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EXCLUSIVE: Fear of being committed may have caused Connecticut gunman to snap
FoxNews.com ^ | 12-18-2012 | Jana Winter

Posted on 12/18/2012 2:34:55 PM PST by servo1969

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To: fso301

Agree. It’s past time we all cut each other a generous length of slack.


101 posted on 12/18/2012 4:19:03 PM PST by Resettozero
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To: sarasota
Joshua Flashman, an acquaintance of the Lanza family -- assuming he's real, and not just a name some prankster is hiding behind.

There's also a series of cult books about a fictional 19th century adventurer named Flashman, so my first thought was it was a prank.

102 posted on 12/18/2012 4:21:41 PM PST by x
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To: Polynikes

yikes, they do not have the same liability immunity.

if the drug IS the cause or even contributed, then you have CRIMINAL liability for the suits.


103 posted on 12/18/2012 4:22:00 PM PST by longtermmemmory (VOTE! http://www.senate.gov and http://www.house.gov)
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To: DBrow
Now, though, medical issues cannot be discussed with parents once the kid turns 18 (like a psychologist or psychiatrist can no longer chat with parents). Financial issues likewise, the kid must handle that too. Bank accounts become viewable only by the kid.

Doesn't matter if a parent is paying for their kid's college, he doesn't have the right to manage the account. A library won't tell a parent what library book the kid has on reserve so they can't pick it up for them on the way home from work. We can thank the libs for all this. It's the libs who have the blood of those little children on their hands.

104 posted on 12/18/2012 4:22:33 PM PST by bgill (We've passed the point of no return. Welcome to Al Amerika.)
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To: DBrow
He maybe could buy a long gun but a 20 yo can’t buy a handgun.

Which is probably why he had his older brother's ID on him.

105 posted on 12/18/2012 4:24:27 PM PST by bgill (We've passed the point of no return. Welcome to Al Amerika.)
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To: Prince of Space
“That “uncle” is a fraud and has been discredited, AFAIK.”

Ok maybe so maybe not. The only ones I see disputing/speculating are the DU fellows. Even Snopes who I have my doubts about sometimes haven’t chimed in yet.Some reports have been apparently “disappeared” without a vociferous and prominent retraction/denial given the high profile nature of this incident
http://www.nyctn.com/a376622-exclusive-nancy-lanza-feared-son-adam-was-getting-worse-told-friend-he-was-burning-himself-with-a-lighter-and-that-she-was-losing-him

106 posted on 12/18/2012 4:25:34 PM PST by Polynikes (Hakkaa Palle)
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To: AppyPappy
Playing video games in your mom’s basement doesn’t exactly sound like a lake of eternal fire.

God, Who does not exist in his previous thinking, wouldn't do such a thing to him because God, Who he didn't believe in, is Love...or some such non-reasoning.
107 posted on 12/18/2012 4:25:44 PM PST by Resettozero
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To: SoldierDad
I saw another guess that he was abused there.Sounds crazy but I learned a long time ago never try to figure out a mentally ill person.My sister was paranoid schizophrenic.She used to be my best friend.She was dangerous only to me.Her mind went when she was 32.
108 posted on 12/18/2012 4:26:27 PM PST by fatima (Free Hugs Today :))
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To: servo1969

I believe this could be it.

Does anyone remember the movie “A Beautiful Mind”? I lived with a man with a severe psychosis - that movie kept bringing moments to me that I lived through. It’s the telephone scene that brings back the real memories - anyone who knows someone will is mentally ill knows the trauma that occurs when the loved one finally says, that’s it - and gets on the phone to call the ambulance or police or whatever. They can go berserk.

Even if the ill person has good experiences at the hospital (and they often do) if they are really in a psychotic break they can go wild and get very, very violent and irrational when you lift that telephone. Seems mom was at a “telephone” moment, figuratively.


