Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Common Creationist Arguments - Pseudoscience
http://www.stardestroyer.net/Creationism/Arguments/Pseudoscience.shtml ^

Posted on 03/13/2002 4:47:26 AM PST by JediGirl

click here to read article


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 1,761-1,7801,781-1,8001,801-1,820 ... 2,461-2,474 next last
To: Doctor Stochastic
" You haven't shown that new genes cannot be acquired. "

Not in that post, no. The sole purpose of that post is/was to show what a proof of macro-evolution would be and to show why the definition was reasonable. I was not trying to debate the possibility of macro-evolution. In fact, what I was doing was setting a challenge to evolutionists to show some proof of macro-evolution.

1,781 posted on 03/24/2002 9:36:46 PM PST by gore3000
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1779 | View Replies]

To: gore3000
Ok. Then if the acquisition of new genes were to be demonstrated, that would be evidence of macro-evolution.
1,782 posted on 03/24/2002 9:40:26 PM PST by Doctor Stochastic
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1781 | View Replies]

To: Doctor Stochastic
Why should we believe your claims about the Bible rather than the Indians's claims about the Vedas?

You can believe what you want, it's a free country. You can believe in the Bible, you can believe in the Vedas, you can even believe in the demi-god Charles if you like. All I am saying is that the Bible has the answer as to how life originated and was created and that evolution contradicts the Bible.

1,783 posted on 03/24/2002 9:41:26 PM PST by gore3000
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1780 | View Replies]

To: Doctor Stochastic
Then if the acquisition of new genes were to be demonstrated, that would be evidence of macro-evolution.

This is what I said and I stand by it for the reasons I explained:

So to sum up. Macro-evolution is a transformation requiring new genes, more complexity and new faculties. In terms of genetics, it requires at a minimum the creation of more than one new gene. In terms of taxonomy it would require an organism to change into a different genus

1,784 posted on 03/24/2002 9:47:33 PM PST by gore3000
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1782 | View Replies]

To: PatrickHenry
Lurking ...
1,785 posted on 03/25/2002 1:52:16 AM PST by PatrickHenry
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1784 | View Replies]

To: Tribune7
Do you really think the brontosaurus acutally existed?

Yes, although the species was renamed "apatosaur." Why would you not think it existed? Don't tell me you're one of those "the fossil record is a conspiracy to damn us all to perdition" fellas.

1,786 posted on 03/25/2002 1:54:21 AM PST by Junior
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1771 | View Replies]

To: PatrickHenry
Lurking ...

Me too! :)

1,787 posted on 03/25/2002 1:56:15 AM PST by RadioAstronomer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1785 | View Replies]

To: Tribune7
Do you really think the brontosaurus acutally existed?

Yes. They call it the Apatosaurus now but the species is still studied. If it's been overthrown, you have a scoop. (Oh, that's right. You already have a scoop. There has been no evolution.)

Usually, though when examples are provided they are disappointingly anti-climatic. Can you provide an example? Remember, we are talking about macro-evolution.

I can't tell you how this sounds this far along on this thread. gore3000 told me a long time ago that, for all you can tell from a fossil, there were mammary glands on dinosaurs.

Yes, that sort of soft tissue has not been preserved. And ID, with it's non-second-guessable Designer, seems to have little to say on the subject.

Evolution has a line of reasoning that says there were no teats on a T. rex. I've challenged gore, who likes to model things with evolution to show how impossible it is, to reproduce this simple syllogism. He has so far failed. Aquinasfan failed to answer on this one as well.

Maybe you can help them out. Why does an evolutionary framework say Mrs. T was a flat-chested as Mr. T?

I think this might be the real point. The model is broken but it's all people have so they hang onto it like a starving dog hangs onto a bone.

On this point, you're supposed to defend how ID really tells you something. To continue to attack evolution here is to stay stuck on the last item, which is where you feel more comfortable.

I can see why you don't want to defend ID as science. It's the most pitiful of contentless shams.

1,788 posted on 03/25/2002 3:41:55 AM PST by VadeRetro
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1771 | View Replies]

To: sayfer bullets
Fair enough, but your church has possession of science classes.

My "church" is doing all the scientific inquiry and has all the scientists who are still asking questions.

Your post confirms that creationists think everything's about religion. That's why the people who are still creationists make lousy scientists. They're the people who have stopped asking questions, or maybe never were asking questions.

The people who still are asking questions stopped being creationists in the 19th century.

1,789 posted on 03/25/2002 3:46:20 AM PST by VadeRetro
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1770 | View Replies]

To: Tribune7; AndrewC
Sometimes there are problems calibrating the clocks. I saw mtDNA attacked as particularly unreliable last year.

This does not help you that much. There's noise in everything in real life. There's also signal and it's real and convincing if you have a brain and it's not turned off.

The line of evidence that comes from these clocks tends to confirm the results from elsewhere. To the extent you want to say some reliability problems are fatal, tell AndrewC.

He thinks molecular evidence trumps all other lines of evidence, always. Maybe not always. When he needs it.

1,790 posted on 03/25/2002 3:54:35 AM PST by VadeRetro
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1772 | View Replies]

To: oldcats
You cannot fathom that a Christian can believe in evolution can you?

If you're a Christian that means you beleive in God and automatically creation--only...no matter how God accomplished it.

Creationism via God--"evolution" right?

That isn't complicated...

and likewise...

an atheist can not believe in creation either---only evolution!

You have to be crazy--in two non communicating pieces to be both---opposites!

