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If Obama wins: Will Texas secede from the union?
BizPac Review ^ | Michael Dorstewitz

Posted on 07/15/2012 3:46:27 PM PDT by cap10mike

Could Texas once again become the Republic of Texas?

Without question, the Nov. 6 election will be a do-or-die, make-or-break, Rubicon-crossing event. If the presidential election goes one way, we get a “do-over.” We’ll be given the opportunity to take the first step on a long, arduous journey back to our political and economic roots. If it goes the other way, federalism and balance of power will continue to be edged out by an overreaching federal government and an imperial presidency. Socialism will have an unbreakable hold on the economy, and a centralized government, rather than a free market, will determine business’ winners and losers.

(Excerpt) Read more at bizpacreview.com ...


TOPICS: Government; History; Miscellaneous; Politics
KEYWORDS: bho2012; election; obama; secession; texas; tx2012
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To: donmeaker

The bottom line is you lust after using force to impose Obama’s rule on any state.

You are even willing, if not eager, to nuke anyone who tries to get away.


251 posted on 07/15/2012 10:57:01 PM PDT by null and void (Day 1271 of our ObamaVacation from reality - Heroes aren't made Frank, they're cornered...)
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To: moonshot925

Another question...

When the war started, a large group of officers (and enlisted soldiers) left the union forces to go home and fight for their states. If they were guilty of treason, why weren’t they arrested on the spot, when they submitted their resignation papers?

I believe they were allowed to leave because people (in general) thought those people had the right to do so.


252 posted on 07/15/2012 11:21:50 PM PDT by Sporke (USS Iowa BB-61)
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To: Road Glide

Re: “What’s going to happen to Texas’ political demographics 20-30 years from now?”

You’re an optimist.

I’ve been predicting that Texas will vote for the Democrat presidential nominee in 2020, eight years from now.

The GOP leadership, and most mainstream Conservative publications, will never acknowledge that 80% of new immigrant citizens vote for the Democrat Party.

If American Conservatism is not destroyed in the short term by our insane immigration policy, it will be destroyed in the long term - as you point out - by political demography.


253 posted on 07/16/2012 12:40:32 AM PDT by zeestephen
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To: allmendream
If I owned hell and Texas I would live in hell and rent out Texas.

Because California is so much better, right? O.o

254 posted on 07/16/2012 3:40:53 AM PDT by al_c (http://www.blowoutcongress.com)
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To: moonshot925
We have the SCOTUS rulings on the subject and you want to claim they are not good enough. It does not get any more absurd than that.

soooo a bad decision makes Obamacare constitutional too, right?

Think of 1857, when the court handed down the outrageous Dred Scott decision, which said African Americans were not citizens. Think of the “separate but equal” doctrine in Plessy v. Ferguson, which the court later repudiated in Brown v. Board of Education.

your the type who would shake his head in disbelief as they pushed you forward into a cattlecar headed toward a death camp...mumbling something about the constitution and the supreme court.

255 posted on 07/16/2012 3:57:28 AM PDT by Vaquero (Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: al_c
If I owned hell and Texas I would live in hell and rent out Texas..............
Because California is so much better, right? O.o

as a New Yorker( who has spent time a little time in Texas)....I tell my Northeast-centric wife(who is xenophobic of all things south of the mason-dixon) that if and when the feces hits the fan, I will run down to Texas and help them man the barricades on the borders both north and south.

256 posted on 07/16/2012 4:04:24 AM PDT by Vaquero (Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: moonshot925

All of those states are just getting a few of their own tax dollars back. And when the govt. goes broke from poor management and communism, the subsidies will stop anyway. Can’t pay what you do not have.
I’m not calling for Texas to leave the US immediately, although the thought is intriguing, BUT, if the Zero by chance gets re-elected, within months, a lot of people in red states will wanting out. I don’t feel like I will be alone.
One goal communists always have is to control the food. So all the mid country farmers need to remember that,too
Best case is for Zero gone, new administration full of conservative R’s even if the one at the top is not too conservative.
I’ve said it on other threads, I’ll say it again, Zero has to go, along with Holder, and all the czars.( That title was borrowed from Russia too)


257 posted on 07/16/2012 4:22:20 AM PDT by Quickgun (Second Amendment. The only one you can put your hands on.)
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To: donmeaker; null and void; JRandomFreeper
The bottom line is you don’t get to use force to remove Texas from the Union.