109 posted on 12/18/2012 4:27:03 PM PST by I still care (I miss my friends, bagels, and the NYC skyline - but not the taxes. I love the South.)
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To: GVnana

I make a big deal because he’s verbally abusive to my parents..they’re scared of him & walk on eggshells around him in their own house.
I pray it never escalates but my parents are not getting any younger & hate to see a man child ruining what should be happy years.
My Mom is a nervous wreck & my Dad is in denial about him & is becoming more sad/withdrawn.
I just feel bad for my parents...


110 posted on 12/18/2012 4:27:11 PM PST by rainee (Her)
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To: longtermmemmory
The phrase “depraved indifference” would seem to apply and I am not trying to quote Law & Order.
111 posted on 12/18/2012 4:29:34 PM PST by Polynikes (Hakkaa Palle)
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To: rainee

I’m sorry.

Blessings on you and your folks.


112 posted on 12/18/2012 4:30:33 PM PST by combat_boots (The Lion of Judah cometh. Hallelujah. Gloria Patri, Filio et Spiritui Sancto!)
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To: allmendream
A good gun safe cannot be broken into or picked by a young video game playing psychotic med taking doofus.

Given enough time and knowing his mother, he could have figured out the combination or found where she had hidden the combination. He would know numbers she'd use like birthdays and anniversaries. Being the genius he was an a computer geek, it would be easy enough to set up a camera pointed at the safe. It could be he was refusing to take his meds.

113 posted on 12/18/2012 4:31:12 PM PST by bgill (We've passed the point of no return. Welcome to Al Amerika.)
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To: fatima

I’m sorry.

Blessings.


114 posted on 12/18/2012 4:32:38 PM PST by combat_boots (The Lion of Judah cometh. Hallelujah. Gloria Patri, Filio et Spiritui Sancto!)
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To: servo1969
One of the strangest most scary days of my life went like this:

Looking for a room as I was going to nursing school( my second degree back a long time ago). We( was with a friend) go to this home and it's dark, shaded weird windows) some broken, and smells of urine) and hear a television turned up and all way.It was the fuzzy sound when the TV is not on a channel but she insists the TV is on the right channel when my friend attempts to touch the TV.

She had six kids and was scared thinking we were"the fuzz or the social workers." Thus the reason it took her five minutes to answer the door.( Oh I looked in the home, and I won't go into detail of the ,"home," It was spooky weird)

It's dark inside, all windows are blacked out because she's telling us there's demons. I didn't notice at first but my friend has me back away from her. She's( the lady) slamming something into the couch over and over again.

My eyes adjust to the darkness and we both realize she's stabbing the couch over and over with a kitchen knife, a big kitchen knife

We skeedaddle but not before I call the social workers. After all she has six kids right? So I get phone calls from her for over a week threatening my life as she knows I'm the one who called the social workers. I record the messages of course and give them to the social workers but for some odd reason they can do nothing. See, she's a black woman with six kids, HUD housing and just needs her anti psychotic meds and I'm just over reacting( pretty much told me I was racist in so many words).

About three weeks later she was being evicted from the apartments because she held the manager at knife point because he called the cops on her as she was threatening the neighbors with the knife in front of her six kids.

The social workers found her a better home with three bedrooms for her kids and all charges dropped. I had asked why, and again I was over reacting; "the woman just needed her medications and a better home to raise her kids right.

Yes, still shaking my head but this happened, and this lame excuse for this Lanza episode is probably the truth. Sad thing is this probably happens more often but of course 26 children and elementary school teachers aren't murdered, just one at a time. I have no idea of stats, probably buried in reports somewhere. Best place to be in America is broke, on welfare with a dozen kids, a minority and a knife in your hand while not taking the meds so the demons can talk to them easier without that"fuzzy" TV interference.

The end

115 posted on 12/18/2012 4:37:08 PM PST by Karliner ( Jeremiah 29:11, Romans 8:28, Romans 8:38"...this is the end of the beginning."WC)
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To: lonevoice
how on earth did he have access to all her weapons and her car?

