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The Question, "What Is an Arminian?" Answered by a Lover of Free Grace
The Works of John Wesley ^ | 1872 | John Wesley

Posted on 11/17/2006 7:33:56 PM PST by DouglasKC

The Question, "What Is an Arminian?" Answered by a Lover of Free Grace

by John Wesley


1. To say, "This man is an Arminian," has the same effect on many hearers, as to say, "This is a mad dog." It puts them into a fright at once: They run away from him with all speed and diligence; and will hardly stop, unless it be to throw a stone at the dreadful and mischievous animal. 

2. The more unintelligible the word is, the better it answers the purpose. Those on whom it is fixed know not what to do: Not understanding what it means, they cannot tell what defence to make, or how to clear themselves from the charge. And it is not easy to remove the prejudice which others have imbibed, who know no more of it, than that it is "something very bad," if not "all that is bad!"

3. To clear the meaning, therefore, of this ambiguous term, may be of use to many: To those who so freely pin this name upon others, that they may not say what they do not understand; to those that hear them, that they may be no longer abused by men saying they know not what; and to those upon whom the name is fixed, that they may know how to answer for themselves.

4. It may be necessary to observe, First, that many confound Arminians with Arians. But this is entirely a different thing; the one has no resemblance to the other. An Arian is one who denies the Godhead of Christ; we scarce need say, the supreme, eternal Godhead; because there can be no God but the supreme, eternal God, unless we will make two Gods, a great God and a little one. Now, none have ever more firmly believed, or more strongly asserted, the Godhead of Christ, than many of the (so called) Arminians have done; yea, and do at this day. Arminianism therefore (whatever it be) is totally different from Arianism.

5. The rise of the word was this: JAMES HARMENS, in Latin, Jacobes Arminius, was first one of the Ministers of Amsterdam, and afterwards Professor of Divinity at Leyden. He was educated at Geneva; but in the year 1591 began to doubt of the principles which he had till then received. And being more and more convinced that they were wrong, when he was vested with the Professorship, he publicly taught what he believed the truth, till, in the year 1609, he died in peace. But a few years after his death, some zealous men with the Prince of Orange at their head, furiously assaulted all that held what were called his opinions; and having procured them to be solemnly condemned, in the famous Synod of Dort, (not so numerous or learned, but full as impartial, as the Council or Synod of Trent,) some were put to death, some banished, some imprisoned for life, all turned out of their employments, and made incapable of holding any office, either in Church or State.

6. The errors charged upon these (usually termed Arminians) by their opponents, are five: (1.) That they deny original sin; (2.) That they deny justification by faith; (3.) That they deny absolute predestination; (4.) That they deny the grace of God to be irresistible; and, (5.) That they affirm, a believer may fall from grace.

With regard to the two first of these charges, they plead, Not Guilty. They are entirely false. No man that ever lived, not John Calvin himself, ever asserted either original sin, or justification by faith, in more strong, more clear and express terms, than Arminius has done. These two points, therefore, are to be set out of the question: In these both parties agree. In this respect, there is not a hair's breadth difference between Mr. Wesley and Mr. Whitefield.

7. But there is an undeniable difference between the Calvinists and Arminians, with regard to the three other questions. Here they divide; the former believe absolute, the latter only conditional, predestination. The Calvinists hold, (1.) God has absolutely decreed, from all eternity, to save such and such persons, and no others; and that Christ died for these, and none else. The Arminians hold, God has decreed, from all eternity, touching all that have the written word, "He that believeth shall be saved: He that believeth not, shall be condemned:" And in order to this, "Christ died for all, all that were dead in trespasses and sins;" that is, for every child of Adam, since "in Adam all died."

8. The Calvinists hold, Secondly, that the saving grace of God is absolutely irresistible; that no man is any more able to resist it, than to resist the stroke of lightning. The Arminians hold, that although there may be some moments wherein the grace of God acts irresistibly, yet, in general, any man may resist, and that to his eternal ruin, the grace whereby it was the will of God he should have been eternally saved.

9. The Calvinists hold, Thirdly, that a true believer in Christ cannot possibly fall from grace. The Arminians hold, that a true believer may "make shipwreck of faith and a good conscience;" that he may fall, not only foully, but finally, so as to perish for ever.

10. Indeed, the two latter points, irresistible grace and infallible perseverance, are the natural consequence of the former, of the unconditional decree. For if God has eternally and absolutely decreed to save such and such persons, it follows, both that they cannot resist his saving grace, (else they might miss of salvation,) and that they cannot finally fall from that grace which they cannot resist. So that, in effect, the three questions come into one, "Is predestination absolute or conditional?" The Arminians believe, it is conditional; the Calvinists, that it is absolute.

