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Genesis Chapter 3 Continued (Fourth Try)
Free Republic Thread ^ | April 2002 | the_doc

Posted on 04/25/2002 10:02:18 AM PDT by Matchett-PI

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To: the_doc; la$tminutepardon; Matchett-PI; RnMomof7; OrthodoxPresbyterian; Wrigley
That form of covenant is called a testament! And it is immediately enforceable upon the death of the testator!

Making note to go read the appropriate part of Hebrews again...

61 posted on 04/26/2002 1:46:27 PM PDT by CCWoody
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To: Matchett-PI, the_doc, Orthodox Presbyterian
I saw in today's paper another scientist's view of the universe that might interest you, M-PI. He says that our universe is like a two-dimensional surface in a multiple dimensional space, with the bottom of another dimension sometimes touching ours. He kind of likes the idea of an oscillating universe, a notion that most physicists rule out.

Anyway, Torah says that we are in a five-D space, the fifth dimension of course, being spiritual. Jesus brought the notion of the Kingdom drawing near as you know and certainly the Jews had and have as part of their theology, that what is below reflects what is above.

The most exciting revelation of course, is that to be in Christ, you have access to this other dimension. By the way did you know that physicists get more and more confused, the more they try and study matter? It appears to be pure information and as close as they can describe it, to be pure thought. Then of course, when they do break it down, it's found to be light. Fascinating isn't it?

62 posted on 04/26/2002 4:17:42 PM PDT by la$tminutepardon
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To: la$tminutepardon
Thanks. Do you remember what the scientist's name is? I'd like to read what he has to say. (I had to shut off my computer because of an electrical storm last night, so didn't see your post until today.)

I think these comments of Gilbert Chesterton in Orthodoxy are interesting:

"The real trouble with this world of ours, is not that it is an unreasonable world, nor even that it is a reasonable one. The commonest kind of trouble is that it is nearly reasonable, but not quite.... It looks just a little more mathematical and regular than it is; its exactitude is obvious, but its exactitude is hidden; its wildness lies in wait."

As an example, Chesteron has an extraterrestrial examine a human body for the first time. He sees that the right side exactly duplicates the left with two arms, two legs, two ears, two eyes, two nostrils, and two lobes of the brain. Going a little further, he finds a heart on the left side. He brilliantly calculates that there is another heart on the right side. Unfortunately, he stumbled over that one.

"It is this silent swerving from accuracy by an inch, that is the uncanny element in everything. It seems a sort of secret treason in the Universe . . . Everywhere in things there is this element of the quiet and incalculable."

63 posted on 04/27/2002 9:11:08 AM PDT by Matchett-PI
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To: Matchett-PI
If you like Chesterton you will like books on synchronicity. Some that I have read are The World within the World by John D Barrow, The New Ambidextrous Universe (Revised edition) by Martin Gardner. Then there's In Search of the Big Bang (Quantum Physics and Cosmology) by John Gribbin. I'm sure there are many more newer books out as well. I enjoyed Faster than Light (Superluminal Loopholes in Physics) by Nick Herbert, PhD. And if you aren't a mathematician, like me, there's Ivars Peterson's The Mathematical Tourist. A very sweet little book if it's still available is Emblems of Mind (the inner life of music and mathematics) by Edward Rothstein.

The two scientists who proposed the universe that I mentioned yesterday are Paul Steinhardt, a Princeton astrophysicist and Neil Turok of Cambridge.

I think no one's model is quite correct because there's so much they don't and never will completely understand. What's interesting is the Jewish religion has a model of Creation which tells just how it was done, but of course, they will not believe it. Mathematics, geometry and music all play a role in all five dimensions that concern us.

I don't know if you know what fractals are but they are beautiful concepts to read about and there are many sites online where you can see some. Just reading about the Mandelbrot set and how it was discovered is fascinating. After you read all this stuff go back and take a walk through the Hebrew bible. You will never be the same.

64 posted on 04/27/2002 10:41:59 AM PDT by la$tminutepardon
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To: Corin Stormhands; The Grammarian; winstonchurchill; Revelation 911; Alas; RnMomof7...
I am interested in continuing our discussion of the Lie of Eden, but I think that this is a good time to pause and reflect on the fact that there are all sorts of professing Christians. Some are real Christians.

Some people are more evidently committed to the Lord's true religion than others are.

For example, worship services are an important part of their lives. They have an obvious assurance of salvation. They expect the atoning Lamb to cover all of their miscellaneous sins. They are committed to extending the influence of God's people, and they are energetic in bringing others into the fold.

They are concerned about morality. They are obviously decent folks. They do good works. They study the Bible. They insist on orthodoxy. They pray. They publicly thank God for His goodness to them. The confess Him before men. They are family-oriented. They bring up their children in God's covenant community. Religious traditions are pretty serious matters with them.

They do not take these things lightly! This is important!