You act like he was an outsider who was never inside the house so knew nothing that was going on in it. Sure, kids never sneak around their parents' room. Sure, being a computer geek, he'd never snoop on her computer or listen in on phone calls or take a peek at the mail. Maybe he had access to her car because he'd blown her face off so couldn't tell him he couldn't borrow the keys. Maybe he had access to her weapons because he'd planned this for a while and began the his morning while she was still asleep in bed.

116 posted on 12/18/2012 4:37:21 PM PST by bgill (We've passed the point of no return. Welcome to Al Amerika.)
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To: servo1969

Larry Kudlow is running this story on CNBC right now


117 posted on 12/18/2012 4:39:32 PM PST by PMAS (All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing)
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To: SoldierDad

Bingo.

My thoughts exactly.


118 posted on 12/18/2012 4:41:16 PM PST by txmissy
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To: allmendream

It’s easy to gain access to a safe if you live in the same house and it gets opened regularly.

A tiny camera or fingerprint dust could easily be used to find the code.

Or, if the safe doesn’t have a lockout feature someone could simply try every combination for several days while the mom isn’t home.


119 posted on 12/18/2012 4:44:37 PM PST by varyouga
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To: Karliner

Wow. Just wow.

The system is so screwed up. Almost beyond repair.


120 posted on 12/18/2012 4:45:36 PM PST by txmissy
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To: fatima

Mental health issues are extremely difficult to deal with, let alone understand. I’m very sorry for your own experiences with such a devastating illness. ((((HUGS))))


121 posted on 12/18/2012 4:47:17 PM PST by SoldierDad (Proud dad of an Army Soldier who has survived 24 months of Combat deployment.)
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To: varyouga
It is also easy to figure out if someone has been messing with your gun safe.

My point is that she failed in her responsibility to keep her firearms out of the hands of a son she knew to be psycho.

Do you propose she should have moved her guns off the premesis? Or just not bothered with any security measures at all - becuase hypothetically any security measure can be eventually overcome?

122 posted on 12/18/2012 4:49:36 PM PST by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: combat_boots

((((Hugs))))


123 posted on 12/18/2012 4:53:01 PM PST by fatima (Free Hugs Today :))
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To: SE Mom; penelopesire; thouworm

Thank you for the ping.

If Nancy was trying to have him committed, what resources would she utilize? If she was volunteering at the elementary school and good friends with school professionals, would not it seem logical she would seek their expertise? Perhaps the elementary school professionals were assisting in a mental health evaluation/intervention.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/14/justice/connecticut-school-shooting-psychologist/index.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+rss%2Fcnn_topstories+%28RSS%3A+Top+Stories%29

Sherlach, 56, was an expert in psychology, having earned her undergraduate degree in that subject at SUNY Cortland and a master’s degree at Southern Connecticut State University.

Before becoming a school psychologist, she worked as a rehabilitation assistant at a psychiatric facility, at a group home for disabled adults and as a community mental health placement specialist.

Her experience in education included stints in the Redding, North Haven and New Haven public school systems before landing at Sandy Hook Elementary in 1994. During her time in Newtown, Sherlach kept busy as a member of numerous groups such as the district conflict resolution committee, safe school climate committee, crisis intervention team and student instructional team.


124 posted on 12/18/2012 4:54:07 PM PST by maggief
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To: allmendream
If she felt her gun safe was not in a secure location where he could not work at it until he opened it - then she needed to move it to a secure location - or store her firearms elsewhere.

Now you are admitting storing guns in a home safe may not classify as secure storage. That's not what you wrote previously. In post #35 of this thread you wrote:

A good gun safe cannot be broken into or picked by a young video game playing psychotic med taking doofus.
FYI, the steel plate in most consumer grade gun safes is not very thick. A quality consumer gun safe will have 8 gauge plate which is just 4.37 millimeters thick. The contents of most gun safes can be accessed fairly quickly with an inexpensive circular saw and metal cutting blades by cutting away the roof, or side walls.

