i'm sure the women and little children raped and murdered by these types will take some comfort in that their abusers will be with them in the hereafter, maybe they can do lunch... excuse be while i go throw up
Posted on 06/08/2017 5:24:08 PM PDT by ealgeone
Question: "Is eternal security a "license" to sin?"
Answer: The most frequent objection to the doctrine of eternal security is that it supposedly allows people to live any way that they want and still be saved. While this may be "technically" true, it is not true in reality. A person who has truly been redeemed by Jesus Christ will not live a life characterized by continuous, willful sin. We must draw a distinction between how a Christian should live and what a person must do in order to receive salvation.
The Bible is clear that salvation is by grace alone, through faith alone, in Jesus Christ alone (John 3:16; Ephesians 2:8-9; John 14:6). The moment a person truly believes in Jesus Christ, he or she is saved and secure in that salvation. It is unbiblical to say that salvation is received by faith, but then has to be maintained by works. The apostle Paul addresses this issue in Galatians 3:3 when he asks, "Are you so foolish? After beginning with the Spirit, are you now trying to attain your goal by human effort?" If we are saved by faith, our salvation is also maintained and secured by faith. We cannot earn our own salvation. Therefore, neither can we earn the maintenance of our salvation. It is God who maintains our salvation (Jude 24). It is God's hand that holds us firmly in His grasp (John 10:28-29). It is God's love that nothing can separate us from (Romans 8:38-39).
Any denial of eternal security is, in its essence, a belief that we must maintain our own salvation by our own good works and efforts. This is completely antithetical to salvation by grace. We are saved because of Christ's merits, not our own (Romans 4:3-8). To claim that we must obey God's Word or live a godly life to maintain our salvation is saying that Jesus' death was not sufficient to pay the penalty for our sins. Jesus' death was absolutely sufficient to pay for all of our sins—past, present, and future, pre-salvation and post-salvation (Romans 5:8; 1 Corinthians 15:3; 2 Corinthians 5:21).
Does this mean that a Christian can live any way he wants to and still be saved? This is essentially a hypothetical question, because the Bible makes it clear that a true Christian will not live "any way he wants to." Christians are new creations (2 Corinthians 5:17). Christians demonstrate the fruit of the Spirit (Galatians 5:22-23), not the acts of the flesh (Galatians 5:19-21). First John 3:6-9 clearly states that a true Christian will not live in continual sin. In response to the accusation that grace promotes sin, the apostle Paul declared, "What shall we say, then? Shall we go on sinning so that grace may increase? By no means! We died to sin; how can we live in it any longer?" (Romans 6:1-2).
Eternal security is not a license to sin. Rather, it is the security of knowing that God's love is guaranteed for those who trust in Christ. Knowing and understanding God's tremendous gift of salvation accomplishes the opposite of giving a license to sin. How could anyone, knowing the price Jesus Christ paid for us, go on to live a life of sin (Romans 6:15-23)? How could anyone who understands God's unconditional and guaranteed love for those who believe, take that love and throw it back in God's face? Such a person is demonstrating not that eternal security has given him a license to sin, but rather that he or she has not truly experienced salvation through Jesus Christ. "No one who lives in him keeps on sinning. No one who continues to sin has either seen him or known him" (1 John 3:6).
I disagree with this sentence: “ A person who has truly been redeemed by Jesus Christ will not live a life characterized by continuous, willful sin.”
We all live a life of continuous, willful sin. All sin is willful, and we sin everyday. To suggest we don’t is absurd.
If you keep sinning, and if you want to keep sinning, you have put the sin before God.
Sinning and turning from sin are two opposite acts.
What matters is which of the two you choose over time.
Some may regard it that way.
We have dual natures in us, believers are both saved and sinner at the same time here. The sin nature still needs to be controlled and it will be, albeit imperfectly. Our loves as believers until we die, is our sanctification process where we grow as people and in our faith and this implies we increase our self control over time to minimize what we recognize to be our problem sins and to not just mentally agree with God we need to change, but also control the body, ie the tongue, the eyes, the stuff we are basically embarrassed and ashamed we are inherently drawn towards that we know is bad. For us, and often for others.
