Posted on 12/03/2012 5:34:08 PM PST by grey_whiskers
LIBERTINE: Anything goes (and the word you would be looking for if you would look).
Libertarian: one who believes the government which governs best governs least.
Have a nice day!
At this point your raving stupidity becomes just that.
At times I wonder if you are a DU'er over here trying to make sure a Republican never gets elected again by alienating what could be a growing part of the GOP vote. Don't forget to shine your jackboots.
You can whine all you want, but libertarians are far lefties on many issues, that is why you attract so many people like Bill Maher and Noam Chomsky.
This is the party platform, and you just cannot say that all lefties drool at this platform.
Throw open the borders completely; only a rare individual (terrorist, disease carrier etc.) can be kept from freedom of movement through “political boundaries”.
Homosexuals; total freedom in the military, gay marriage, adoption, child custody and everything else.
Abortion; zero restrictions or impediments.
Pornography; no restraint, no restrictions.
Drugs; Meth, Heroin, Crack, and anything new that science can come up with, zero restrictions.
Advertising those drugs, prostitution, and pornography; zero restrictions.
I am socially Conservative, Christian, Fiscally conservative, and I don't need man's law to live a moral life.
I have God's Law, and that is sufficient.
Man's law would tell me it is okay to covet and take my neighbor's property, to slaughter babies in their mothers' wombs, in some jurisdictions for a man to lay with a man as with a woman and call it "marriage", but not okay to pray in public, acknowledging the gifts of Our Creator.
Keep your lawbooks.
Keep in mind that people who hijacked the democrat party and the word 'liberal' (Thomas Jefferson was a liberal, in the classical sense), are doing all they can to split the Right into fragments, and it is useful idiots like you who will make them successful.
Sorry, but you can’t just make things up. Libertarianism is a way that people who like conservative economics but like the left’s stand on social issues and the military to find a niche for themselves.
Libertarians are at war with true conservatism.
You have confused the Communist influences of the 1960 with libertarianism.
You have attributed everything from sodomy to abortion to methamphetamine to people who only want a less totalitarian government, all the while failing to give the credit to the people who deserve it: the New Left--the same Communist movements which sought in their enumerated goals to promote moral degeneracy, who decried McCarthy as a "witch-hunter", and who absconded with the media while people like you were howling over how many life sentences a pot smoker should serve for possession of a joint (something which wasn't even illegal 50 years earlier).
Even as the walls close in, you refuse to admit that the law has become the problem, not the solution, and like the two-edged sword it is, it is being wielded against America and our Constitution--by BOTH sides of the political aisle.
We have the howling expenses of the War on Drugs and the War on Poverty, both depleting the treasury, but also providing the excuse to approve of entering and searching a premises, a person, their possessions, vehicle, and effects without a warrant.
Has drug use stopped? No. But our right to be secure in our person, property, papers and effects has.
Has child abuse stopped? No. Not only has it not, but now we subsidize (at gunpoint, taxman) the festering poverty ridden hellholes where it thrives.
How's that working out for you? Or are you so married to the Statist way that you can't see its failures?
Eisenhower had Operation Wetback to deal with the southern border, now our tax money goes to arm Mexican Drug Cartels, and when the lid is blown off that, not a peep form the alphabet press.
More laws? Like the ones which keep Arizona from patrolling its own international border?
We have ample Oil and Gas resources, not to mention coal, but our own government won't let much of that even be explored, yet we spend trillions in treasure and thousands of lives 'nation building' our enemies (and they will be the second we pull out--some are now) and our own borders aren't secure from invasion--and then don't even get their oil and gas in repayment.
How is that, by what insane stretch is that "providing for the common defense"? --all the while decisions are made to abandon our people in harm's way--at the highest levels.
If you are a Conservative, tell me where is the Constitutional authorization to go abroad and 'build nations'?
Where is the Constitutional authorization to regulate what an adult willingly consumes?
Where is the Constitutional authorization for the EPA?
Where is the Constitutional authorization for the expenditure of public money to provide for the murder of the unborn? for that matter, for hurricane relief?
It isn't there.
As a libertarian, Constitutionalist, Conservative, a Christian, I can be opposed to the concept of forcibly taking money from me to fund anything that is not authorized in the agreement to have a Federal Government. As a Christian, I am especially opposed to abortion.
And just so you know, I do not believe in using recreational drugs--I don't even drink alcohol. The destructive effects of these have been manifest in those I know and have known (many of whom are dead) who have.
I am opposed to homosexuality, especially the push to 'normalize' it, and the teaching of it in schools as "normal".
I am a Social Conservative.
I also believe there are far too many laws, covering far too many topics, which are primarily there to serve the joint purpose of providing 'work' for Federal Employees and providing snares which defy moral or common sense with which to entrap the unwary population or cow them into attempting nothing.
This country is just beginning to feel the effects of that as we raise children who have little incentive to explore, start a business, learn, or excel.
It will get worse, and you can thank too much government for that.
oh no, kids are definitely given the incentive to explore... each other
ugh
It's sad. We always wanted to know what was over the next hill, around the next bend in the creek, and were encouraged to go find out. We had our 'fat' kids, but even they were in good enough shape to keep up, and most were well within an acceptable body weight.
Of my 'peer' group, there arose a USMC Sgt Maj, a Navy SEAL, a Geologist, a Construction company owner, a farmer, and others who were equally successful in life. We had too much on the ball to be distracted by drugs, even though they were out there. Some of us even drank for a while and gave it up--jut no satisfaction in that.
No hippies, no queers, no Liberals, and we did it with a fraction of the rules we have today. Imagine that.
The libertarian agenda is taken from their platform and posted in post 39.
It is an absolute dream agenda for a leftist and one that they have largely succeeded in imposing over the large 50 years, immigration is a powerful tool of the leftists.
Here is the ACTUAL, WORD FOR WORD language of libertarians on immigration.
COMPLETE PLATFORM TEXT
INDIVIDUAL RIGHTS AND CIVIL ORDER
IMMIGRATION:
“”The Issue: We welcome all refugees to our country and condemn the efforts of U.S. officials to create a new “Berlin Wall” which would keep them captive. We condemn the U.S. government’s policy of barring those refugees from our country and preventing Americans from assisting their passage to help them escape tyranny or improve their economic prospects.
The Principle: We hold that human rights should not be denied or abridged on the basis of nationality. Undocumented non-citizens should not be denied the fundamental freedom to labor and to move about unmolested. Furthermore, immigration must not be restricted for reasons of race, religion, political creed, age or sexual preference. We oppose government welfare and resettlement payments to non-citizens just as we oppose government welfare payments to all other persons.
Solutions: We condemn massive roundups of Hispanic Americans and others by the federal government in its hunt for individuals not possessing required government documents. We strongly oppose all measures that punish employers who hire undocumented workers. Such measures repress free enterprise, harass workers, and systematically discourage employers from hiring Hispanics.
Transitional Action: We call for the elimination of all restrictions on immigration, the abolition of the Immigration and Naturalization Service and the Border Patrol, and a declaration of full amnesty for all people who have entered the country illegally.””
Look at the "Libertarian Party Platform" and compare it to this:
CURRENT COMMUNIST GOALS
1. U.S. acceptance of coexistence as the only alternative to atomic war.
2. U.S. willingness to capitulate in preference to engaging in atomic war.
3. Develop the illusion that total disarmament [by] the United States would be a demonstration of moral strength.
4. Permit free trade between all nations regardless of Communist affiliation and regardless of whether or not items could be used for war.
5. Extension of long-term loans to Russia and Soviet satellites.
6. Provide American aid to all nations regardless of Communist domination.
7. Grant recognition of Red China. Admission of Red China to the U.N.
8. Set up East and West Germany as separate states in spite of Khrushchev's promise in 1955 to settle the German question by free elections under supervision of the U.N.
9. Prolong the conferences to ban atomic tests because the United States has agreed to suspend tests as long as negotiations are in progress.