No right--no wrong--no sense...atheism/secular humanism---EVOLUTION.

Creationism cancels out the relevance of evolution unless you collect/trade Christmas wrapping paper--ribbons--boxes?

Completely unless you are in the paper-rags--bones--scrap business!

1,791 posted on 03/25/2002 3:55:30 AM PST by f.Christian
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1752 | View Replies]

To: gore3000
SHOW ME THE BONES OF THESE HOMO SAPIENS, SCIENTIFICALLY CLASSIFIED AS HOMO SAPIENS WHICH YOU SAY WERE AROUND AFTER 200,000 YEARS AGO.

That would make this the third thread I've filled up with archaic Homo sapiens skulls just to answer you on this point. Why is this necessary?

Ah, but wait! Now you're saying "after 200,000 years ago," not before? Are you declaring a skinny gap from 200,000 years ago to 120,000 years ago? Or would anything after 200,000 years ago do? You forgot the upper limit on your gap. How about some skulls from last week?.

Earlier, your gap was from 400,000 years ago (the approximate end of H. erectus) to 100,000 years ago. Has your position evolved?

Your gaps are getting smaller than the error bars in dating most of these skulls. I don't see where that helps you.

But settle down and just tell us what you're trying to tell us.

1,792 posted on 03/25/2002 4:06:49 AM PST by VadeRetro
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1777 | View Replies]

To: gore3000
You agree with me that the definitions of speciation are nonsense but you call my calling for at least a genus change for macro-evolution to be mush.

What did I say and how does what you say I said differ?

1,793 posted on 03/25/2002 4:08:42 AM PST by VadeRetro
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1778 | View Replies]

To: VadeRetro
No Vade, there is no such thing as "archaic" anything. Classified finds have names, they have a species name. And the upper age for homo sapiens is 100,000 years ago not 120,000. This is the 3rd or 4th post where you make an excuse instead of delivering the goods.
1,794 posted on 03/25/2002 4:18:10 AM PST by gore3000
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1792 | View Replies]

To: gore3000
You state the evolution has been disproven. Please supply FACTS that prove it wrong. Now as you are so fond of doing, let me put some of MY stipulations on your proof....
1. The Bible does not count. It is based on faith, NOT on facts...
2.Your facts must be colaborated and tested, with similar results from each test...
I know you are going to say that these are unfair, but they are not less fair than the stipulations that you always put on our theory.
Oldcats
1,795 posted on 03/25/2002 4:44:01 AM PST by oldcats
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1773 | View Replies]

To: Tribune7
If I come to conclude that Man along with all animals and plants are descended from a common ancestor, it will be with the understanding that it was God -- our Creator -- who set everything in motion.

No problem there, but the motion is what scientists study, not the creation.

1,796 posted on 03/25/2002 4:46:03 AM PST by js1138
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1616 | View Replies]

To: gore3000
Brain size is relevant in a couple of ways. The parts of the prain that deal with specific sensory processing are larger, proportionally, in animals that rely on a specific sense. thus dogs have a greater percentage of their brain devoted to smell, and hawks have a greater percentage devoted to sight.

When you say humans are smarter than elephants you are simply saying that humans have language. And the relevant parts of the human brain are larger.

Animals with larger brains -- particularly in proportion to their overall weight -- are smarter than those with smaller brains.

1,797 posted on 03/25/2002 4:54:32 AM PST by js1138
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1622 | View Replies]

To: VadeRetro
Your post confirms that creationists think everything's about religion.

To communists, everything is a class struggle. To a child with a hammer, everything's a nail. Same thing.

1,798 posted on 03/25/2002 5:04:41 AM PST by Junior
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1789 | View Replies]

To: gore3000
the upper age for homo sapiens is 100,000 years ago not 120,000.

Considering morphologically H. Erectus shades into H. Sapiens over this time period, and Vade has already shown you skulls from this time frame, and has also explained to you the nomenclature surrounding Homo Sapiens Sapiens and Archaic Homo Sapiens. Your inability to grasp even simple concepts does not speak well for your ability to grasp something as involved as the theory of evolution. Which lends credence to our theory as to why you cannot answer Vade's question dealing with teats on dinosaurs -- you really don't have any idea of that which you speak in regards to the theory of evolution.

1,799 posted on 03/25/2002 5:15:26 AM PST by Junior
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1794 | View Replies]

To: gore3000
I have indeed put a lot of thought into this, and I am still convinced that evolution DOES occur. This does not conflict with my theological beliefs. Sorry that your faith is too rigid to accept new ideas.
As for me not having other problems with your post, I was addressing the personal attack (and both of us know it was). There has been many many number of other posts that adress evolution, so I will let them speak for themselves.
As I have stated before, I am neither an athiest nor materialist. I do believe in God and in His Son. Yet I also believe in science. I do not see evolution disproving God. I am comfortable with my beliefs. Shouldn't that be good enough? As for others that believe in evolution, I don't care what their spirituality or other beliefs are. Are you happy with being lumped in with every other Christian? Are you happy to be lumped in Jerry Falwell or Jimmy Swaggart (didn't one of them have repeated affairs while married?) or a con-man like Jim Baker?
You accuse me of not adressing all your questions, yrt you did the same with part of mine. DO you take the Bible literaly...word for word?
Oldcat
1,800 posted on 03/25/2002 5:23:07 AM PST by oldcats
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1775 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 1,761-1,7801,781-1,8001,801-1,820 ... 2,461-2,474 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson