Senate tosses shutdown hot potato back to House

KETK ^ | September 27, 2013 | KETK

[mdittmar]

President Barack Obama said Friday that new exchanges for private health insurance under Obamacare will open next week as scheduled even if there is a government shutdown, adding: "That's a done deal."

In a congressional version of hot potato, the Senate on Friday passed a short-term spending plan that would prevent a looming government shutdown and sent it to the House for a weekend showdown between Republican tea party conservatives and their more moderate party leaders.

The 54-44 vote on strict party lines came after Senate Democrats pushed through an amendment to restore funding for Obamacare that House Republicans had eliminated in their version of the spending measure, which would prevent the start of a government shutdown on Tuesday.

Now House Speaker John Boehner must decide whether to urge his divided Republican caucus to vote with Democrats to pass the Senate plan, or yield again to a hardline conservative wing that demands making continued government funding contingent on undermining Obamacare.

Cruz loses filibuster bid

President Barack Obama, who has criticized Republicans for their attacks on his signature health care reforms, will make a previously unscheduled public statement at 3:30 p.m. ET on Friday, the White House announced.

[jjsheridan5]

A question. How does Ted win this? Be specific. I have played this scenario out in my head many ways. I can’t see it. Help me see how this ends up anywhere besides a shutdown and republicans looking bad. History has showed in the past what will happen.

One of the most common mistakes is to assume that a future result will necessarily mirror a prior result. In 95, the Republicans "lost" in the shutdown. But there were many differences between then and now. In 95, the economy was in decent shape, which helped Clinton. Now, it is in a depression (in most of the country). In 95, the Republicans were coming off of a historical blowout, and had a large number of vulnerable freshman. Now, this is not the case. In 95, we were heading into a general election (where Democrats tend to do much better). Now, we are heading into an election with no presidential contest.

More importantly than all of that, in 95, the debate was over something distant, something that didn't affect people's daily life. ObamaCare (now partially owned by the GOPe) scares people to death -- independents, republicans and democrats. It is garbage, and everyone knows it is going to affect them personally. This gives the current debate a meaning to every person in this country (barring those exempted). And guess who has emerged as the single person most identified with opposition to the nightmare of McConnellCare? The one you call "Ted".

"History has showed in the past what will happen." No, it has not. History has shown that it can happen, under the right circumstances, but doesn't show what will happen, any more than a baseball game tells you what will happen on the next. This myth has been created by the GOPe in order to convince people that outright opposition to Obama is suicidal, when, in fact, it is anything but.

As far as how does "Ted" win this? He already has. He has identified the true enemies here, and positioned them so they cannot hide behind parliamentary games. He has become the single person most identified with opposition to RinoCare. We can never defeat the Democrats until we have excised the cancerous cockroaches in the GOP. And in that, we are much further ahead than we were even a few days ago.

[CommieCutter]

And I won’t be voting for them. I’m done.

Disrupt, take them out at the ballot box.

No more.

Let the Dems have it. Let it burn.

And no vote for you Dems either. I’ll vote Libertarian or any other non-establishment alternative.

[sickoflibs]

No problem. Bohner wont let us down.

It was a great idea to pick Bohner to be the key point man in this fight. How could a plan like that go wrong??

[chopperjc]

You make some valid observations. First history showed republicans in a much better place in 96 than now. Polling shows that this is a loser. A shutdown will only magnify this.

To say that he has won already is a poor reading in my opinion. I have said this several times tonight but once again if you lose a coup attempt which this is the survivors will end you. Should Senator Cruz fail to defund Obamacare the establishment will end him. You do not whip the house as a junior senator. It is unprecedented. Since he is he better win or the other members will make it there life’s work to screw him.

[Redcloak]

Senate tosses shutdown hot potato back to House

Or put another way: Mitch McConnell and the Senate Republicans run away screaming like frightened, little girls... again.

[AFreeBird]

Yea, cause Boner’s got no balls. And how the heck do you get a boner with no balls anyway?

And we won’t even get into the spine issue.

Sheesh, we are so screwed.

[jjsheridan5]

On your first point, polling, this far out from a mid-term election, isn’t particularly important. If there were to be a shutdown, how that shutdown is handled is much more important than anything else. Not saying it is a guaranteed winner, just that we don’t know anything for certain. Yet the GOPe is trying to convince you that they do know for certain. They are either lying or wrong.

On your second point, this isn’t a coup attempt. “They” have no ability to take down Cruz. This isn’t some banana republic in Africa (yet?). No matter how this pans out (assuming he doesn’t do anything stupid, which would be very much out of character), he now has one of the safest seats in the Senate. More importantly, he has a fierce, knowledgeable following among those that know that we have to stop playing defense, and start playing offense. He has emerged as a leader that people will follow. As an aside, that is one thing that the GOPe doesn’t understand, and the Democrats do. If you are continually on the offensive, you only need to win a handful of times to come out ahead. But if you are always on the defense, you have to win just about every time.