11. Away, then, with all ambiguity! Away with all expressions which only puzzle the cause! Let honest men speak out, and not play with hard words which they do not understand. And how can any man know what Arminius held, who has never read one page of his writings? Let no man bawl against Arminians, till he knows what the term means; and then he will know that Arminians and Calvinists are just upon a level. And Arminians have as much right to be angry at Calvinists, as Calvinists have to be angry at Arminians. John Calvin was a pious, learned, sensible man; and so was James Harmens. Many Calvinists are pious, learned, sensible men; and so are many Arminians. Only the former hold absolute predestination; the latter, conditional.

12. One word more: Is it not the duty of every Arminian Preacher, First, never, in public or in private, to use the word Calvinist as a term of reproach; seeing it is neither better nor worse than calling names? -- a practice no more consistent with good sense or good manners, than it is with Christianity. Secondly. To do all that in him lies to prevent his hearers from doing it, by showing them the sin and folly of it? And is it not equally the duty of every Calvinist Preacher, First, never in public or in private, in preaching or in conversation, to use the word Arminian as a term of reproach? Secondly. To do all that in him lies to prevent his hearers from doing it, by showing them the sin and folly thereof; and that the more earnestly and diligently, if they have been accustomed so to do? perhaps encouraged therein by his own example!

From the Thomas Jackson edition of The Works of John Wesley, 1872.



TOPICS: General Discusssion; Religion & Culture; Theology
KEYWORDS: arminian; calvinist
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I found this article kind of amusing because it seems like the term "Arminian" is still thrown around quite a bit (especially on FreeRepublic!) when not many even realize what it means.
1 posted on 11/17/2006 7:33:58 PM PST by DouglasKC
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To: DouglasKC

I have never been angry at the Arminians, but sometimes frustrated :>)


2 posted on 11/17/2006 7:40:33 PM PST by irishtenor (We survived Clinton in the 80s... we can survive her even when her husband is gone.)
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To: DouglasKC
Thanks, I've been here long enough to have read this before but it may be instructional for other Arminians Christians.
3 posted on 11/17/2006 7:42:02 PM PST by BipolarBob
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To: DouglasKC

An attempt to clear up some of the misunderstandings
about Calvinism. This is not meant to be a detailed
doctrinal defense of Calvinism's Doctrines Of Grace.


1) Calvinism and Hyper-Calvinism are poles apart. The terms are not to be used synonymously. A Hyper-Calvinist is not just a zealous Calvinist. We both consider each other to be "mongrel" Calvinists. No man will actually call himself a Hyper-Calvinist.

2) Yes Calvinists are split into several factions. But then so are many such doctrinal schools e.g. Dispensationalism, Church Government, Worship - do we sing only the Psalms or use hymns? Which hymns? Do we use music? Which music? Which set of texts do we base our Bible translation on? Is it the Textus Receptus that is important or the (KJV) AV? or both? etc.

3) The term free will needs to be defined to avoid confusion. Calvinists will either affirm it or deny it, depending on what they think you mean. This sometimes leads to charges of contradictions. Consult the standard Calvinist Confessions e.g. the Westminster Confession of Faith Chapter 9 for a defining of terms.

4) The term free agency is not automatically the same as free will when used by a Calvinist. It is the Calvinist's preferred term to free will. Preferred so as to avoid the confusion spoken of in the above point.

5) Calvinists do believe in man's responsibility, but deny his ability to repent and believe the gospel. The two terms are not synonymous. Calvinists believe that man's inability to repent and believe are caused by his own sin ... not any positive imposition on God's part.

6) Calvinists do not believe that men are puppets or blocks of wood or robots, but responsible beings and are treated as such by God, even when fallen. [more about "puppets"]

7) Calvinists are not fatalists. Calvinists believe that God has ordained the end and also the means to that end. Therefore they do believe in evangelism as the means God uses to fulfill His intention of saving the elect. It is not true to say that Calvinists believe that God saves men without the gospel. Calvinists do believe in prayer.

8) Calvinists do believe that it is the duty of men to repent and believe the gospel. This is one of our quarrels with the Hyper-Calvinists.

9) Calvinists do believe that the gospel is (to quote Calvin) to be preached indiscriminately to the elect and to the reprobate (Commentary on Isaiah 54:13). This is another one of our quarrels with the Hyper-Calvinists.

