Is The Roman Catholic View of the Eucharist Supported by the Historical Evidence?

In Plain Site ^ | Jason Engwer

[HossB86]

Look. Apparently you have forgotten the original posting you made, and the question I asked you about it. Let's revisit it again...

"Nice dodge. What is your scriptural proof that Christ is continually being sacrificed. That was your assertion and that was the proof that I requested of you.

Why are you evading the question? What is the scriptural proof for Christ's continuing sacrifice?

Let me give you a hint: there is none. The only "proof" is a bunch of pap made up by the Roman Catholic Cult and sold as "Holy Tradition."

"Holy Tradition" == False Gospel.

Here's some scriptural proof that refutes what you're trying to sell: Luke 24:4-7: "While they were perplexed about this, behold, two men stood by them in dazzling apparel. 5 And as they were frightened and bowed their faces to the ground, the men said to them, “Why do you seek the living among the dead? 6 He is not here, but has risen. Remember how he told you, while he was still in Galilee, 7 that the Son of Man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men and be crucified and on the third day rise.”"

Hmmm. Doesn't sound like he's still on the cross. Let's see... Even Christ HIMSELF refutes your assertion: John19:20 "When Jesus had received the sour wine, he said, “It is finished,” and he bowed his head and gave up his spirit."

What was finished, I wonder? The once and final sacrifice for our sins? Did you catch that? FINISHED..

Let's see if there's anything else... Mark 16:19 "So then the Lord Jesus, gafter he had spoken to them, was taken up into heaven and sat down at the right hand of God."

Aaaaand.... Luke 22:69 "69 But from now on the Son of Man shall be seated at the right hand of the power of God.”"

Hmmmm. Oddly, Jesus is seated at the right hand of the Father.... in direct opposition to your claim!

But wait -- we have a witness to the fact! Acts 7: 55-56 "But he [Stephan], full of the Holy Spirit, gazed into heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God. 56 And he said, “Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God.”

So...again, I ask, what is your scriptural PROOF that Christ is being continually crucified/sacrificed??

Hoss"

So, now that we're back on the same page...

What is your scriptural PROOF that Christ is being continually crucified/sacrificed??

Your last posting to me had nothing to do with the question. Can you answer this? If there is scriptural proof, I assume you can provide it. Why won't you answer this question?

Hoss

[rwa265]

I was told about two Jesuit priests who said to one another: “Finally! We have a Pope we understand.” I’m not so sure I do.

I’ll say this about him. He sure knows how to stir the pot.

[LurkingSince'98]

The Sanctus

The Sanctus has been a part of the Mass from the first century AD and its Jewish roots go back even farther. The first part of the chant is based upon Isaiah 6:3 and Daniel 7:10. The second part is based on Mt 21:9. The chant unites our voices with those of the saints and angels in heaven into one song of praise of God.

HOLY, holy, holy, Lord God of hosts. Heaven and earth are full of Thy glory. Hosanna in the highest. Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord. Hosanna in the highest.

For the Greater Glory of God

[terycarl]

Nope, ask Elsie or look back a few posts...some Popes have said and done stupid things and I am under NO obligation to follow those thoughts.... And the CURRENT one? You following or murmuring?

Following....WAY to early to discern exactly what he is trying to accomplish but I will stay tuned and judge his actions as they progress...

[terycarl]

I guess Catholics have a REALLY good reason that they have NOT barricaded the doors of the 'health clinics' where human lives are SNUFFED out at the rate of approximately 3,300 every working day.

I have actually done that, and even attended the march in Washington D.C. Years ago....if only those protestant doctors would cease their operations the clinics would close...

[HossB86]

The Sanctus [....]

You just cannot provide an answer, can you? When confronted with the fallacies and lies of the Catholic Cult, when faced with a direct question about a statement YOU made, you cannot answer it directly without showing the falsehoods and lies of the Catholic Cult.

What are the scriptural proofs that Christ is being continually sacrificed? It's a simple question: either provide the scripture, or admit that your position was incorrect.

It's that easy. If you continue to avoid answering, then the lack of an answer will suffice to say that you were incorrect.

Proof?