I recommend you not try.

“Kill a man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill everyone, and you are a god.”

Last call for the train to Bergen-Belsen. All aboard for Bergen-Belsen....

258 posted on 07/16/2012 4:39:13 AM PDT by bigheadfred (MY PET TAPEWORM OBIWAN IS AN INSANE MILITARY HATING LEFTIST)
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To: donmeaker; null and void; JRandomFreeper; moonshot925
AAAAHHHHH!!!!

I almost forgot the song dedication to mom.

From FIRE FALL

cinder-Ella

259 posted on 07/16/2012 5:21:37 AM PDT by bigheadfred (MY PET TAPEWORM OBIWAN IS AN INSANE MILITARY HATING LEFTIST)
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To: null and void

These South hating thugs on Free Republic would make Nazi’s blush.


260 posted on 07/16/2012 6:23:36 AM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: al_c

Yes it is. California is a very productive state in terms of agriculture and intellectual property; we make some of the best stuff in the world.

The best American President in living memory was Governor of what State?

But like many places where living is easy - political and cultural decadence can set in.

But there is a lot more to California than Governor Moonbeam and the fast train to economic ruin.

And it was a joke Francis. ;)


261 posted on 07/16/2012 7:35:49 AM PDT by allmendream (Tea Party did not send GOP to D.C. to negotiate the terms of our surrender to socialism)
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To: allmendream
And it was a joke Francis. ;)

Likewise, left-coaster.

262 posted on 07/16/2012 7:39:54 AM PDT by al_c (http://www.blowoutcongress.com)
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To: Vaquero

The supreme court ruled it was unconstitutional for the federal government to force individuals to buy goods or services they did not want according to the Commerce Clause.

The supreme court ruled it was unconstitutional to force states to comply or lose funding for existing programs.

The supreme court only ruled that congress or state assemblies had the constitutional authority to regulate such programs and levy a “tax” for people who didn’t participate.

The Fourteenth Amendment made the Dred Scott decision null and void.


263 posted on 07/16/2012 8:49:31 AM PDT by moonshot925
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To: moonshot925
The supreme court ruled it was unconstitutional for the federal government to force individuals to buy goods or services they did not want according to the Commerce Clause.

yeah so they pulled a bunch of crap and called it a tax

what are you a FRIGGIN LAWYER

there the first to go, you know...(just ask Shakespeare)

264 posted on 07/16/2012 9:23:10 AM PDT by Vaquero (Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: moonshot925
Lets forget the Constitution for a minute...

there is another document

it begins like this....

The Unanimous Declaration of the Thirteen United States of America

When, in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness...

265 posted on 07/16/2012 9:32:06 AM PDT by Vaquero (Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: AlexisHeavyMetal1981
“Seems clear enough to me. We have to come up with an official declaration, listing anew the current long train of abuses, to nullify the overreaching oppression, fortified by the language in the original DOI, signed by the governors of the 26 or so states that wish to remain free, then have at it.”

You mean something like this?

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and Property.

That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

Such has been the patient sufferance of these States; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of Government. The history of the present Federal Government of the United States of America is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.
They have refused to Assent to State Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

They have forbidden our Governors to pass Laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till a distant and remote court’s Assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, it has utterly neglected to attend to them.

They have refused to defend other Laws for the accommodation of large numbers of people, unless those people would relinquish their Freedom of Religion, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only.

They have restricted the rights of several States under the guise of correcting historical prejudice but in truth for the sole purpose and effect denying their peoples equal representation in their government.

They have supported the cowardly interstate defection of State legislators in order to dissolve rightfully elected legislatures and disrupt the operation of State governments .

They have, under these guises, refused for a long time to allow many states to properly and lawfully apportion their legislative districts, further eroding the fair and just representation of their citizens by their own elected officials.

They have endeavored to overwhelm the population of these States; for that purpose obstructing enforcement of reasonable Laws for Naturalization or Repatriation of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to stem the human tide threatening to overrun them.

They have obstructed the Administration of Justice by refusing his Defend Laws rightfully passed by the legislature.

They have erected an unelected and unaccountable shadow government and appointed Judges blatantly complicit in the overthrow of the principals of liberty and justice central to the defense of every American’s freedom.

They have erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance.

They have broken into our homes and businesses and intimidated citizens on their own property under the guise of Education and Environmental protection.