For less than $50 at Harbor Freight he could by a circular saw and pack of metal cutting blades. Hearing protection and goggles may push the tab to $50. He also could have dipped into his allowance and bought Harbor Freight's purpose built metal saw for $100 that will cut up to 7mm steel plate.

Assuming the mom had a safe, if he really wanted to get in and knew his mom was going out shopping for 4 hours, he could have quite a surprise waiting for her when she returned home.

A consumer grade safe may be a safer storage spot but it cannot be considered safe storage when a clever but disturbed person has unsupervised access to the house.

125 posted on 12/18/2012 4:58:30 PM PST by fso301
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To: allmendream
My point is that she failed in her responsibility to keep her firearms out of the hands of a son she knew to be psycho.

Give it a rest until you know the whole story. There are many ways that he could have gained access from even a dedicated gun owner such as yourself. Whatever mistakes she made, she paid for it with her life.

126 posted on 12/18/2012 5:01:55 PM PST by AmusedBystander (The philosophy of the school room in one generation will be the philosophy of government in the next)
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To: allmendream
“It is also easy to figure out if someone has been messing with your gun safe.”

Explain. I don't see how this is possible without cameras or fingerprinting. Maybe leaving a wheel safe on a certain digit each time would work.

Gun safes are intended for thieves, small children or maybe to stop acts of passion. They are useless for securing something from a calculating adult that lives in the same house.

127 posted on 12/18/2012 5:02:04 PM PST by varyouga
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To: SoldierDad

We had her committed 3 times.The first time My sister and I went with the police with a court order from a judge.The police sent me up the apartment steps.She opened the door and I told her she had to go.She said”Your going to rot in hell”.They put me in the paddy wagon with her.She whipped out a wig,boots,makeup and by the time we got to the hospital she looked better than me.The Doctor took one look at her and said it was a waste of time because they could only keep her 3 days.He said look at her:)Had to let it go.


128 posted on 12/18/2012 5:02:19 PM PST by fatima (Free Hugs Today :))
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To: fso301
Well either way she got outsmarted and outmaneuvered by a booger eating psychotic who got her guns and shot her in the face with them.

Anything he could have done (cameras, print dust, etc) to figure out the combo - she could have done to figure out he was messing with her safe.

I lock my door. Sure someone could just kick down the door - but I still lock it.

However you think it would be best for her to meet her responsibility to make sure her firearms didn't fall into the hands of a psychotic - my point is that she FAILED in that responsibility.

129 posted on 12/18/2012 5:03:55 PM PST by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: varyouga

I don’t know about useless - a locked door is useless if your philosophy is that someone can kick down the door.

However she needed to meet her responsibility to make sure her firearms didn’t fall into the hands of a psycho - my point is that she FAILED in that responsibility.


130 posted on 12/18/2012 5:06:19 PM PST by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: fatima

Our society does not handle mental health issues well. We need change. Unfortunately, those currently in control want to focus on banning firearms instead. Sad.


131 posted on 12/18/2012 5:07:30 PM PST by SoldierDad (Proud dad of an Army Soldier who has survived 24 months of Combat deployment.)
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To: Alaska Wolf

........thank you, thank you, thank you re your statement “Where the hell was his father?”

Our society “glorifies” the “single mom”. BS!....a “single mom” is a tragedy and evidence of failure in our liberalistic, no accountability society! I think the vast majority of freepers would agree that an active father, even in a divorced environment, is what a single mom needs but you NEVER hear this! For decades, liberals hate and despise and rascalize fathers and the liberal courts buy in on it. AND, too many fathers getting a divorce run up the surrender flag at the first shot and just abandon the kid to a single mom with tragic consequences. I know I had a brother in law that did exactly this and just destroyed his son. I on the other hand, just in contrast, fought both of my x wives every step of the way for 10 years each! Result: Two wonderful, hard working successful kids. One a CPA, one an executive, both college grads. My point?! I stayed involved and active and made sure that both kids always knew that Dad was there too and that what I thought ALSO mattered. I was not a checkbook dad!