Some are just grateful for this fact that God won’t give up on us. It is part of trusting God at His word. Understanding that God did not set up these things to prevent us from being with Him, but that He provided a way, the same way, for all to be with Him, if they desire. When we screw up we know that we can sincerely ask for forgiveness and be assured He will, because we know He is on our side.
As God saves us entirely, with nothing we do counting towards our own salvation, and He says He will never take it away from us, then there isn’t anything we can do to lose it.
I would say if one thinks this grants them a license to sin more and sin like crazy and that they can somehow demand God must save them on a technicality, I would really seriously have to question if that person was genuinely saved. Because real believers do not try to pull this kind of jerk move on God.
I halfway agree. God’s Salvation is eternal. It is impeccable. It is undeserved, and can’t be earned.
It is a gift freely given by God. If we reject God, that is turning away from His gift of Salvation.
We reject God every time we sin. Fortunately, we can seek His forgiveness, and return to Him.
However, if we die resisting God, then Hell is our reward.
Salvation never goes away, but we are always able to reject it.
Where does the Bible say "our salvation is secured by [our] faith"? With the idea that continued faith is a requirement.
When the jailor asked Paul and Silas what he must do to be saved in Acts 16:30, they said "Believe [Πίστευσον] on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house."
That is an aorist imperative. Its aspect is punctiliar not progressive. I know the games the semantic games the "perseverance of the saints" crowd makes of verbal aspect. But here is one example that sinks that boat. Salvation is a ONE TIME event.
We performed no meritorious acts to get saved. And our status as "sons of God" is not dependent upon our performance in accordance with the law -- i.e. not sinning.
11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not. 12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: 13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. (John 1:11-13)
Born of God, not by the will of the flesh or men.
I have to ask God to deliver me from sin in the moment I’ve living, in the present.
When I prayed a prayer years ago and then got “saved” and I kept on sinning, which is my actual experience, I wasn’t getting it right.
I need God all the time, all the time.
I can’t do it by self-will using God’s name in vain.
I have to surrender, give it up, admit my powerlessness and say God is ‘the boss’.
I must admit I’m wrong to God and even humble myself to admit I’m wrong to others.
No, what it does is causes us to fall on our faces before God in GRATITUDE of what He's done and out of that gratitude, not not out of fear of hell, purpose to live a live as free from sin as possible to honor and glorify the One who paid such a great penalty to save us.
People who think that way and make those accusations are showing that they do not understand the new birth and do not have a regenerated spirit cause no person with a regenerated spirit would even think of looking at eternal security in the terms of *Oh boy, now I can go out and sin up a storm and I'm good to go.*
Salvation is not fire insurance.
No, no born again believer goes to hell over sin.
There is a difference between choosing to sin and outright rejecting God.
Salvation is not on again and off again. That's salvation by works, not grace.
Our salvation is not secured by our anything.
It is secured by God who secures it for us by giving us the Holy Spirit.Security of the believer
John 5:24 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.
John 6:37-39 All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out. For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me. And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day.
John 10:25-30 Jesus answered them, “I told you, and you do not believe. The works that I do in my Father's name bear witness about me, but you do not believe because you are not among my sheep. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand. I and the Father are one.”
Romans 4:16 Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may be by grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham's offspring-not only to those who are of the law but also to those who have the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all.
1 Corinthians 1:4-8 I give thanks to my God always for you because of the grace of God that was given you in Christ Jesus,that in every way you were enriched in him in all speech and all knowledge—even as the testimony about Christ was confirmed among you—so that you are not lacking in any gift, as you wait for the revealing of our Lord Jesus Christ, who will sustain you to the end, guiltless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.
2 Corinthians 1:21-22 And it is God who establishes us with you in Christ, and has anointed us, and who has also put his seal on us and given us his Spirit in our hearts as a guarantee.
2 Corinthians 5:4-8 For while we are still in this tent, we groan, being burdened—not that we would be unclothed, but that we would be further clothed, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life. He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who has given us the Spirit as a guarantee.
So we are always of good courage. We know that while we are at home in the body we are away from the Lord, for we walk by faith, not by sight. Yes, we are of good courage, and we would rather be away from the body and at home with the Lord.
Ephesians 1:13-14 In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory.
Ephesians 4:30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.
Philippians 1:6 And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.
Colossians 1:13-14 He has delivered us from the domain of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.
