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$2.9 Billion Solar Roofs Program Proposed For California
Environment California ^ | December 13, 2005

Posted on 12/13/2005 5:25:39 PM PST by calcowgirl

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To: JamesP81; GSlob
"These batteries don't last forever, and will have to be replaced."

This is likely one of the least significant elements of this question. The lead/acid batteries last a long time if they are not deep-discharged (more than 50%) and checked for water level at proper intervals. When they fail, the lead is reused to make new batteries, so there is little waste there.

Lithium ion batteries have a better size to capacity ratio than lead/acid batteries, but cost so much more that they could never pay for themselves under any known scenario. They also present a more grave waste disposal/recycling problem than lead, which is almost inert in it's metalic state.

We have been using a one KW system at our ranch for five years, that supplies all the power we need for everything except running the pumps and wells, for which we use IC engines. The system has been running continuously without any malfunction, and the batteries are still at about 98% capacity, due to careful control of charge and float voltages, to keep the batteries cool in the summer (which is when most damage is done).

41 posted on 12/13/2005 8:05:21 PM PST by editor-surveyor (Atheist and Fool are synonyms; Evolution is where fools hide from the sunrise)
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To: calcowgirl
I'm not following you on the redistribution. It sounded like the poor would be unaffected.

1) From the proposal: Utility customers taking service on the California Alternative Rates for Energy (CARE) should be exempted from the costs of this program as a matter of equity

That's permissive suggestion, as opposed to regulatory language. Translation: We suggest you do so but we acknowledge insufficient funding levels if you do. The regulatory language immediately preceding reads : "component would be funded using distribution revenues from all gas and electric customers

2) From LIHEAP: The utilities report that more than one million low-income customers meet the CARE eligibility criteria but are not currently participating in the program. December 7, 2005

42 posted on 12/13/2005 8:32:58 PM PST by Amerigomag
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To: Amerigomag

Thanks for that. I have much to learn in the area of energy. I do know the regulation business at length (in another industry sector) and agree with your "should/would" observation.


43 posted on 12/13/2005 8:37:51 PM PST by calcowgirl
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To: SampleMan
The absolute most efficient household solar power available has nothing to do with electricity. Heat collection boxes for hot water is the best bang for the buck and amazingly low tech. Works great in sunny climes, such as southern Cal. They they want to do something meaningful, they would require these on new homes or when a new waterheater is purchased.

This is the system my uncle is using. It's solely for his hot water heater. Works fairly well too.
44 posted on 12/13/2005 8:38:28 PM PST by JamesP81
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To: SampleMan
Heat collection boxes for hot water is the best bang for the buck and amazingly low tech.

Rooftop hot water heaters used to be commonplace in Florida--as late as the 1950's. Then they went away during the era of dirtcheap energy.

45 posted on 12/13/2005 8:40:45 PM PST by hinckley buzzard
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To: NormsRevenge
China may be where they can manufacture it cheap in bulk

Probably not.

On average, the solar panel export industry in China has grown by 25 percent each year for the past 10 years. But while the country's growth rates appear to be very high, they are actually lower than worldwide demand growth rates of solar panels and products.

One of the main reasons for this is a severe lack of solar cells, which is the result of a worldwide shortage of hyperpure or semiconductor-grade silicon, the base material for solar cells.

46 posted on 12/13/2005 8:49:29 PM PST by Amerigomag
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To: calcowgirl
It is entirely possible that the time is right for government action in bringing alternative energy applications across the threshold. Although as a conservative I recoil at government intrusion into my life, as a realist I recognize that without government intervention going back to the 19th century America would never have developed as fast as it did.

Without government money there would have been no canals to open the trans-Appalachian west; No transcontinental railroads until much much later; No commercial air travel (no airports, no aviation R&D); No Interstate Highway system; No nuclear generating plants producing electricity.

None of these enterprises made a profit initially, and many banks went broke funding growth in the 19th century. But we built this country on government assuming the risks, speculation and boom-bust cycles, and bad debt, for anyone who wants to know.

Maybe the time for government to act and pump life into the alternative energy field has arrived. If the people of California want to be the benefactors of the new energy economy, I say, Thanks.

47 posted on 12/13/2005 8:58:23 PM PST by hinckley buzzard
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To: Amerigomag; NormsRevenge
NR may be remembering some excerpts I posted, one of which was from this article:
The governor specifically praised a solar chip from SunPower, a solar company in Sunnyvale, California. “This is the future, ladies and gentleman,” he said.