65 posted on 04/27/2002 11:50:15 AM PDT by the_doc
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To: White Mountain; restornu; Cubicle Guy
On the Predestination thread, in your post #964, you said:

Why the emphasis on the thoughts in your head, and so little said about our daily walk, applying the teachings of the Bible to our daily life, living a righteous, Christlike life? Let us obey Him and trust in Him that He is faithful and will keep His promises, and that the words of the prophets shall not fail. May God bless you and yours and be a light to your path!

#65, above, is my best response.

66 posted on 04/27/2002 12:27:00 PM PDT by the_doc
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To: la$tminutepardon
I just ran across this thought it fit into our conversation:

COVENANT OF WORKS, the constitution under which Adam was placed at his creation. In this covenant, ( 1.) The contracting parties were ( a) God the moral Governor, and ( b) Adam, a free moral agent, and representative of all his natural posterity ( Rom 5:12-19). ( 2.) The promise was "life" ( Mat 19:16,17; Gal 3:12). ( 3.) The condition was perfect obedience to the law, the test in this case being abstaining from eating the fruit of the "tree of knowledge," etc. ( 4.) The penalty was death ( Gen 2:16,17).

This covenant is also called a covenant of nature, as made with man in his natural or unfallen state; a covenant of life, because "life" was the promise attached to obedience; and a legal covenant, because it demanded perfect obedience to the law.

The "tree of life" was the outward sign and seal of that life which was promised in the covenant, and hence it is usually called the seal of that covenant.

This covenant is abrogated under the gospel, inasmuch as Christ has fulfilled all its conditions in behalf of his people, and now offers salvation on the condition of faith. It is still in force, however, as it rests on the immutable justice of God, and is binding on all who have not fled to Christ and accepted his righteousness.

67 posted on 04/27/2002 3:02:30 PM PDT by RnMomof7
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To: RnMomof7,the_doc
The "tree of life" was the outward sign and seal of that life which was promised in the covenant, and hence it is usually called the seal of that covenant.

Yes I can agree with this. After all, Who is the Tree of Life? For those who have ears to hear, it just gets curioser and curioser.......

68 posted on 04/27/2002 3:19:43 PM PDT by la$tminutepardon
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To: RnMomof7,the_doc
The "tree of life" was the outward sign and seal of that life which was promised in the covenant, and hence it is usually called the seal of that covenant.

Yes I can agree with this. After all, Who is the Tree of Life? For those who have ears to hear, it just gets curioser and curioser.......

69 posted on 04/27/2002 3:20:00 PM PDT by la$tminutepardon
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To: la$tminutepardon;the-doc
Think that the New Covenent was sealed on a tree...and with blood

doc .........trees trees trees..

70 posted on 04/27/2002 3:25:10 PM PDT by RnMomof7
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To: RnMomof7
The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil and the Tree of Life obviously do correspond to Adam and Christ, respectively.
71 posted on 04/27/2002 3:32:54 PM PDT by the_doc
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To: the_doc
The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil and the Tree of Life obviously do correspond to Adam and Christ, respectively

Not so obvious to me I am waiting for it to come out as a movie ! *****giggle*****

72 posted on 04/27/2002 3:58:34 PM PDT by RnMomof7
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To: RnMomof7, the_doc
We're going to read Revelation chapter 22 to you (but not 9:11)
73 posted on 04/27/2002 4:01:12 PM PDT by la$tminutepardon
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To: la$tminutepardon
I have read Rev 22 (many times)..it is one of my favorite chapters..I love the imagery...but I never got the impression that Jesus was the tree of life....I just wondered that the tree of life was now in heaven...and we could now eat of it..duuuuhhh never made that connection
74 posted on 04/27/2002 4:11:35 PM PDT by RnMomof7
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To: la$tminutepardon; RnMomof7
Ooooohh, I just noticed that Revelation 9:11 is an ominous verse.
75 posted on 04/27/2002 4:15:58 PM PDT by the_doc
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To: RnMomof7
well you had it right though as it means a gibbet as well as a tree. I guess we can also use scripture to reaffirm it as we get "root" "branch" "rod" "staff" etc. all referring to the Messiah.
76 posted on 04/27/2002 4:18:45 PM PDT by la$tminutepardon
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To: the_doc
Ooooohh, I just noticed that Revelation 9:11 is an ominous verse

I know

77 posted on 04/27/2002 4:20:13 PM PDT by la$tminutepardon
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To: the_doc, RnMomof7
very creepy...
78 posted on 04/27/2002 4:22:27 PM PDT by la$tminutepardon
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To: the_doc
Makes ya wonder why anyone would name themself that huh?
79 posted on 04/27/2002 4:33:25 PM PDT by RnMomof7
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To: la$tminutepardon
Well I feel a little better Matthew Henry missed it too:>)
80 posted on 04/27/2002 4:54:13 PM PDT by RnMomof7
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