10) Calvinists do not limit the value or merit or worth of the blood of Christ. They do limit the intention of the blood to save any other than the elect. We are happy enough (as was John Calvin) with the statement that the blood of Christ is sufficient for the whole world but efficient only for the elect.

11) Calvinists do not believe that men are damned without any reference to their sin. God passing by and leaving certain men in their sin is not the same as God damning men by the sheer force of His decree.

12) Calvinists do not just preach on the Five Points and nothing else. At least no more so than Dispensationalists who just preach on prophecy or Pentecostals who just preach on the gifts of the Spirit etc.

13) Calvinists do not read the Five Points into every text of scripture. Many of the major Bible commentaries, beloved and valued by all Christians e.g. Matthew Henry were written by Calvinists.

14) Calvinists do believe that men can resist the Holy Spirit. They believe that even the elect can resist the Holy Spirit, and do - but only up to the time when the Spirit regenerates their heart so that resist Him no more. The non-elect effectively resist Him all their lives.

15) Calvinists do not believe that men are brought kicking and screaming irresistibly to Christ. We believe in irresistible grace. The will is not passed by in salvation. No man ever came to Christ unwillingly, or regretted that he had been brought.

16) Calvinist's do not believe that there are souls out there who want to be saved, but can't be saved because they are not of the elect.

17) Calvinists, being without access to the Lamb's Book of Life, see every man as potentially elect and preach the gospel to him.

18) Calvinists do believe in unconditional election but they do not believe in unconditional salvation. Except a man be born again, he will not enter the kingdom of Heaven (John 3:3) Except he repent, he will perish (Luke 13:3) Except he be converted etc., all these are conditions of salvation.

19) Calvinists do believe that regeneration precedes faith in Christ. We do not confuse the term regeneration with that of justification or salvation. The Spirit of God regenerates the elect sinner enabling him to forsake the deadness of his sin and willingly embrace Christ and so be justified by faith and saved for eternity. Regeneration therefore is not synonymous with justification or salvation any more than conviction of sin is synonymous with conversion to Christ.

20) Perseverance of the saints does not mean that Calvinists believe that they must hang on for dear life without any reference to the keeping power of God. It simply means that we believe that the Christian will prove to be an overcomer in accordance with 1 John 5:4-5 etc.

21) Some Calvinists use the phrase Particular Redemption as opposed to Limited Atonement because they can see how the General Redemptionist position may also be said to limit the atonement, although in a different way (i.e. it does not set out to do all what was intended).

22) Calvinists do not believe that John Calvin is infallible, no more than Methodists believe that John Wesley is infallible or Dispensationalists allowing Schofield or John Darby the final word.

23) While Calvinists believe that saving grace and repentance are the gifts of God, given only to His elect, they do not believe that God exercises faith for them or repents for them. The elect sinner, enabled by the power of God, actually repents and believes for himself.

24) While there can be no real middle ground between the Calvinist position and that of the non Calvinist, yet most Calvinists believe that both sides really do preach the gospel. Despite our differences as to many of the details, a man who preaches that Christ died for the ungodly and that the work was sufficient to save the whosoever who will repent and believe is really preaching the gospel. We rejoice in the gospel preaching of John Wesley just as much as that of George Whitefield, although (naturally) we would hold Whitefield to be the better theologian.

25) There is a difference between a paradox and a contradiction. We know that God is sovereign, yet man is free to follow the dictates of his own will. Where the two lines meet is not for us to say. Calvinist ignorance on the matter is to be excused on the basis of Deuteronomy 29:29

26) Although Calvinists believe that even sinful acts are ordained by God (Ephesians 1:11 / Proverbs 16:4) yet such makes the event certain, but not necessary. This clears God from being the author of sin. This view best explains the Cross (Acts 2:23, 4:27-28 / Luke 22:22).

http://www.inhisword.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=19


4 posted on 11/17/2006 7:59:15 PM PST by Liberal Bob
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To: Alex Murphy

Ping.


5 posted on 11/17/2006 8:07:39 PM PST by ConservativeMind
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To: DouglasKC
I found this article kind of amusing because it seems like the term "Arminian" is still thrown around quite a bit (especially on FreeRepublic!) when not many even realize what it means.

Ditto for the term "Calvinism".

6 posted on 11/17/2006 9:48:01 PM PST by Alex Murphy
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To: Liberal Bob; Alex Murphy; DouglasKC
So my questions would be these:

Are Arminians part of the elect or not?

Do people have to believe that they are part of the elect to be part of the elect?

How does one know that he is part of the elect?

Didn't the Pharisees and Sadducees and their followers believe that they were part of the elect of God?

Did that belief that they were part of the elect help them or hurt them when it came to receiving the words of God that could save them from their sins?

Where are they now as a result of that belief that they were the elect of God and predestined to salvation?

7 posted on 11/18/2006 4:37:34 AM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
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To: All
What Is an Arminian?

Someone from Arminia
8 posted on 11/18/2006 5:50:36 AM PST by escapefromboston (manny ortez: mvp)
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To: Uncle Chip
Are Arminians part of the elect or not?

Those that are save or will be saved before they die are. Salvation is the same no matter what you call yourself or how believe you came to Christ.

Do people have to believe that they are part of the elect to be part of the elect?

NO!

How does one know that he is part of the elect?

You come to Christ.

Didn't the Pharisees and Sadducees and their followers believe that they were part of the elect of God?

The elect were given to Christ before the earth was formed, it does not matter what man thinks of himself. And again some of them were part of the elect and some not, I give you Saul called Paul.

Didn't the Pharisees and Sadducees and their followers believe that they were part of the elect of God?

The Jews of today do, the Muslims do.

Did that belief that they were part of the elect help them or hurt them when it came to receiving the words of God that could save them from their sins?

Why did Christ speak in parables? MARK 4:10 When He was in private, those who were around Him, along with the Twelve, asked Him about the parables. 11 He answered them, "The secret of the kingdom of God has been granted to you, but to those outside, everything comes in parables 12 so that they may look and look, yet not perceive; they may listen and listen, yet not understand; otherwise, they might turn back--and be forgiven. "

Where are they now as a result of that belief that they were the elect of God and predestined to salvation?

I refer you back to your fist question, belief in predestination has nothing to do with salvation.

So I have a question for you. Are you one of the elect?

9 posted on 11/18/2006 9:39:43 AM PST by Liberal Bob
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To: Liberal Bob
To go along with Mark 4 speaking to the Gentiles Paul said.

Rom 11:7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded 8 (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear;) unto this day

10 posted on 11/18/2006 10:44:47 AM PST by Liberal Bob
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To: Liberal Bob
Rom 11:7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

I am part of the church, the ekklesia, the called out ones that Jesus spoke of. Are only the "elect or chosen" saved? What about those who are called and answer the call? Isn't that really what the church is? BTW, the word "election" in the above verse refers those of Israel who received their Messiah as forgiveness of their sins. Those of Israel who did not were blinded.

11 posted on 11/18/2006 1:47:24 PM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
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To: Uncle Chip
I am part of the church, the ekklesia, the called out ones that Jesus spoke of. Are only the "elect or chosen" saved?


Well what did Christ say about it?


John 6:41 The Jews then murmured at him, because he said, I am the bread which came down from heaven. 42 And they said, Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? how is it then that he saith, I came down from heaven? 43 Jesus therefore answered and said unto them, Murmur not among yourselves. 44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. 45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me


What about those who are called and answer the call? Isn't that really what the church is?


And where does this call come from? Yes the Church is the elect.


John 6:65 And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

BTW, the word "election" in the above verse refers those of Israel who received their Messiah as forgiveness of their sins.


Yes and your point? All the elect will come to Christ. All that come to Christ are the elect. Your point please.

Those of Israel who did not were blinded.

Are you saying that because they did not accept Christ they were blinded or are your agreeing that they did not accept Christ because they were blinded. Or maybe you are talking about actual loss of physical sight and not blinded to the truth. Please explain.

It seems you have not read my first post #4 you might want to read it before you ask any more of your questions.

I will ask you one more time a very simple question please be courteous enough to answer. Are you one of the elect that is addressed in the New Testament?

12 posted on 11/18/2006 3:29:05 PM PST by Liberal Bob
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To: Liberal Bob
I will ask you one more time a very simple question please be courteous enough to answer. Are you one of the elect that is addressed in the New Testament?

What you really mean to ask is "are one of the elect that is addressed in Calvin's Institutes of Religion?" Right? ---- the answer to that question is an emphatic: NO.

I believe in the gospel of Jesus Christ, not the gospel according to John Calvin and its false reconstructionism.

No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

And where does it say there that the Father is only going to draw the select few??? It doesn't say anything of the sort. Furthermore, Jesus said that if "I be lifted up from the earth, I will draw ALL men unto me".[John 12:32] How many??? All --- All --- All

So then, when you say that you are one of the elect of Christ, of which Christ are you referring to? The Calvinist Christ who draws only the select few to salvation? or the Biblical Christ who draws ALL men unto Himself because He said He would draw ALL men unto Himself?

13 posted on 11/18/2006 6:01:32 PM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
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To: Uncle Chip
I asked you a question, will you answer it please.

Are you one of the elect that is addressed in the New Testament?

14 posted on 11/18/2006 7:20:33 PM PST by Liberal Bob
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To: Liberal Bob; Uncle Chip
Are you one of the elect that is addressed in the New Testament?

Can we not simply rest with assurance upon the promise of God: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. (John 3:15 KJV)?

Should not the question be simply: Do you believeth in him?

15 posted on 11/18/2006 7:58:19 PM PST by P-Marlowe (LPFOKETT GAHCOEEP-w/o*)
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To: P-Marlowe
Should not the question be simply: Do you believeth in him?

But that is not the question. This is not a trick question, it would not hurt your argument to say yes. Do you see that you are arguing over words that you have come to disagree with because of your hate for a man that is not even in the Bible. Arminianism and Calvinism have the same salvation message of faith and grace they only disagree on how much man and God participate in that salvation.

I can not go to the mountain and spar with satan for 40 days, not even 40 seconds. I will loose. So where does my faith come from? It is not from me, I am too weak, I am not worthy of faith. I do not have the Will to make that decision on my own.

Refusing to answer the question only makes be believe your are ashamed to be one of Christ elect.

2 Tim 3:16 Sola Scriptura

16 posted on 11/18/2006 9:01:39 PM PST by Liberal Bob
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To: Liberal Bob; Uncle Chip
Refusing to answer the question only makes be believe your are ashamed to be one of Christ elect.

Whoa, there cowboy. That is a pretty nasty accusation coming from someone who considers himself "elect", wouldn't you say?

I could say that by refusing to answer my question, it makes it appear that you are ashamed to say you believe in Christ.

But I would not be so presumptuous.

The fact is that the elect are those who are numbered in the "whosoever" in John 3:15.

Those who believe in Christ are the elect. I believe in Christ, therefore I am elect.

I can rest on Christ's promise that whosoever is included in the whosoever in John 3:15 is elect.

Do you believe that? Is that what you are basing your belief that you are elect upon? Belief in Christ?

Or something else? Something additional?

17 posted on 11/18/2006 9:10:49 PM PST by P-Marlowe (LPFOKETT GAHCOEEP-w/o*)
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To: Liberal Bob; P-Marlowe

Discuss the issues all you want, but do NOT make it personal.


18 posted on 11/18/2006 9:19:20 PM PST by Religion Moderator
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To: P-Marlowe
I have answered your question and I believe I have stated my beliefs. And I am pleased that you understand that you are one of the elect. Now that we have that out of the way with at least one of you, we can dispense with term and move on. So without the word 'elect', we still have 'chosen' and 'predestination'. So lets take the word chosen, where do you stand on it's meaning and would you say that you fall within it's meaning? I am referring to it as used in Mark 13:20, it is interchanged in the deferent translations with elect as in Romans 11:5.

To make it clear to you and save you a post I believe the elect or the "whosoever" are chosen. And being one of the whosoevers I am chosen. I believe that you, having received salvation, are one of the chosen or elect. To be elected is to be chosen and to be chosen is to be elected as whosoevers.

Now if I can get you to agree on this we can move on to the big sticky one 'predestination', here we will butt up against 'FREEWILL.'

19 posted on 11/19/2006 12:16:48 AM PST by Liberal Bob
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To: Liberal Bob
Now if I can get you to agree on this we can move on to the big sticky one 'predestination', here we will butt up against 'FREEWILL.'

Why do we have to butt up against "free will." What purpose would be served by that?

Why can't we all simply rejoice that we are saved, that we are chosen, that we are elect, that we are brothers and sisters in Christ? Why must we speculate or argue on these immaterial points. Is it not more important that people simply come to Christ than that they somehow come to some kind of mystical understanding of the reason why?

Has anyone ever been saved by his understanding of predestination? Or are we saved by our faith in Christ?

Where in the bible does it say that if we believe in predestination we are saved? Is that somewhere in the Book of Hezekiah? I musta missed it.

20 posted on 11/19/2006 12:50:43 AM PST by P-Marlowe (LPFOKETT GAHCOEEP-w/o*)
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