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Rep. Ron Paul's Texas Straight Talk- Monitor thy neighbor
Ron Paul's Congressional site ^ | 22 July 2002 | Rep. Ron Paul (R-Tex.)

Posted on 07/26/2002 6:28:10 AM PDT by radical4capitalism

Monitor Thy Neighbor

Opposition to the Patriot Act, legislation passed by Congress and signed by the President last year, is growing. Americans are beginning to understand that many precious liberties have been put in jeopardy by the government’s rush to enact new laws in the wake of September 11th. Federal law enforcement agencies now have broad authority to conduct secret, warrantless searches of homes; monitor phone and internet activity; access financial records; and undertake large-scale tracking of American citizens through huge databases. We’re told this is necessary to fight the unending war on terror, but in truth the federal government has been seeking these powers for years. September 11th simply provided an excuse to accelerate the process and convince all of us to relinquish more and more of our privacy to the federal government.

Now the Justice department wants to extend the new investigative powers to private citizens. It recently unveiled Operation TIPS- Terrorism Information and Prevention System- as part of President Bush’s Citizen Corps initiative. The goal is to enlist thousands or even millions of Americans to act as spies for the government, reporting suspicious activity to officials using a handy toll-free hotline. The Justice department especially hopes to enlist mailmen, delivery drivers, plumbers, gas-meter readers, and the like, as they have access to private homes and businesses in their daily work. As usual, the war on terror is offered as justification for this proposal.

This almost might be funny if it were not real. Imagine the rampant abuses possible with a national spy program. Busybodies across the country will clamor to join the effort and act as self-appointed neighborhood vigilantes. Unscrupulous individuals of every stripe will abuse the program by snitching on ex-spouses, personal enemies, and racial groups they don’t like. Bickering neighbors will enjoy calling in to report unkempt lawns and barking dogs as sure signs of nefarious activity. I certainly hope the Justice department employs some very patient people to field the flood of useless calls.

If a government-sponsored snitch program sounds pretty bad to you, you’re not alone. Some commentators draw parallels between Operation TIPS and the citizen informants of the former East German Stasi secret police. Of course, suggesting the obvious- that citizen spy programs are incompatible with a free society- invites denunciations and sharp reminders that "we’re at war." Remember, however, that wars have been used throughout modern history to justify rapid expansion of state power at the expense of personal liberty. We cannot remain free if we allow the endless, undeclared war on terror to serve as an excuse for giving up every last vestige of our privacy.

I applaud Congressman Dick Armey for adding a provision to the homeland security bill that would prohibit the Justice department from implementing the TIPS program. His opposition brings needed public attention to this terrible idea. But even if Congress supports him, there is no guarantee another informant proposal will not surface soon thereafter. Congressional oversight of administrative agencies (consider the Treasury department and its renegade IRS) is nonexistent. The Justice department almost certainly will seek another way to implement the program, with or without congressional approval.

Ultimately, we have to ask ourselves what kind of society we hope to leave our children and grandchildren. A civilized and free society would not be discussing, much less seriously debating, any proposal to enlist private citizens to act as federal neighborhood snitches.


TOPICS: Candidates; General Discussion
KEYWORDS: congress; libertarian; ronpaul; ronpaullist; texas; tips
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To: Doug Fiedor
>>>Yes. As he presents himself, he is quite obviously a big government loving Rockerfeller Republican. A typical, garden variety statist.

Sorry to disappoint you. I'm a Reagan conservative and a life long Republican.

OTOH, you're just another Libertarian fringe extremist LOSER. I can tell that because you agree with tpaine, the biggest LOSER to ever come on FreeRepublic.

21 posted on 07/27/2002 2:08:02 PM PDT by Reagan Man
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To: Reagan Man
Knock it off.
22 posted on 07/27/2002 2:17:14 PM PDT by Jim Robinson
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To: Reagan Man
Reagan Man:
I have neither the time nor the desire to get into a long, extended debate with you over the merits and principles of the the RLC or Ronald Reagan. Suffice it to say that your interpretation of Reagan as some great "Biblical" Republican are unfounded. While he was Governor of California, Reagan revealed his civil libertarian side when he publicly opposed an anti-gay ballot proposition. Reagan was also a staunch supporter of free-market capitalism, much to the chagrin of liberals and Democrats. In my mind, Reagan's political qualities can be considered libertarian in nature. By the way-- libertarians have been accused of being anarchists, but these charges are completely unfounded. Reagan was correct: true libertarianism is essentially true conservativism. Of course, Religious Righters will disagree, and that is their perogative.

Regards,
Pete Krembs
State Chairman
23 posted on 07/27/2002 2:26:10 PM PDT by radical4capitalism
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To: Reagan Man
You have never established ANY facts to back up your silly 'dirty liar' claim.
Which makes you look like an idiot. - Thanks.
24 posted on 07/27/2002 3:17:56 PM PDT by tpaine
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To: Reagan Man
As I pointed out, Ronald Reagan wasn't a Libertarian and never had much to say about the fringe extremist politics of Libertarianism,


And you were refuted.
Now, rather than buttressing your point, or countering with more facts, you just resume with 'liar, liar pants on fire'.
-- Grow up, - elsewhere.
25 posted on 07/27/2002 3:23:54 PM PDT by tpaine
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To: tpaine
Knock it off.
26 posted on 07/27/2002 3:58:21 PM PDT by Jim Robinson
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To: Jim Robinson
Knock it off.
26 posted on 7/27/02 3:58 PM Pacific by Jim Robinson - to 25
25 posted on 7/27/02 3:23 PM Pacific by tpaine

Yo boss.
-- Seems I already had though, for 35 minutes or so.
- But who am I to say?
27 posted on 07/27/2002 5:46:12 PM PDT by tpaine
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To: Reagan Man
I bet that one took a while to come up with. I see I'm dealing with a true wit.
28 posted on 07/28/2002 12:41:46 AM PDT by A.J.Armitage
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To: Reagan Man
We’re told this is necessary to fight the unending war on terror, but in truth the federal government has been seeking these powers for years.