The chip, designed in California and manufactured in China, is “an amazing China-California success story” that represents the future, Mr. Schwarzenegger said.

Shareholders were made very happy when Schwarzenegger's promotion that day more than doubled the value of their share price, days before their IPO. See more snips here
48 posted on 12/13/2005 9:05:08 PM PST by calcowgirl
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To: calcowgirl

"Million Solar Roofs"?

I wonder if this is inspired by george bush's thousand points of light theme?


49 posted on 12/13/2005 10:16:58 PM PST by NormsRevenge (Semper Fi ... Monthly Donor spoken Here. Go to ... https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: NormsRevenge
LOL. You may be on to something! It was initially co-authored by both Murray(D) and our New not-so-conservative Congressman John Campbell (R). And with Arnold's initiation, it certainly has that (R) behind it.

By the way--we're gonna help get Solar installed in Mexico, too! That along with what appears to be a quasi-merger of our school system! Check out the Governor's latest Radio Address.

(snip)

We saw two classes linked by videoconference where the students talked back and forth, shared ideas and improved their language skills. These are the first two sister schools but we are going to expand this program to as many schools as possible so more children from California and Mexico can learn from each other.

As we find new ways to bring the leaders of tomorrow together we are also working hard to solve the challenges we face today, challenges like expanding our economy.

That's why it's important to speed up the movement of goods across our border and build new economic partnerships like the one we're creating in high tech, between our Silicon Valley and the Silicon Border, or the steps we're taking to bring California solar technology to Baja to help them meet their energy needs.


50 posted on 12/13/2005 10:27:47 PM PST by calcowgirl
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To: calcowgirl

..we are going to expand this program to as many schools as possible so more children from California and Mexico can learn from each other.

--

Oh joy. :\

looks like the incubator for a merged NA is set to High..


51 posted on 12/13/2005 10:32:25 PM PST by NormsRevenge (Semper Fi ... Monthly Donor spoken Here. Go to ... https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: calcowgirl

Pretty sure this was originally John Campbell's baby.

Now he's been inflicted on the whole country...dang...


52 posted on 12/13/2005 10:33:22 PM PST by EternalVigilance (I support the FairTax for the sake of my children and grandchildren...)
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To: EternalVigilance
Yep. (I just posted that minutes ago in #50, lol). He was one of the originators, with Murray (D). He carried the legislation for Arnold. It's one of the first things I found that made me worry about Campbell.
53 posted on 12/13/2005 10:37:09 PM PST by calcowgirl
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To: NormsRevenge
...students talked back and forth, shared ideas and improved their language skills...

They can't pass high school graduation exams in English, but we're worried about them improving their foreign language skills. This is giving Hedgetrimmer's posts about the North American Union new credence, imo.

54 posted on 12/13/2005 10:39:48 PM PST by calcowgirl
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To: Carry_Okie; SierraWasp; FOG724; tubebender

PING - You might find these tidbits interesting.


55 posted on 12/13/2005 10:47:08 PM PST by calcowgirl
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To: JamesP81

I used to have one too (back in the 80's in Texas). Being on a corner, The company inststalling it gave me a 40% break on the price, which along with the tax credit from the feds cost me only $1500. It ran well, and saved a lot, but only becuase I was a total electric house. If I had gas/propane hot water, it would have never paid off. As it was, this system paid off in 4 years and was still running when we sold the house in 1994. It was a Reynolds Aluminum Crown Top system.

To make a long story short, unless the cost of the hot water systems can be significantly reduced, say 60% or more, they will never pay off in any reasonable time.


56 posted on 12/14/2005 6:02:50 AM PST by nuke rocketeer
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To: NormsRevenge

It also sounds like some old Mao Chicom promotion from the "Great Leap Forward" and the Cultural Revolution!


57 posted on 12/14/2005 6:04:56 AM PST by nuke rocketeer
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Comment #58 Removed by Moderator

To: MaDuce
Why this is all a scheme by BIG SOLAR to rape the rate payer and line the pockets of BIG SOLAR executives!!!!

I believe that would be ...God. : )
59 posted on 12/14/2005 2:51:11 PM PST by Boondock_Saint
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To: calcowgirl
“With this program, California can finally get on track to becoming the world solar power leader,” said Bernadette Del Chiaro

That's what they said the last twelve times.

California is hilarious.

60 posted on 12/14/2005 2:52:43 PM PST by Hank Rearden (Never allow anyone who could only get a government job attempt to tell you how to run your life.)
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