They have committed us to war without proper legislative action, ceding all military action and authority subservient to an increasingly tyrannical and unaccountable Chief Executive.

They have conspired with other nation’s governments to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving their Assent to their Acts of pretended Legislation:

For granting unequal protection under the law based on skin color, racial origin, or gender:

For extracting tithes to foreign states under the guise of aid:

For cutting off our Trade with many parts of the world:

For imposing Taxes on us without our Consent:

For restricting the right to bear arms in defense of one’s own person or property:

For transporting us beyond Seas to be tried for pretended offenses:

For abolishing the free market and redistributing the hard earned property of the American people under the guise of fictitious scientific and economic theories which exist for the sole purpose separating wealth from the citizens who earned or created it:

For attacking our Beliefs, cynically declaring civilization’s most cherished and important Laws and Morals manifestations of hatred to be abolished:

For creating super-national courts and councils declaring themselves invested with power to legislate for us in all cases whatsoever.

They have abdicated Government here, by levying tyrannical mandates on the many stats under the rubric of fairness or compassion, but then compelling the states to fund the federal largess themselves.

They have plundered our resources, denied our own industry, seized great portions of our territories, and destroyed the livelihood of our people.

They have destroyed our banks by compelling them to lend indiscriminately to favored political classes effectively turning our lending institutions into charitable organizations and instruments of “social justice”.

They have created nameless bureaucracies for the purpose of taxation without representation by debasing our currency, stripping it of all measures of substantial value and simultaneously printing vast quantities of new Dollars for distribution as political largess.

They have taxed our children, grandchildren, and distant future generations who as yet have no voice in and now face a lifetime of indentured servitude to government by spending grotesque sums on credit, and have even now refused to produce federal budgets as part of the effort to hide the breadth and scope of the thievery.

In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms: Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated injury. A Government, whose character is thus marked by every act which may define as Tyrannical, is unfit to govern a free people.

Nor have We been wanting in attentions to our Federal brethren. We have warned them from time to time of attempts by their legislature to extend an unwarrantable jurisdiction over us. We have reminded them of the constitutional contract between the federal government and the states that created it. We have appealed to their native justice and magnanimity, and we have conjured them by the ties of our common kindred to disavow these usurpations, which, would inevitably interrupt our connections and correspondence. They too have been deaf to the voice of justice and of consanguinity. We must, therefore, acquiesce in the necessity, which denounces our Separation, and hold them, as we hold the rest of mankind, Enemies in War, in Peace Friends.

We, therefore, the Representatives of the Free Republics of America, in General Congress, Assembled, appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, do, in the Name, and by Authority of the good People of these States, solemnly publish and declare, That these States are, and of Right ought to be Free and Independent Republics; that they are Absolved from all Allegiance to the United States government, and that all political connection between them and the United States of America, is and ought to be totally dissolved; and that as Free and Independent Republics, they have full Power to levy War, conclude Peace, contract Alliances, establish Commerce, and to do all other Acts and Things which Independent Republics may of right do. And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor.

266 posted on 07/16/2012 9:33:25 AM PDT by LaserJock
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To: Vaquero

The constitution is the supreme law of the United States, not the Declaration of Independence.

The Declaration of Independence has had no legal power or authority since 1789.


267 posted on 07/16/2012 9:45:41 AM PDT by moonshot925
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To: Sporke

So how does that equate to secession?


268 posted on 07/16/2012 10:21:59 AM PDT by jmacusa (Political correctness is cultural Marxism. I'm not a Marxist.)
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To: zeestephen
I’ve been predicting that Texas will vote for the Democrat presidential nominee in 2020, eight years from now.

Makes sense, there's barely a pinch of sh!t's difference between the parties today.

269 posted on 07/16/2012 10:35:49 AM PDT by null and void (Day 1272 of our ObamaVacation from reality - Heroes aren't made Frank, they're cornered...)
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To: zeestephen
I’ve been predicting that Texas will vote for the Democrat presidential nominee in 2020, eight years from now.

Makes sense, there's barely a pinch of sh!t's difference between the parties today.

270 posted on 07/16/2012 10:36:08 AM PDT by null and void (Day 1272 of our ObamaVacation from reality - Heroes aren't made Frank, they're cornered...)
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To: Quickgun
One goal communists always have is to control the food. So all the mid country farmers need to remember that, too

They would be well served to remember all the Ukrainian farmers Stalin starved out of existence.