If you have forgotten that this forum was screaming about attempts to insert this crap into all manner of legislation during Clinton's years in office we'll give you an excuse and expect you to catch up on all the news you missed. If you have forgotten that this Forum regularly heaped all manner of praise on Ron Paul for his statements just like this during the Clinton years we will likewise allow you to catch up on what you missed. Anyone can have their head up their @ss for any manner of reasons and miss the important stuff.

If you are merely chosing to ignore the truth of these words then you deserve all the ridicule that a shill deserves. You will have joined such luminaries as Lanny Davis, Rahm Emanuel and Hillary Clinton in the "Spinsters and Shills Hall of Shame."

29 posted on 07/28/2002 6:06:50 AM PDT by Abundy
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To: Reagan Man; Jim Robinson; tpaine
The RLC and this new RLC forum, is nothing but a Libertarian effort in futility. It has little to do with the original concept of FreeRepublic, which was promoting the conservative agenda. Just because Jim Robinson has decided to support this fringe extremism and give credence to a separate forum for the Libertarian agenda, doesn't mean the conservative memory of the great Ronald Reagan has to be damaged from dirty liars like you, tpaine.

Really? When is the last time you read Free Republic's stated purpose? Do you even know where to find these words:

Free Republic is an online gathering place for independent, grass-roots conservatism on the web. We're working to roll back decades of governmental largesse, to root out political fraud and corruption

You better calm down and actually apply any brain cells you might have before engaging your keyboard...

30 posted on 07/28/2002 6:11:37 AM PDT by Abundy
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To: Reagan Man
fringe extremist politics

You really have gotten down the Lanny Davis/Rahm Emanuel/Hiltlary Clinton buzzwords quite well, haven't you? What happened, did you lose your job in the White House Press machine when Bush took over?

31 posted on 07/28/2002 6:13:11 AM PDT by Abundy
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To: Abundy
Knock it off.
32 posted on 07/28/2002 9:08:19 AM PDT by tpaine
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To: tpaine
Knock what off? Telling the truth?
33 posted on 07/28/2002 9:40:31 AM PDT by Abundy
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To: Abundy
'Joke', son.
- Maybe you're too pre-pubescent to get it.
34 posted on 07/28/2002 9:44:57 AM PDT by tpaine
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To: tpaine
Maybe you need to use some /sarcasm tags...'specially since you insulted me on the other thread.

Here I thought that you and I agreed on much of the issues...beginning to wonder if the critics who say you just exist here to stir up trouble through invective and illogic are correct. (I've disagreed with that assesment to date)

35 posted on 07/28/2002 9:50:41 AM PDT by Abundy
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To: Abundy
'Joke', son.
- Maybe you're too pre-pubescent to get it.
34 - tpaine


Maybe you need to use some /sarcasm tags...'specially since you insulted me on the other thread.
Here I thought that you and I agreed on much of the issues...beginning to wonder if the critics who say you just exist here to stir up trouble through invective and illogic are correct. (I've disagreed with that assesment to date)


Good grief. YOU initiated this 'trouble' with that nasty little pre-pube remark on the other thread. - Now you apparently want to notch it up with what 'critics say'.
--- Getta grip. - And a sense of humor.

36 posted on 07/28/2002 10:19:19 AM PDT by tpaine
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To: tpaine
And a sense of humor.

Hmmm...I characterize your inanane disagreement over minutia withe GOPcapitalist as "pre-pubescent" and you tell me to get a sense of humor?

OK, so I forgot the /joke tag on my post too...but then you refuse to answer valid points, fixating on my use of sarcasm? OK, I've already apologized on the other thread - and before I decide that I hit a little too close to home with the original characterization of you, how about re-thinking your comment regarding the quality of my posts after reviewing the substantive ones on this thread and the other two?

37 posted on 07/28/2002 10:36:08 AM PDT by Abundy
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To: Abundy
Good grief. YOU initiated this 'trouble' with that nasty little pre-pube remark on the other thread. - Now you apparently want to notch it up with what 'critics say'.
--- Getta grip. - And a sense of humor. - 36 posted by tpaine

Hmmm...I characterize your inanane disagreement over minutia withe GOPcapitalist as "pre-pubescent" and you tell me to get a sense of humor? OK, so I forgot the /joke tag on my post too...

Your initial 'characterization' was not a joke. It was an insult, which you just admitted on that thread.

but then you refuse to answer valid points, fixating on my use of sarcasm? OK, I've already apologized on the other thread - and before I decide that I hit a little too close to home with the original characterization of you,

'Decide' what you like. But stop your 'inane' snide remarks, and surprise, - so will I.

how about re-thinking your comment regarding the quality of my posts after reviewing the substantive ones on this thread and the other two?

Check that mirror again, your swelled head seems to be getting worse.

38 posted on 07/28/2002 11:40:28 AM PDT by tpaine
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To: tpaine

Physician, heal thyself.

39 posted on 07/28/2002 11:41:55 AM PDT by Abundy
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To: Abundy
Mirror mirror, on the wall...
40 posted on 07/28/2002 12:04:18 PM PDT by tpaine
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