RobbyS
You will be laughed at for at for using “antediluvian,”

By who? Why?

Sea levels are higher today than they were 15,000 years ago. You can bet the folks who lost their homes as the glaciers melted weren't laughing.

27 posted on 08/04/2012 12:47:47 PM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: squarebarb
And you forgot the round thatched huts that were Celtic...and the rough log cabins that were Scots-Irish, etc. etc. And I always thought roman architecture stank. It was a rip-off from Greece, it was grandiose and heavy and the expression of a one-party state. Your comparison is mindless.

And you are a picker of nits.

Maybe you can enlighten us by listing the top 100 African medical and industrial contributions to modern culture. (other than the burning tire necklace).


28 posted on 08/04/2012 12:50:50 PM PDT by Iron Munro ("Jiggle the Handle for Barry!")
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To: smokingfrog
Many of the characteristics of the ancient culture identified by anthropologists are still present in hunter-gatherer cultures of Africa today,

Well, that explains a lot about the epic fails in so many African nations.

29 posted on 08/04/2012 12:53:15 PM PDT by Valpal1
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To: BenLurkin

They will assume that you are a creationist. INHO, however, the term is still useful. Because much more human history is unknown than known. A few years ago, a massive temple was unearthed in southern Turkey. It has been dated at about ten thousand years, and is Stonehenge on a massive scale. As there are only tens of thousands of archeologists, no way will be ever know what the “real” past was like.


30 posted on 08/04/2012 12:55:05 PM PDT by RobbyS (Christus rex.)
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To: All


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31 posted on 08/04/2012 12:57:09 PM PDT by musicman (Until I see the REAL Long Form Vault BC, he's just "PRES__ENT" Obama = Without "ID")
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To: Iron Munro
It looks like this emerged from certain African cultures...


32 posted on 08/04/2012 1:03:46 PM PDT by ProtectOurFreedom
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To: smokingfrog

Modern culture still hasn’t emerged from that continent and never will.


33 posted on 08/04/2012 1:04:13 PM PDT by TheRhinelander
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To: ProtectOurFreedom

What a waste of the life force.


34 posted on 08/04/2012 1:10:45 PM PDT by Iron Munro ("Jiggle the Handle for Barry!")
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To: Pollster1

This kind of thing is sometimes described as being “prehistoric”. However, I’m not so sure.


35 posted on 08/04/2012 1:12:50 PM PDT by equaviator (There's nothing like the universe to bring you down to earth again.)
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To: RobbyS; BenLurkin
Between 24,000 and 20,000 years ago the current Ice Age reached a peak period for glaciation.

The ocean was as low as it goes. Humans, as usual, lived on the flood planes of the slow flowing rivers, or near the shoreline ~ and that was about 400 ft deep in the present ocean.

With a small population they had no reason whatsoever to advance inland or uphill so whatever it was they did is little known ~ as yet.

Besides the inland areas were filled to the brim with giant elephants and enormous saber toothed tigers and dire wolves.

A guy could get et!

I suppose ANTIDILUVIAN is as good a name for it as any.

36 posted on 08/04/2012 1:14:47 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: RobbyS; BenLurkin
The dates here ~ 44,000 years ago ~ are not coincident with the flow of human beings North and East out of Africa. It is now known that happened about 100,000 years + earlier, and took place from the Arabian peninsula.

The earlier Neanderthal colonization of Europe was about 400,000 years back.

What I think has been discovered is the movement of a more highly cultured human group from Arabia back down into Africa during a short, previously unknown Saharian pluvial.

There's also the recent discovery that virtually all indigenous Africans have a quite serious gene group that comes from yet a different race which did not pass on any of those genes to Europeans, East Indians, or Andaman Islanders.

Some of the anthropoligists have suggested this other race was another version of the Neanderthalers ~ albeit a group living in Africa and pursuing a separate evolution.

It is possible the people returning to Africa bred (as is normal) with this other population to create today's current indigenous populations. The Sen people seem to be a separate race from all the others in Africa, but they are demonstrably related at the genetic level with the Europeans and East Asians.