So, our completely out of balance SOCIETY, including sitting on the sidelines conservatives that let liberals get away with their liberalism, or go along with it to be cool, contributed their fair share to killing those kids just as sure as the sun rises tomorrow. Adam, his dad, mom, liberals, politicians, the ACLU, the dimocratic party, MSM, the liberal teachers who refuse to even consider arming themselves against maniacs and who have I left out.................are all, in varying degrees, responsible for those 20 kids being slaughtered!

Back when mom, pop, and two to three kids had supper together every night with the gd TV turned off and no such things as video games, this bs did not happen! My kids NEVER got to watch TV Monday through Friday EVER! Fathers are IMPORTANT and I hope all freepers help keep that argument going as just one argument to throw in the face of the coming onslaught by the gun grabbers! Had a strong Dad been involved in Adams life,and HELPING the single mom every way he could, and in some cases whether she liked it or not, this would not have happened, period!


132 posted on 12/18/2012 5:11:32 PM PST by Cen-Tejas (it's the debt bomb stupid!)
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To: maggief

Now we now what happen .
It looks like mom
Was trying to commit her son .
She turned her friends at the school
Namely the school
Principal and counselor !
These two people are seen arguing with this kid the day before !!
Nancy volunteered last year in the kindergarten so the 1 st graders shot were her kids last year !
He snapped and seeked revenge on everyone involved !


133 posted on 12/18/2012 5:12:51 PM PST by ncalburt (Axelrod Psych OPS has gone to 24/7 non stop - "The election is over " status until Nov)
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To: bgill

“Doesn’t matter if a parent is paying for their kid’s college, he doesn’t have the right to manage the account.”

Or see the grades, bgill!


134 posted on 12/18/2012 5:19:29 PM PST by DBrow
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To: bgill

Correct. You could not find out what classes your kids have in college, how much they owe or anything like that. Thank the ACLU and libs for all this. Remember, you can’t find out if your 14 year old had an abortion. We should teach 10 year olds all about sex and show them how. We can’t keep them from all these things but the Left throws a fit because a 20 year old, crazy or not had a gun. They have created all this. They are the ones who have driven the wedge between parents and children. They are the ones who have driven the wedge between men and women, husbands and wives and driven this society into the ground.


135 posted on 12/18/2012 5:20:46 PM PST by taterjay
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To: GlockThe Vote

From interviews I saw, she was an excellent mom.

She held the tiger by the tail for a long time and then realized that he could not be helped by her anymore. He was burning himself...and needed help beyond her capacity and ability.

She knew he was a danger to himself and I wonder if she knew he was an evil danger to others as well.

God rest her soul. It’s wrong to condemn her.


136 posted on 12/18/2012 5:31:12 PM PST by SaraJohnson
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To: allmendream

These discussions are endless and almost useless. For example, she did keep guns locked up except 1 by her bed for protection. A discussion between them escalates into argument or a threat to mom’s life. She goes to bedroom to get the weapon to defend herself and son gets to her before she can defend. He takes said weapon from her and kills her. That is hypothetical but as likely a scenario as any other. It is a tragedy without clear answers at the moment at least.


137 posted on 12/18/2012 5:32:17 PM PST by taterjay
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To: allmendream

I know more than a few people who bought a safe, then never got a locksmith to change the combo from the “factory default”.

The factory default is used by the salesmen so they only need to know one or two. If you know them you can try them to see if it works.


138 posted on 12/18/2012 5:36:09 PM PST by DBrow
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To: Alaska Wolf
Where the hell was his “father”?

Off living his own life with another wife.