Hoss

[terycarl]

While I realize that sheer numbers aren't the proof of anything, they at least indicate something. I have no concept of how many Catholics that there have been since the time of Christ...about 1.3 billion right now...and you maintain that they are all wrong and the handful of protestants that happen to belong to whichever of the 20,000 or so denominations that you follow are right??? O.K., I'll play the odds and go with the Catholics. That is the stupidest thing I have ever heard.

uhhhh...O.K., you go with the 432 people in your "denomination"...I'll stick with untold billions of Catholics who are right....whatever...

[terycarl]

I see logic is not a requirement in catholic seminary school.

you are a protestant and you bring up the subject of logic???....O.K. I guess......snicker

[CommerceComet]

I’m glad to see some egregious comments deleted. Some people need to be shown the time-out corner. They are long on insult and short on answers.

[terycarl]

Gallup (2012) reports that 82% of catholics believe birth control is ok.

Birth control is perfectly O.K......artificial contraceptives are not....Family planning is actually taught by Catholics....use approved methods and even God smiles.

[CynicalBear]

Please prove that Linus was even a Bishop.

[terycarl]

She said NOThing except; "Let it be as you have said." The angel told her what was going down; period.

yeah....that free will stuff is way overrated...probably doesn't apply to everybody...

[ealgeone]

Birth control is perfectly O.K......artificial contraceptives are not....Family planning is actually taught by Catholics....use approved methods and even God smiles.

Discuss amongst yourselves!

[LurkingSince'98]

agree completely

it’s called Natural Family Planning, a very sophisticated version of the “rhythm method” of years back

nothing artificial and from surveys of Catholics using this method separation and divorce rates long term are a fraction of one percent.

and God smiles

[LurkingSince'98]

there is NO requirement that a Pope must be a bishop first, what makes you think that he must?

[LurkingSince'98]

The main testimony of the New Testament lies in the account of the institution of the Eucharist, and most clearly in the words of consecration spoken over the chalice. For this reason we shall consider these words first, since thereby, owing to the analogy between the two formulas clearer light will be thrown on the meaning of the words of consecration spoken over the chalice. For this reason we shall consider these words first, since thereby, owing to the analogy between the two formulae, clearer light will be thrown on the meaning of the words of consecration pronounced over the bread. For the sake of clearness and easy comparison we subjoin the four passages in Greek and English:

Matthew 26:28: Touto gar estin to aima mou to tes [kaines] diathekes to peri pollon ekchynnomenon eis aphesin amartion. For this is my blood of the new testament, which shall be shed for many unto remission of sins.
Mark 14:24: Touto estin to aima mou tes kaines diathekes to yper pollon ekchynnomenon. This is my blood of the new testament which shall be shed for many.
Luke 22:20: Touto to poterion he kaine diatheke en to aimati mou, to yper ymon ekchynnomenon. This is the chalice, the new testament in my blood, which shall be shed for you.
1 Corinthians 11:25: Touto to poterion he kaine diatheke estin en to emo aimati. This chalice is the new testament in my blood.

The Divine institution of the sacrifice of the altar is proved by showing

that the “shedding of blood” spoken of in the text took place there and then and not for the first time on the cross;
that it was a true and real sacrifice;
that it was considered a permanent institution in the Church.

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/10006a.htm

Ad Majoram Dei Gloriam

[rwa265]

If you are truly interested in learning why Catholics believe as they do that Christ is continually sacrificed, you can find the explanation in The Catechism of the Catholic Church; Part Two. The Celebration of the Christian Mystery; Section Two. The Seven Sacraments of the Church; Chapter One. The Sacraments of Christian Initiation; Article 3. The Sacrament of the Eucharist; paragraphs 1322 - 1419.

This belief is based on the understanding that:

1) Jesus was speaking literally when he said: “I am the living bread that came down from heaven; if any one eats of this bread, he will live for ever;... he who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life and... abides in me, and I in him” (1406)

2) At the Last Supper, on the night he was betrayed, our Savior instituted the Eucharistic sacrifice of his Body and Blood in order to perpetuate the sacrifice of the cross throughout the ages until he should come again. (1323)

Many of his disciples did not accept this understanding and no longer followed him. Even Peter did not say he accepted it. When Jesus asked the Twelve if they wanted to leave, Peter said: “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life. We have come to believe and to know that you are the Holy One of God.” I have a feeling, though, that when Jesus was not around, the Twelve had many discussions wondering what Jesus meant.

In any event, this is what Catholics believe, and John 6 and the Last Supper narratives are the basis for that belief.