Questions for "Bible Christians" that they can't answer - Part 2

Catholic Convert ^ | October 27, 2013 | David Palm and Steve Ray

[CynicalBear]

>>Then Mary and Joe blew it bigtime too, huh?<<

Nope, Joseph was specifically told what to name Him.

Matthew 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS (Iésous): for he shall save his people from their sins.

[CynicalBear]

>>They had consulted with the Pharisee scholars of their day to do the translation of the Masorite scrolls, and they had been heavily influenced by them in that process to NOT disclose his name because part of his name reveals the name of Yehova.<<

You were there!!! Wow! If not, would you please show your documented proof that “they had consulted with the Pharisee scholars of their day”?

[editor-surveyor]

>> “When I learned that Jesus was a combination of Hebrew words that meant “God who saves us”, I praised the Lord and I knew what people meant when they said “Yeshua HaMashiach”, but it didn't prevent my salvation or change the way I spoke His name in my prayers, my sharing of the gospel nor in reference to Him” <<

Speaking the real name Yehova has immense power. It changes your life, and the lives of those upon whom you confer his traditional blessing:

Numbers 6:

[22] And Yehova spake unto Moses, saying,
[23] Speak unto Aaron and unto his sons, saying, On this wise ye shall bless the children of Israel, saying unto them,
[24] Yehova bless thee, and keep thee:
[25] Yehova make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee:
[26] Yehova lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.
[27] And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them

Those are the most powerful sentences one can ever speak upon another.

[CynicalBear]

>>You do realize the site is a Jewish Christian site?<<

Yes I did. That’s why I thought it was particularly of interest. I would surely take their word over those Jewish wannabees here.

[editor-surveyor]

You have to be joking!

You’ve never read the accounts of the translation of the KJV Bible?

Explains a lot.

[CynicalBear]

You didn’t read it all did you?

[roamer_1]

So you say that’s the only name to use in naming Jesus ey? Many can play that silly game

ROTFLMAO!!! LoL! You crack me up! ANYTHING but admit His Name.

Those of us who actually have faith in God that He indeed could and did preserve His word for us today understand that He indeed did inspire all of scripture including the New Testament in Greek. Cast you doubts about those words of God that He preserved for us at your own risk. We have dealt with those who cast doubts on the word of God in these forums before and each time God’s word wins. He preserved those words in the Greek.

LOL! Sooo. It can be translated with authority into ANY other language EXCEPT Hebrew, eh? It can be Hellenized, Latinized, Paganized, Anglicized, but NOT, EVER, NEVER 'normalized' to the nation that the players actually ARE, en-cultured to how THEY lived! And Lo! If meaningful and extraordinary Hebraisms miraculously appear, Why that can ONLY be coincidence! And what of Aramaic? Are not the Aramaic Gospels preserved as well? Can you conclusively PROVE the Old Syriac came from the Greek? No you can't because even the best scholars cannot admit that in unison.

As to the Names of Yahweh, Do you suppose it is a coincidence that every_single_one of them are HEBREW and have an HEBREW meaning?

That 'Iesous' must be preserved when it admits in itself the Hebrew ORIGINAL 'Yeshua' is an utterly hilarious proposition! Especially when you stop to consider that every_single_name for Yeshua is ALSO ORIGINALLY HEBREW.

His NAME is Yeshua! That Jesus transliterates from Yeshua in a contracted or 'endearing' form rather than the proper and formal Yahushua only further confirms it's Hebrew origin. So tell me again how the transliterated 'iesous' is the name above all names!

Look, you can call him Jesus all day long. I don't care what you do. But for me to be criticized for calling Him Yeshua, which is undoubtedly his actual name, is wholly beyond absurd. His name resides where it's meaning is found.

You may keep your Greek Primacy - I don't believe it.

[editor-surveyor]

You do of course realize that Jesus and Iésous are not the same?

Iésous is the Greek transliteration of Joshua, which uses the soft J! Not Jesus unless you pronounce the J as traditional, like a Y.

[CynicalBear]

I don’t use just the KJV. I find that the original Greek is always the final go to source.

[editor-surveyor]

This thread has become comic relief!

You just can’t make this stuff up.

[CynicalBear]

>> But for me to be criticized for calling Him Yeshua,<<

You’re not being criticized for calling Him Yeshua. You can call Him anything you see fit. You’re being criticized in part because you cast doubts on the infallibility of the New Testament and you say that those who call Him Jesus are wrong.

That’s part of the problem with people who come in here with teaching contrary to scripture. They always try to hide behind obfuscation and won’t admit what they are actually being challenged on.

>>You may keep your Greek Primacy - I don't believe it.<<

Thus my explanation above.

[editor-surveyor]

Then why do you argue against what the Greek says his name is?

[editor-surveyor]

>> “That’s part of the problem with people who come in here with teaching contrary to scripture” <<

That again would be you.

[CynicalBear]

>>The Greek MS proffer the ‘Y’ sound, but you demand the modern ‘hard’ J.<<

Oh really? You can read my mind now? Are you standing around the corner spying on me or something that you can say “you demand the modern ‘hard’ J”? Or do you live your entire life on assumptions?

[redleghunter]

You make a very important logical point.

I am no theologian, but pinged one above:)

Yeshua: "Savior"; "the salvation of the Lord"; God (YHVH) delivers or saves (his people).

Jesus (Ἰησοῦς Iēsous): "God Saves; (is) salvation; "Yahweh is salvation

I do believe we are discussing the Same King of Kings and Lord of Lords who was nailed to a cross for our sins, died, was buried and three days later rose from the dead and is now sitting at the Right Hand of The Father in Heaven.

You proclaim Yeshua HaMashiach...you do well.

We proclaim Jesus The Christ...we do well.

The Chinese proclaim Yesu Jido...they do well.

All of the above proclaim the Messiah (Christ) of the NT. All of the above proclaim the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the ‘A’ and the ‘Z, The One "who loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood, and has made us kings and priests to His God and Father, to Him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen."

Now that we are all on the same "page" what else should we discuss?

[metmom]

The other thing people are being criticized for is legalistically demanding everyone do it their way over something they have been convicted by God of.

One of the best definitions of legalism that I’ve ever seen is being personally convicted by God of something and then demanding everyone else do it as well.

This is what’s going on here. I don’t see anywhere in Scripture that any of this stuff on the name of Jesus is of consequence regarding one’s salvation, any more than what day one worships on is.

God knows the heart and accepts the one who trusts His Messiah by faith, whatever language they speak.

[CynicalBear]

>>Then why do you argue against what the Greek says his name is?<<

Say what? His name in the Greek text is Jesus ((Iésous). I have shown that now multiple times.

[editor-surveyor]

Dither dither.

[editor-surveyor]

Iésous is Joshua.

[CynicalBear]

Well said. We do not however cast doubt in the minds of those babes in Christ as to the authenticity of the New Testament as we have it in the Greek. It is that which I see as insidious.