271 posted on 07/16/2012 10:40:26 AM PDT by null and void (Day 1272 of our ObamaVacation from reality - Heroes aren't made Frank, they're cornered...)
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To: central_va
These South hating thugs on Free Republic would make Nazi’s blush.

Pretty much.

I've applied for a job in your neck of the woods.

Pray for me.

272 posted on 07/16/2012 10:43:08 AM PDT by null and void (Day 1272 of our ObamaVacation from reality - Heroes aren't made Frank, they're cornered...)
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To: moonshot925

“The Declaration of Independence has no legal power or authority today

The Constitution is the Supreme Law of the United States.”

My rights and my states rights come from God, not the federal govt.
Where the rubber meets the road, I’ll side with God, and you can keep your interpreted version of the Constitution. :)


273 posted on 07/16/2012 10:43:36 AM PDT by Sporke (USS Iowa BB-61)
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To: null and void

Will do.


274 posted on 07/16/2012 10:52:11 AM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: moonshot925

When the politicians and bureaucrats treat the ‘supreme law of the land’ like so much toilet paper, that is the time Patriots revisit the Declaration. Those who block them fall into the category of TYRANT!


275 posted on 07/16/2012 11:45:48 AM PDT by Vaquero (Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to Vfight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: moonshot925

Both New York and Virginia explicitly retained the right to secede from the USA through specific language in their conditional ratification of the Constitution.

Thank you Patrick Henry.


276 posted on 07/16/2012 12:23:54 PM PDT by Triple (Socialism denies people the right to the fruits of their labor, and is as abhorrent as slavery)
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To: Vaquero

The constitution has served us well over the past 223 years, through good times and bad. It has allowed us to progress more in 223 years than than any other nation has in thousands.

The amendment process has been used to address some of the fundamental omissions and errors and to keep the document updated.

Why would we ever revisit the Declaration?

Does the declaration give us the freedoms of speech, assembly, religion, the press and petition?

Does the declaration give us the right to bear arms?

Does the declaration protect us from unreasonable searches and seizures?

Does the declaration give us the right to a fair and speedy trial by jury?


277 posted on 07/16/2012 12:36:29 PM PDT by moonshot925
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To: Triple

Oh, and if I’m not mistaken Wyoming filed an amacus brief in the Heller case which basically said if the ruling went against Heller, Wyoming considered it a breach of contract with the federal government...secession.


278 posted on 07/16/2012 12:36:55 PM PDT by Triple (Socialism denies people the right to the fruits of their labor, and is as abhorrent as slavery)
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To: Vaquero
soooo a bad decision makes Obamacare constitutional too, right?

Yep, that's the way it works, unless you're an anarchist. Conservatives respect the rule of law - even when it goes against our desires. Why else do you think that conservatives are so ticked off at roberts's betrayal? It is precisely because he abandoned principle to impose a political solution to the issue.

your the type who would shake his head in disbelief as they pushed you forward into a cattlecar headed toward a death camp...mumbling something about the constitution and the supreme court.

That wasn't necessary.

279 posted on 07/16/2012 12:39:09 PM PDT by rockrr (Everything is different now...)
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To: Triple

Signing statements to the ratification process don’t carry the weight of law. They may have been a reassurance to folks but they aren’t enforceable.


280 posted on 07/16/2012 12:42:05 PM PDT by rockrr (Everything is different now...)
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To: rockrr

These were not “signing statements” as a president may do when signing a bill into law. They were strongly worded deliberate conditional ratifications authored by one of our most revered patriots, Patrick Henry.

The Constitution was freely entered by New York and Virginia, which would retain member state status, as long as certain conditions were upheld by the federal government. The conditional ratifications could have been rejected, but they were not.

You see, a president has no authority to amend a law in a signing statement. That was not the case with the conditional ratification, which captured the additional requirements needed for New York and Virginia to ratify the Constitution. BTW - the ratification documents had both immediate and ongoing requirements, and the immediate requirements were fulfilled.


281 posted on 07/16/2012 1:24:25 PM PDT by Triple (Socialism denies people the right to the fruits of their labor, and is as abhorrent as slavery)
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To: rockrr

See 275


282 posted on 07/16/2012 2:06:34 PM PDT by Vaquero (Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to Vfight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: Vaquero
The Unanimous Declaration of the Thirteen United States of America

Actually, the original Declaration of Independence reads,

"The unanimous Declaration of the thirteen united States of America"

although you will sometimes see it printed the way you posted it.