Colossians 2:13-14 And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses, by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross.
Colossians 3:3 For you have died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God. When Christ who is your life appears, then you also will appear with him in glory.
1 Peter 1:3-5 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you, who by God's power are being guarded through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.
Hebrews 6:17-20 So when God desired to show more convincingly to the heirs of the promise the unchangeable character of his purpose, he guaranteed it with an oath, so that by two unchangeable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled for refuge might have strong encouragement to hold fast to the hope set before us. We have this as a sure and steadfast anchor of the soul, a hope that enters into the inner place behind the curtain, where Jesus has gone as a forerunner on our behalf, having become a high priest forever after the order of Melchizedek.
Jude v24"Now unto Him that is able to keep you from falling, and to present you faultless before the presence of his glory with exceeding joy"
1 John 5:13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/3156607/posts?page=313#313
2 Corinthians 1:21-22 Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is God; Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.
For which the Greek, from the Byzantine, is:
2Corinthians 1:21-22 ο δε βεβαιων ημας συν υμιν εις χριστον και χρισας ημας θεος ο και σφραγισαμενος ημας και δους τον αρραβωνα του πνευματος εν ταις καρδιαις ημων
The first word in bold above is “bebaion,” the idea of confirmation, frequently used in commercial settings to confirm a bargain. Which of course makes sense of the remaining terms used here, which are also elements of a secured contract.
The second word in bold above is “sphragisamenos,” being sealed is to be marked by the signature, signet ring, or other unique proof of identity, that we belong to God, and this sealing is done by God, who is the one taking action in this verse. We do not and cannot seal ourselves. We do not, by our own powers, have access to God’s “signet ring.”
The third bolded word above is “arrabona,” and indicates what we might loosely refer to as earnest money, but in Hebrew culture conveys more the idea of a pledge of covenant, a security given as a guarantee that the deal will go through, though we only receive part payment at the beginning. See ערב for the related Hebrew stem indicating “pledge.”
Christians sin. They sin and then repent of their sins. They do not "practice" (continuous, willful sin) sinning.
1Jn 3:4-6 Everyone who makes a practice of sinning also practices lawlessness; sin is lawlessness. You know that he appeared in order to take away sins, and in him there is no sin. No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him.
i'm sure the women and little children raped and murdered by these types will take some comfort in that their abusers will be with them in the hereafter, maybe they can do lunch... excuse be while i go throw up
Those types who claim that salvation is a license to sin and act like that will not be with them for eternity.
At least not in heaven with them.
And I am sure that some people JUST DON’T GET IT.
Really, you think rapists, murderers and child abusers are genuine Christians???
The Apostle Paul was a murderer but he found forgiveness is Jesus Christ and it changed his life completely. That’s what real faith, being born again in Christ, does to a person. But even Paul admitted that he had an ongoing battle within him between the spirit newborn nature and the old sin nature. We are dead to sin and alive in Christ. There WILL be victory and we WILL be made holy, as holy as Christ is holy because we are found IN Him, not having our own righteousness but the righteousness of God IN Christ. That is what eternal security means.
The parable of the ten bridesmaids chews up this argument.
In general, I agree. Anybody who says he isn’t a sinner is a liar.
Sadly, we are talking about the same thing, and using the same words, but we have different context/meaning.
Salvation is neither on nor off. However, it is rejected (sinning), and accepted (repentance, conforming to God’s will, etc.).
God doesn’t take away Salvation, we freely give it up when we sin. Fortunately, God is a merciful God, and when approached by a penitent, He is forgiving.
Of course, the goal is to change our ways, and completely conform ourselves (rebirth, born again) to God’s will.
We need God’s grace(s), as we are incapable by our nature, to not sin. We are constantly tempted by the evil one, and often give in. Again, we can seek forgiveness, and seek to amend our lives.
I would suggest that being born again is not a one time event, but rather, something that happens each time we cast off sin and seek to live that new life.
Going back to the beginning, God offer Heaven to each and every one of us. Jesus’s Passion, Death, and Resurrection, redeemed all of mankind for eternity. This redemption/salvation, is a permanent, unmerited, un-earnable, and eternal gift. However, as humans, we often reject that gift, but through God’s mercy, are able to accept the gift again.
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