10. Allow all Soviet satellites individual representation in the U.N.
11. Promote the U.N. as the only hope for mankind. If its charter is rewritten, demand that it be set up as a one-world government with its own independent armed forces. (Some Communist leaders believe the world can be taken over as easily by the U.N. as by Moscow. Sometimes these two centers compete with each other as they are now doing in the Congo.)
12. Resist any attempt to outlaw the Communist Party.
13. Do away with all loyalty oaths.
14. Continue giving Russia access to the U.S. Patent Office.
15. Capture one or both of the political parties in the United States.
16. Use technical decisions of the courts to weaken basic American institutions by claiming their activities violate civil rights.
17. Get control of the schools. Use them as transmission belts for socialism and current Communist propaganda. Soften the curriculum. Get control of teachers' associations. Put the party line in textbooks.
18. Gain control of all student newspapers.
19. Use student riots to foment public protests against programs or organizations which are under Communist attack.
20. Infiltrate the press. Get control of book-review assignments, editorial writing, policymaking positions.
21. Gain control of key positions in radio, TV, and motion pictures.
22. Continue discrediting American culture by degrading all forms of artistic expression. An American Communist cell was told to "eliminate all good sculpture from parks and buildings, substitute shapeless, awkward and meaningless forms."
23. Control art critics and directors of art museums. "Our plan is to promote ugliness, repulsive, meaningless art."
24. Eliminate all laws governing obscenity by calling them "censorship" and a violation of free speech and free press.
25. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting pornography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio, and TV.
26. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as "normal, natural, healthy."
27. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with "social" religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity which does not need a "religious crutch."
28. Eliminate prayer or any phase of religious expression in the schools on the ground that it violates the principle of "separation of church and state."
29. Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate, old-fashioned, out of step with modern needs, a hindrance to cooperation between nations on a worldwide basis.
30. Discredit the American Founding Fathers. Present them as selfish aristocrats who had no concern for the "common man."
31. Belittle all forms of American culture and discourage the teaching of American history on the ground that it was only a minor part of the "big picture." Give more emphasis to Russian history since the Communists took over.
32. Support any socialist movement to give centralized control over any part of the culture--education, social agencies, welfare programs, mental health clinics, etc.
33. Eliminate all laws or procedures which interfere with the operation of the Communist apparatus.
34. Eliminate the House Committee on Un-American Activities.
35. Discredit and eventually dismantle the FBI.
36. Infiltrate and gain control of more unions.
37. Infiltrate and gain control of big business.
38. Transfer some of the powers of arrest from the police to social agencies. Treat all behavioral problems as psychiatric disorders which no one but psychiatrists can understand [or treat].
39. Dominate the psychiatric profession and use mental health laws as a means of gaining coercive control over those who oppose Communist goals.
40. Discredit the family as an institution. Encourage promiscuity and easy divorce.
41. Emphasize the need to raise children away from the negative influence of parents. Attribute prejudices, mental blocks and retarding of children to suppressive influence of parents.
42. Create the impression that violence and insurrection are legitimate aspects of the American tradition; that students and special-interest groups should rise up and use ["]united force["] to solve economic, political or social problems.
43. Overthrow all colonial governments before native populations are ready for self-government.
44. Internationalize the Panama Canal.
45. Repeal the Connally reservation so the United States cannot prevent the World Court from seizing jurisdiction [over domestic problems. Give the World Court jurisdiction] over nations and individuals alike.
Now, I present the whole list so I can't be accused of picking and choosing, but I didn't put the things you attribute to libertarians (note the lower case 'l'--it matters) in red, just so they'd stand out for you.
The same people are backing that agenda who were backing it before, and they have called themselves Libertarian, or at least some of them have. As you look down that list, you will find that much of that (the list is from 1963) has been done.
It wasn't done by libertarians, or even Libertarians, it was done by Democrats and Republicans who marched to the wrong drummer. The social conservative/fiscal conservative/small 'l' libertarians (as opposed to the Libertarians) would not have gone for that, often pushed third party candidates or voted GOP, and most of us fought against it.