More to the point, how exactly will the GOPe “end him”. He is beyond there arrows at this point. Right now, virtually every one of the GOPe (in the Senate) is in serious danger of being primaried. Even should they hold out in the primary, they are so weakened that any decent challenger would beat them in the general (with the except of a few, in very republican states). It seems to me that he is much closer to ending them, than they are to ending him.

I will grant that whipping the house as a junior senator is somewhat unprecedented. But maybe someone should have done this long ago? Either way, he is in a very safe seat (almost unbeatable, really), is a natural leader and will have a dedicated following, both at the grassroots level, and within Washington, and there is not a thing that the GOPe can do about it. I stand by my contention that he has already won.

I know that the parallel can be made to Palin. But there was one important distinction. As much as I admire Palin, she was vulnerable because she comes across as flighty (her way of speaking really rubs some people the wrong way, and a lot of people just saw her as stupid). This is by no means an insult to her, she is one of the most courageous politicians this country has seen. But the Democrats and GOPe could spin her as stupid (and other things), and her manner of speech hurt her. They will have a much more difficult time spinning Cruz, who has no such vulnerability.

[St_Thomas_Aquinas]

He's already being pilloried from the floor of the senate by republicans. Do you think he cares? Do you think the Texans that elected him care? He's going to be up their noses for at LEAST the next 5 years. There is NOTHING that anyone can do about that.

It's a beautiful thing. And, oh yeah, he's now polling #1 for president.

I bet that has the GOP's attention.

[riri]

It is time for scorched Earth.

Exactly.

Whatever the strategy has been up until now, it's an abysmal failure. I can hardly even use my imagination and conjure up a WORSE set of circumstances than we find ourselves in.

Go for broke. Toss the dice. Brace for impact. See what happens.

[St_Thomas_Aquinas]

Then shouldn’t the House stake out a position and not change? Send it back to the Senate as many times as it takes. Fund the government, not Obamacare. The people will figure it out eventually.

We hold all the cards. Screw you Obama.

[St_Thomas_Aquinas]

I just do not see how he gets the president to defund his signiture legislation.

The House doesn't have to do anything, and Obamacare doesn't get funded. We hold ALL the cards. The government gets nothing without House funding.

Government is HIS religion, not ours.

Tell Obama, "Figure out how to fund it yourself. Why don't you hold a bake sale?"

All it takes is an ounce of courage.

Past generations stood up to the Nazis. We can stand up to a tin pot doofus.

[John Galt's cousin]

“Then shouldn’t the House stake out a position and not change? Send it back to the Senate as many times as it takes. Fund the government, not Obamacare.

“The people will figure it out eventually.”

_________________________________________________

What would happen if the House sent numerous specific bills to the Senate, but none of them funded obammycare? Let the Senate and Bronco Bama choose which parts of the federal government go without funding.

The middle ground may be to sent a compromise bill on obammcare - delay it for s year and require ALL federal employees, including the entire executive branch to use oobammycare.

[chopperjc]

How will the GOP establishment end him? After this is over, if he loses, nobody will fund him, nobody will work with him and then the process stories and whatever skeletons are out there will come out. It really isn’t that hard. Especially when it is your own people doing it to you.

As far as polling goes I am specifically speaking of polling related to a shutdown. It is massively unpopular. You barely get a majority of the Republican Party. Obviously independent and Dems against.

I know kind of cool shutting it down. Long term the numbers say it is bad.

If you think this is the principled place to take a stand I am not going to argue the point. I am just not sure it plays the way you want when half your own party is against you.

[chopperjc]

Yeah I have read that: it would be great if true. The facts say different. To not fund Obamacare means you have to shut the government down. The Dems are not going to fund the gov with an Obamacare exemption. The senate just proved that.

Ok so lets shut it down. Fine. Only a few problems with that. Half your own party is against that. Polling shows barely a majority of republicans want a shutdown. More than 1/2 of the republican senators voted for cloture. So the house shuts it down.

Do you think Obama comes crawling saying please mr republican fund our government, you can defund Obamacare just please let us back in? We may not like him or what he stands for but to dismiss him as a politician I will not do. 1st dem elected twice with over 50% of vote since FDR. You may hate him but I do not underestimate him. He has no elections left, he has a majority in polling and in senate. The house is fractured.

I am not against anyone taking a principled stand but to think you are in the drivers seat is a little naive and shortsighted. I doubt the party will hold let alone the country.

[itssme]

I agree with you...defeatism is a lousy way to go through life. George Washington lost many a battle, until he won the war. Folks have to learn how to take loses, and continue to fight in the process. Pick yourself up, dust yourself off and continue to fight...keep your mind on the positive, and don’t waddle in the negative. Difficult, but not impossible to achieve.

[SunkenCiv]

Thanks mdittmar.

Obama said Friday that new exchanges for private health insurance under Obamacare will open next week as scheduled even if there is a government shutdown...

[RedMDer]

Only Obama and the rats are calling for a shutdown.

[St_Thomas_Aquinas]

Half your own party is against that.

What party do you belong to?

[jimsin]

Jim Robinson!
YEP A GLARING OMISSION....

[jimsin]

YEP MARK LEVIN...THE GREAT ONE..!
YEP A GLARING OMISSION....