Those uncapitalized letters in the original DOI are important and reflect the relationship between the independent states at that time. There was no United States of America in 1776.

See: The engraving of the original DOI by William Stone as commissioned by John Quincy Adams or this official transcript of the DOI at the US Archives. Supposedly, it took Stone three years to carefully engrave his "exact" copy of the original DOI.

283 posted on 07/16/2012 2:28:47 PM PDT by rustbucket
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To: Triple
Sorry but that's not how it worked then, or how it works now.
Article VII - The Ratification of the Conventions of nine States, shall be sufficient for the Establishment of this Constitution between the States so ratifying the Same.

The Constitution is silent on provisional or conditional ratifications. The ratification process was a Yea/Nay of the United States Constitution. You may recall that the process got held up because Massachusetts balked at accepting the Constitution as-is. They had conditions which were debated and formed the foundation for the Bill of Rights.

The vote to ratify was an "all-in" proposition.

284 posted on 07/16/2012 3:07:41 PM PDT by rockrr (Everything is different now...)
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To: Vaquero

So you’re an anarchist then....OK by me.


285 posted on 07/16/2012 3:09:13 PM PDT by rockrr (Everything is different now...)
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To: rockrr

Anarchist like Jefferson Washington Franklin Adams Henry etc?

Take your pick


286 posted on 07/16/2012 3:34:40 PM PDT by Vaquero (Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to Vfight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: donmeaker

“Actually, you can also be confined in a home for the insane.”

Damn, does that mean he would be forced to go to Californicate?


287 posted on 07/16/2012 3:56:23 PM PDT by antisocial (Texas SCV - Deo Vindice)
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To: Vaquero

You flatter yourself.


288 posted on 07/16/2012 4:02:05 PM PDT by rockrr (Everything is different now...)
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To: rockrr

It wasn’t Mass - It was Virginia and New York, driven by Patrick Henry.

The sovereign states of Virginia and New York entered the USA by ratifying the constitution provided that certain conditions were met and maintained.

That is what NY and VA did, and the conditions were accepted. You may not like it but NY and VA retained the right to assert their sovereignty, in the event the federal government did not meet certain conditions.


A copy of the VA ratification: (from usconstitution.net)

WE the Delegates of the people of Virginia, duly elected in pursuance of a recommendation from the General Assembly, and now met in Convention, having fully and freely investigated and discussed the proceedings of the Federal Convention, and being prepared as well as the most mature deliberation hath enabled us, to decide thereon, DO in the name and in behalf of the people of Virginia, declare and make known that the powers granted under the Constitution, being derived from the people of the United States may be resumed by them whensoever the same shall be perverted to their injury or oppression, and that every power not granted thereby remains with them and at their will: that therefore no right of any denomination, can be cancelled, abridged, restrained or modified, by the Congress, by the Senate or House of Representatives acting in any capacity, by the President or any department or officer of the United States, except in those instances in which power is given by the Constitution for those purposes: and that among other essential rights, the liberty of conscience and of the press cannot be cancelled, abridged, restrained or modified by any authority of the United States.

With these impressions, with a solemn appeal to the searcher of hearts for the purity of our intentions, and under the conviction, that, whatsoever imperfections may exist in the Constitution, ought rather to be examined in the mode prescribed therein, than to bring the Union into danger by a delay, with a hope of obtaining amendments previous to the ratification:

We the said Delegates, in the name and in behalf of the people of Virginia, do by these presents assent to, and ratify the Constitution recommended on the seventeenth day of September, one thousand seven hundred and eighty seven, by the Foederal Convention for the Government of the United States; hereby announcing to all those whom it may concern, that the said Constitution is binding upon the said People, according to an authentic copy hereto annexed, in the words following:

A copy of the Constitution was included in the ratification document.

On motion, Ordered, That the Secretary of this Convention cause to be engrossed, forthwith, two fair copies of the form of ratification, and of the proposed Constitution of Government, as recommended by the Foederal Convention on the seventeenth day of September, one thousand seven hundred and eighty seven.


Virginia also included a proposed “bill of rights.” It was clear at the time that Virginia (and the other states) retained sovereignty, and the right to withdraw from the USA.


