Posted on 06/15/2023 11:36:28 PM PDT by ganeemead
It was known since the end of the Cold War and especially 1994 that Russia did not want NATO to expand into former Soviet Republics.
Russia has openly, many times, expressed this concern and we did make this promise to them. Just like we signed a Ballistic Missile Treaty with them and then withdrew. Just like we agreed to a Minsk agreement and then violated it.
Russia knew that a unified Germany would be in NATO. They knew and they accepted NATO Expansion in Eastern Europe.
It wasn’t until 2004 where we pulled a fast one on them with Lithuania, Estonia and Latvia where Russia got pissed.
Then in 2008 when we tried it in the Republic of Georgia they invaded.
Then in Ukraine as we were playing our games there and promised them NATO, they invaded in 2014.
Get this into you skull: NO MAJOR POWER WANTS ANOTHER PLAYING ON THEIR BORDER, NOT EVEN US.
The only reason why we are as aggressive as we are with Russia is because everything is the other way around, i.e. they are a weak conventional force and we think we can just do with them whatever we want. We would never dare do the same in Taiwan and with the PRC.
When Zelensky runs out of Ukrs, he will just use Poles! Then Americans, he can fight forever. Lose a tank, make a call, and get six brand new ones overnight. As long as the pipeline to Washington and the EU is open he can fight till the cows come home. The question is—how long do Americans wish to fight?
The Soviet Empire is gone. The Warsaw Pact is gone.
What you have today is Russia when compared to the US has 55% of our ground forces, 47% of our air forces, 43% of our naval forces, 1 carrier and it’s not even on par with any of our 11 super carriers. Russia has 44% of our population, 40% the number of men reaching military age we do. Russia has less industry, less high tech, and an economy (GDP) <1/10 our size. They have few allies, all of them are weak in every sense and most have their own security issues to where it is very difficult for them to do much in terms of military assistance. Their most powerful and dependable ally would be Belarus, which likely has an inferior military to the Netherlands (one of our weaker NATO allies). Russia relies on conscription and that is usually an issue regards institutional knowledge, discipline and morale for a military. Russia does not have Central and South America to fall back on, an endless supply of bodies. These places routinely become the source for soldiers and even today we are actively recruiting in Columbia, Brazil, etc. for our war in Ukraine. That’s where many of the mercenaries in the worlds largest mercenary force ever assembled come from: https://t.me/TrackAMercChat
The only area where Russia is on an equal footing with us is in terms of their nuclear deterrence. That’s it.
That said, it is precisely because Russia is a weak conventional force, that we are as belligerent with them as we are.
Do you see us acting the same way regards Taiwan and the PRC?
We simply gambled and did not expect Russia to come out of their corner swinging like they did.
We were hoping they would simply acquiesce.
Twenty years ago man. OK, 18 years ago in some cases. It’s a crock.
In this case you have cause and effect reversed. Look at the dates. Russian buildup Nov 1, US talking Nato Dec 9.
Poles and etc didnt and dont agree with you about the “no threat”. They would know that better than anyone.
NATO and neocon lunatics responsible for this **** should burn in hell for it.
You have the White House number ask for Joe.
We offered NATO in October:
That is a fact, and while you are entitled to your opinions, it does not change a fact: https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukrainian-president-zelenskiy-holding-talks-with-biden-adviser-says-2021-12-09/
November the Russian buildup started.
The Russians then engaged us and made many, many public statements about what would result. Sergey Lavrov talked about it until he was blue in the face. We just chose to ignore it.
We simply “casually” told Ukraine that it’s OK for them to come into NATO and our news media carrying the water for this Democrat administration didn’t question what the consequences might be, if this is a prudent decision, if cost/benefit and the assumed risk made any sense.
Just like our media is not holding Biden accountable for what has happened now.
It’s Putin’s fault, even Trump, (((ANYONE))) except their boy Biden. As attitudes and perceptions begin to change and someone will need to be blamed, our media will point the finger at ANYONE except Biden and eventually they will even pin a failure on Mr. Z. This is simply because 5 of the 6 major media conglomerates that control 90% of what you see and hear are aligned with the Democrats, ~85% of all journalists are self professed more liberal minded and vote Democrat. All your economic interests in the West both in the US and EU wanted this and the political class chase these folks. The news media is either outright owned or beholden (advertisement revenue) to these oligarchs and big corporations. The government today has a much greater stake in the media (where I worked we expanded media operations by 300% from 2008 until I retired in 2022) and what you hear and see is influenced both because they grew in their media operations but also became very forward leaning on censorship.
So you get: “Ukraine is winning (for now according to our meda) and this war is anyone except Biden’s fault.”
You will find almost no article linking Biden to the cause of this war, just like you had little media coverage about Burisma and the 17 recordings, with the news media covering the Trump arraignment for hours and with hundreds of articles, pundits, editorials, etc. The media is part of the political and even government apparatus. Because Biden is a Democrat, and he was basically doing what the big corporations and oligarchs wanted, he enjoys a huge media advantage.
***This US administration has caused more death and misery in Europe than anyone else since WWII!***
***This administration has destabilized Europe and caused irreparable damage to NATO, even if that is not discussed today.***
***This administration has cost the US tax payer hundreds of billions when you look at the combined spending and economic effect of this war (sanctions) etc.***
***There will be long term consequences, as Russia will likely arm proxies that mean us harm, you will see an accelerated divestment form the dollar and further formation/development of BRICS.***
This is a stupid war, caused by an administration which gambled, and we’re all paying for it, Europe, Ukraine, the US, Russia, the nations that get their energy or food from Russia and who we tried to coerce into going along with our sanctions...