139 posted on 12/18/2012 5:36:40 PM PST by presently no screen name
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To: Amberdawn
We need to send congratulations, along with Christmas cards to the ACLU in honor of their murderous stupidity over denying this mother a way of easily committing her son.

NO. We need to BAN the ACLU.

140 posted on 12/18/2012 5:38:06 PM PST by presently no screen name
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To: allmendream
As bad as it was for them, one of my friend's other brothers-in-law was talking to his wife on the phone as he drove there from the airport. All of a sudden he hears multiple gunshots, screams, and the phone drops to the floor.

It was a couple of minutes before everything calmed down enough that his wife was able to get back on the line. I cannot even begin to fathom what was going through his mind for those minutes, which probably seemed like eternity.

141 posted on 12/18/2012 5:40:16 PM PST by Stonewall Jackson ( "I must study politics and war that my sons may have liberty to study mathematics and philosophy.")
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To: Amberdawn
We need to send congratulations, along with Christmas cards to the ACLU in honor of their murderous stupidity over denying this mother a way of easily committing her son.

POST OF THE YEAR!!!

142 posted on 12/18/2012 5:42:28 PM PST by usconservative (When The Ballot Box No Longer Counts, The Ammunition Box Does. (What's In Your Ammo Box?))
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To: taterjay

It is strange to me that he tried to buy a gun a few days ahead of time, knowing there were guns in the house. If he had easy access to guns at home, why would he try to buy one, knowing he risked discovery of his plan by doing so?

I wonder if he created a ruse to get his mother to access the guns at home, and his ruse worked—then the killing started.
Just a thought...


143 posted on 12/18/2012 5:45:09 PM PST by Radagast the Fool
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To: taterjay

But you left out .
The kid then goes to school to seek revenge on his Mom ‘s friends who are involved in the commitment idea .
The principal and guidance counselor .
Then he decided to kill the kids his Mom lavished attention on last year then on the kindergarden who now in the first grade.


144 posted on 12/18/2012 5:48:06 PM PST by ncalburt (Axelrod Psych OPS has gone to 24/7 non stop - "The election is over " status until Nov)
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To: Radagast the Fool

We have fingerprint technology with gun safes now — we ourselves are thinking of obtaining one to store our guns, as we have an autistic son who is now 11.

Would have perhaps helped this mother.

I still can’t figure out why she would take him to a shooting range. Just sounds a bit extreme to be teaching those skills to a kid like this.


145 posted on 12/18/2012 5:49:03 PM PST by LibsRJerks
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To: Sarah Barracuda

Exactly. This isn’t the time for idle speculation. This is the time to get organized and meet the statists head-on.

Molon Labe!


146 posted on 12/18/2012 6:04:38 PM PST by absalom01 (You should do your duty in all things. You cannot do more, and you should never wish to do less.)
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To: allmendream

He broke into a locked school! Never say never when it comes to a madman. They connive and watch your every move.


147 posted on 12/18/2012 6:05:49 PM PST by presently no screen name
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To: bgill
Which is probably why he had his older brother's ID on him.

More proof that the killer didn't just suddenly snap, but had carefully planned the massacre.

148 posted on 12/18/2012 6:10:45 PM PST by Alaska Wolf (Carry a Gun, It's a Lighter Burden Than Regret)
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To: SaraJohnson

Or alternatively she drove him to madness through well-intentioned but destructive over-protection and by presenting him as a danger to others and to himself and by giving him dangerous medications.

Being dead doesn’t make her perfect or a saint. What evidence we have (medicine, speaking ill of him to his babysitter and giving him access to weapons doesn’t indicate great parenting)

There is no actual evidence that he posed any sort of threat to anyone until he was faced with the prospect of being locked up and put under state care for life for being different.


149 posted on 12/18/2012 6:11:04 PM PST by LastNorwegian
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To: presently no screen name

That too....


150 posted on 12/18/2012 6:13:39 PM PST by Amberdawn
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