But if you don't want the help of those who have been aware of and fought this gradual takeover (and so much more ) of the US, well, I guess that's because most of your totalitarian goals have been reached.
We have people to grope us in airports, we can be stopped and searched at any highway checkpoint, our homes can be invaded without a warrant, our finances and communications be scrutinized, and we're just a RCH away from being dragged off in the middle of the night--already authorized by the Defense Act.
I'll continue to stand where I do. Less government is better. It's cheaper, it is less totalitarian, it is more moral, if for no other reason than the opportunities for corruption and larceny are fewer and smaller. YMMV
You ramble on, but you cannot ignore how radically left wing libertarians are in so many areas and are part of the left’s fight against conservatism.
COMPLETE PLATFORM TEXT
INDIVIDUAL RIGHTS AND CIVIL ORDER
IMMIGRATION:
“”The Issue: We welcome all refugees to our country and condemn the efforts of U.S. officials to create a new “Berlin Wall” which would keep them captive. We condemn the U.S. government’s policy of barring those refugees from our country and preventing Americans from assisting their passage to help them escape tyranny or improve their economic prospects.
The Principle: We hold that human rights should not be denied or abridged on the basis of nationality. Undocumented non-citizens should not be denied the fundamental freedom to labor and to move about unmolested. Furthermore, immigration must not be restricted for reasons of race, religion, political creed, age or sexual preference. We oppose government welfare and resettlement payments to non-citizens just as we oppose government welfare payments to all other persons.
Solutions: We condemn massive roundups of Hispanic Americans and others by the federal government in its hunt for individuals not possessing required government documents. We strongly oppose all measures that punish employers who hire undocumented workers. Such measures repress free enterprise, harass workers, and systematically discourage employers from hiring Hispanics.
Transitional Action: We call for the elimination of all restrictions on immigration, the abolition of the Immigration and Naturalization Service and the Border Patrol, and a declaration of full amnesty for all people who have entered the country illegally.””
C.S. Lewis made mention of this in Screwtape Proposes A Toast.
Cheers!
Something like that ~ Dire Straits said it all ~ very prescient group.
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The entire article deserves a careful and thoughtful read. Note that for decades the bastardy rate (yes, the author uses that very precise and accurate word) in the US was .03% for decades. What is it now? 40% and accelerating up. Destruction is on the way. Time to slam on the brakes and do a U turn. First thing is to abolish ALL WELFARE. Sink or swim, and keep the legs closed.
One more time:
Libertines: Anything goes, if-it-feels-good-do-it.
Liberals: In their modern incarnation a totalitarian group bent on doing whatever they want while enslaving the rest of the world for fun and profit, for its own good.
libertarians: The government which governs best governs least. Proponents of limited government (like our Constitution was supposed to provide) not to be confused with a political party of a similar name, although there may be a few libertarians there.
Nope, exactly the same as a federal judge and they're all leftwingtards.
Well, that's two of you who don't get it. Probably never will. Thanks for playing.
What part of no more government than absolutely necessary don't you understand?
If we were to restrict things to just save innocent lives, there would be no automobiles, no 5 gallon buckets, no swimming pools, absolutely nothing sharp or pointy, and bathtubs would be lined with foam so you wouldn't hurt yourself if you slipped and fell. Electricity, fire, and natural gas would be banned. Life would be a rubber room and you'd eat your strained pablum with a dull spork, all the while monitored by a half dozen government employees with a medical crew on standby in case you choked.
If that's the world you want to live in, go ahead. I want no part of it.
Life isn't safe--there are no guarantees, but those who would give up essential liberty for security deserve neither.
Yes, Sir!
Yes, Sir!
The pull quote of the piece, spoken of welfare single mothers: “Her right to be promiscuous trumps our right to the fruits of our own labor.”
That’s killing our country and driving us all into penury. And once we’re broke, the welfare collectors who net more than my hard-working Hubby, are going to be very, very angry.
At us.
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