Abject failure!
If you want to gamble, go do it with your money, your life, don’t force others to pay for your game.
Thank you for your post.
Fall Blau is AGAIN not going according to plan.
This is a sad story.
I have nothing against Ukraine and frankly not even Russia.
Both are people that have something to offer this world.
These are BOTH Christian and European based cultures.
These are BOTH societies with higher literacy rates than we have in the US.
Ukraine: https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/UKR/ukraine/literacy-rate or https://www.trade.gov/market-intelligence/ukraine-international-student-education
Russia: https://www.globaldata.com/data-insights/macroeconomic/literacy-rate-in-russia/ or https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/RUS/russia/literacy-rate
I post this because folks in the US won’t believe it.
We are deep into cliche and the perceptions our idiot media and Hollywood have created. This is not how we Americans see parts of Russia: https://www.google.com/search?newwindow=1&client=firefox-b-1-lm&q=st+petersburg+russia&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiKyuWHp8j_AhXGEFkFHfrFCQcQ0pQJegQIBhAB&biw=1920&bih=937&dpr=1
These are countries (I’m talking about both of them) with nuclear energy, where some of the worlds top scientists come from, that compete with us in a space race and where we are DEPENDENT on them for many years to get our astronauts into space. Russia frankly beat us to the vaccine for Covid, and it is their product which commands most of the worlds market. We rent Ukraine’s AN225 to carry the heaviest loads carried by plane. We ask for help from Russia’s big icebreakers. Some of the classic composers, greatest literature, comes from there.
And now you have these two nations who are more alike than different, tearing each other apart.
If this were two morons killing each other and it had no impact on me (example: Iran-Iraq war), I wouldn’t care. But these are not morons, and this war does impact me.
There are many words you can use to describe this war: stupid, sad, idiotic, irrational, dumb... Even predictable, preventable, unnecessary...
Even funny can describe the war, in a sick sort of way, when looking at the media. When it’s a Democrat and oligarch backed war, suddenly the media is OK with perpetuating it, using mercenaries (we wanted to ban them a few years ago), the extremely high expenditures, the loss of life... Suddenly we don’t have stories about the health effects of DU (Depleted Uranium - ammunition which we are giving the Ukraine), suddenly our media is no longer concerned about folks returning and having PTSD, or the children in Ukraine and how this war is psychologically affecting them. There is a humorous aspect to this war too when you look at our media and how it is covered, in a macabre sense.
This $hit needs to end, but their is no adult out there making them (Russia-Ukraine) settle it. In fact, our senile leader with his entourage of inexperienced child experts (example: Jake Sullivan), one of our top national security advisors, are only fueling this insanity.
| In the News/Activism forum, on a thread titled Russian Army 'Wipes Out' over 600 Ukrainian troops; Zelensky admits 'Counteroffensive Tough' , 2CAVTrooper wrote: |
It was a comedy skit, you know because he was a comedian and he made fun of such things. comedian a professional entertainer who amuses by relating anecdotes, acting out comical situations, engaging in humorous repartee, etc. an actor in comedy.
You must be a closet member of the gaystapo if you’re against him or anyone else making fun of, or ridiculing homos. I bet In Living Color’s “Men on”, and SNL’s “Ambiguously Gay Duo” skits must give you the vapors eh? |
How cute. You are name-calling to try to discourage people from pointing out the obvious - Zelensky wasn't 'joking' and that wasn't a 'comedy' skit - he slept his way to the top as an actor and it shows. *shudder* The guy has substantial practice walking and dancing in high heels - he's good at it.
“That Canuck guy is a, mental midget and batcrap crazy. “
More likely a troll. By now he OBVIOUSLY knows that the West wanted this war as a means to impose sanctions to cripple Russia, resulting in the overthrow of its government. So now he’s left having to be like Hillary, lashing out at all who tell the truth.
There’s a few people around that are either devoid of mental ability or intentional trolls. There’s no way someone who is honest can not see there’s a bigger picture here.
“There’s a few people around that are either devoid of mental ability or intentional trolls.”
In our friend’s case, it’s trolling, as Canadians never hated Russians during the Cold War (how could they, since Americans hated Russians and no Canadian with any self-respect would ever agree with Americans on anything).
I do think a decent number of Americans here simply hate Russians due to the Cold War...in fact, I was like that, until I saw just what NATO became, when they bombed Serbia - something the Neocons STILL have not explained as to why it was needed.
It was at that point that I started to understand the Russian perspective. They CLEARLY have a reason to fear the Neocons, so it’s hard to blame them for trying to keep order in their backyard.
Except when they played them in hockey.
In our friend’s case, it’s trolling, as Canadians never hated Russians during the Cold War (how could they, since Americans hated Russians and no Canadian with any self-respect would ever agree with Americans on anything
This isn’t my perception. Grew up in southern BC, but I’m Albertan to the core. We love our American neighbours and didn’t like Russia during the cold war either. We were lied to a lot though. We have more guns per capita up here than in Texas. We’re a pretty tenacious lot.
The majority of us here want American government to be small, put Americans first and stick to the original constitution. It’d the Canadians out east that are screwed up.
And your proof that he “slept his way to the top” is what exactly?
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.