37 posted on 08/04/2012 1:23:34 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: muawiyah

All these things are possible. We do not know when physically modern men first appeared on the scene, nor what the true course of history is. One constant I have ƒound is that most people do not know how big Africa is. We were on a tour in Spain. The South Africians who were with us were flying out of Madrid the same time we were, and getting home after we arrived back to DFW. Direct flights in each case.


38 posted on 08/04/2012 1:36:27 PM PDT by RobbyS (Christus rex.)
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To: muawiyah

All these things are possible. We do not know when physically modern men first appeared on the scene, nor what the true course of history is. One constant I have ƒound is that most people do not know how big Africa is. We were on a tour in Spain. The South Africians who were with us were flying out of Madrid the same time we were, and getting home after we arrived back to DFW. Direct flights in each case.


39 posted on 08/04/2012 1:36:38 PM PDT by RobbyS (Christus rex.)
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To: BenLurkin
"The antediluvian civilization was global. Most traces of it are under 400 feet of water today."

Tiwanaku is pretty high and dry though.

40 posted on 08/04/2012 1:40:50 PM PDT by Flag_This (Real presidents don't bow.)
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To: muawiyah

Wow...you mean everybody got free beach-front property and no property taxes, to boot? Man, what a time to live!


41 posted on 08/04/2012 1:43:33 PM PDT by ProtectOurFreedom
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To: smokingfrog
They made a documentary about nep lithini life back in the 60's. It was amazing technology.


42 posted on 08/04/2012 1:45:32 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: smokingfrog

about nep lithini = neolithic


43 posted on 08/04/2012 1:46:38 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: smokingfrog

about nep lithini = neolithic


44 posted on 08/04/2012 1:46:38 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Tupelo
Once again I have to call Bull$hit. Nothing about modern culture came from Africa. Especially South Africa. Once again, name me one, just one successful subSarahan African country.

There have been tons of them. Didn't you get the memo?

I remember one Freeper years ago, who was an expert on African civilations, all of which disappeared without a trace. He wasn't too good at grammar and spelling, but he knew his myths.

Not a trace of written language in sight, no history, no narrative of any kind. Just the speculations defined by Mark Twain, "Such large returns of conjecture, from so modest investment of fact."

45 posted on 08/04/2012 2:11:09 PM PDT by publius911 (Formerly Publius 6961, formerly jennsdad)
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To: albionin

The same can be said of Siberia... or Antarctica.


46 posted on 08/04/2012 2:17:23 PM PDT by publius911 (Formerly Publius 6961, formerly jennsdad)
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To: ProtectOurFreedom

And no snoopy neighbors. Come the warm days of summer you could lie there nekkid and nobody cared!


47 posted on 08/04/2012 2:23:21 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: RobbyS

AFRICA is HUGE


48 posted on 08/04/2012 2:25:04 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: Flag_This
1200 BCE ~ estimated age for establishment of Tiwanaku ~ long after the big ice went away.

When the ice melted and the oceans began rising human beings were forced to figure some stuff out ~ maybe killing the big tigers was one of them. Still, as the ice melted the zone of grass that fed the giant elephants moved North as well and the predators followed the prey.

Serendipitously a comet smacked into the Earth and froze the elephants and that took the predators with the prey leaving behind only the smaller cats like lions and tigers.

Human beings quickly learned to deal with the smaller cats and today they are almost extinct.

49 posted on 08/04/2012 2:29:31 PM PDT by muawiyah
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To: muawiyah

The evidence of cultural levels in man from 200k to 40k is very limited. South Africa has definite evidence of relatively modern culture from 85k. However, a polished child’s skull raising question of “religion” is 160k and the tool kits show a consistent level of esthetic design from 200k+.

The record is very sparse because there just were not all that many of us around. At some point around 80k there were only 10k modern humans around or so DNA seems to indicate.

My point is that evidence is so rare as to make almost any speculation “iffy”.


50 posted on 08/04/2012 2:31:15 PM PDT by JimSEA
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