289 posted on 07/16/2012 4:48:08 PM PDT by Triple (Socialism denies people the right to the fruits of their labor, and is as abhorrent as slavery)
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To: Triple
You may not like it but NY and VA retained the right to assert their sovereignty, in the event the federal government did not meet certain conditions.

They may retain the Natural Right of Rebellion, but they possess no other extra-constitutional rights recognised by the United States Constitution or any of her courts.

290 posted on 07/16/2012 4:57:41 PM PDT by rockrr (Everything is different now...)
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To: moonshot925; Vaquero; rockrr
The ONLY thing giving anyone anything right now is there was a second amendment and that the current citizenry are heavily armed.

Not some "belief" or a piece of paper with fine sounding words on it.

Anarchist like Jefferson Washington Franklin Adams Henry etc?

Including ANY of the 200,000 PATRIOTS who fought in the war. "Ordinary" folks. JUST LIKE Vaquero.

291 posted on 07/16/2012 5:01:23 PM PDT by bigheadfred (MY PET TAPEWORM OBIWAN IS AN INSANE MILITARY HATING LEFTIST)
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To: rockrr

“They may retain the Natural Right of Rebellion, but they possess no other extra-constitutional rights recognised by the United States Constitution or any of her courts. “ - RR

There are many extra-constitutional rights that are are in fact recognized by the Constitution. Are you baffled by that statement? (I bet you are.)


Read Amendment X:

The power not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.


Clearly the right to withdraw from the Union was contemplated by Virginia, and retained by Virginia, since it was not delegated by the Constitution. If you think all rights are enumerated in the Constitution, then try reading the ninth amendment.

Amendment IX

The enumeration in the Constitution of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage other rights retained by the people.


Amendment IX and X, along with the rest of the Bill of Rights, were brought about by

...wait for it...

—————Patrick Henry—————

Are you seeing the connections?


292 posted on 07/16/2012 5:46:54 PM PDT by Triple (Socialism denies people the right to the fruits of their labor, and is as abhorrent as slavery)
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To: null and void

No. Your are projecting. You will merely be stopped from using force to separate the United States, just like any other enemy.


293 posted on 07/16/2012 8:11:07 PM PDT by donmeaker (Blunderbuss: A short weapon, ... now superceded in civilized countries by more advanced weaponry.)
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To: Triple

It was not clear, and in fact the courts ruled the other way in Texas v. White. Further, any reservations that were mentioned at the time of ratification were not duplicated when the states were re-admitted after the Great Rebellion. So any reservations by the states during ratification are no longer in effect.


294 posted on 07/16/2012 8:18:18 PM PDT by donmeaker (Blunderbuss: A short weapon, ... now superceded in civilized countries by more advanced weaponry.)
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To: bigheadfred

The current citizenry are not heavily armed. The state of armament has progressed rather more than privately owned weapons in the bast 60 years.

How many aircraft carriers does Texas have? Zero. How many modern fighters? How many modern guided artillery rounds? Zero.


295 posted on 07/16/2012 8:21:34 PM PDT by donmeaker (Blunderbuss: A short weapon, ... now superceded in civilized countries by more advanced weaponry.)
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To: antisocial

Nah. We in California have standards for our asylums.


296 posted on 07/16/2012 8:24:03 PM PDT by donmeaker (Blunderbuss: A short weapon, ... now superceded in civilized countries by more advanced weaponry.)
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To: Vaquero

No, private parties who pretend to represent entire states without benefit of elections are tyrants.


297 posted on 07/16/2012 8:40:44 PM PDT by donmeaker (Blunderbuss: A short weapon, ... now superceded in civilized countries by more advanced weaponry.)
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To: Vaquero

Just think about it. They would see you as the enemy to be kept out by the northern border of Texas. I don’t see it working out well for you.


298 posted on 07/16/2012 8:45:12 PM PDT by donmeaker (Blunderbuss: A short weapon, ... now superceded in civilized countries by more advanced weaponry.)
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To: donmeaker

You are so full of Bandini.


299 posted on 07/16/2012 8:48:16 PM PDT by null and void (Day 1272 of our ObamaVacation from reality - Heroes aren't made Frank, they're cornered...)
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To: null and void

Full of himself. He should be prouder of hizself than he already is.


300 posted on 07/17/2012 3:49:03 AM PDT by bigheadfred (MY PET TAPEWORM OBIWAN IS AN INSANE MILITARY HATING LEFTIST)
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