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Childish behavior |
Posted on 01/16/2013 8:57:49 AM PST by marshmallow
Enoch 1:1 Implies restoration during tribulation - not congruent with scriptures.
Enoch 1:8 In conflict with the doctrine that peace was made at the cross.
Enoch 2:2-3 Contradicts 2 Pet 3:3-7
Enoch 6:3 Semjaza is listed as the leader of the angels, which is not scriptural
There are more than 30 others. Need I go on?
I point them to scripture not to doctrines developed thousands of years later.
>> Wouldn't it be better if the lurkers were able to see your statement of faith, compare it to scripture,<<
I have no statements of faith other than scripture.
>> In essence, by insisting that your interpretation of scripture is correct because YOU only base your beliefs on scripture that you are, in fact making doctrine for all who read your posts.<<
So youre saying that holding to scripture as my only doctrine is me making doctrine? Say what?
>> In other words, your denomination is the Church of Cynical Bear, and YOU are the final authority since it is your interpretation that is the Truth and anyone disputing that doctrine is espousing false doctrine.<<
Dispute the scripture? Dispute the scripture? Really?
No, dispute YOUR interpretation of scripture. Unless you are infallible, your interpretation of scripture is not TRUTH. It is your opinion.
Do you claim to be infallible in your interpretation of any and all verses in the Bible? Or do you think that there are some ideas you may have developed about certain verses which just might be..... (gasp).... wrong?
Take heed lest you fall.
I dont interpret scripture. I let scripture interpret scripture. You will not see an interpretation by me other than scripture that discounts or clarifies something that has been posted.
I think you are being disingenuous. Obviously if you get any meaning at all out of any scripture you are engaged in interpreting it.
Thanks for the discussion. It has been..... enlightening.
After a thousand post I can't tell if you are a Trinitarian or a modalist, an Arminian or a Pelagian, a Word of Faith or a Church of God follower, a Campbellite or a Unitarian. If your purpose here was to sew confusion and advocate for doctrinal anarchy, then you've succeeded. If your purpose was to sew harmony and enlighten the lurkers and edify the body of Christ, then I think you didn't quite achieve your goals.
But I've been wrong before.
I'm out of here.
My purpose was and is to point to Christ and His word rather than all those other denominations which try to insert themselves in between us and Christ. Gods word is the source of all truth and the only infallible source.
You're not the first.
Adios Muchacho.
According to Scripture, our eternal destiny IS sealed forever by faith. So, if that means we have been given the faith of Christ when we believe in Him, we ARE sealed with the Holy Spirit until the day of redemption and we are forever HIS. I think far too much is being made of the words "in" and "of". If you looked at an online parallel Bible at Galatians 2:20, it's about 50/50 for "faith OF Christ" and "faith IN Christ". Of course, the translators often use words in English that best impart the original languages' meanings and in order to do that they add extra words. The KJV designates added words by using italics, and it is understood that it means the word was "added by the translators". This ongoing nattering over the right word seems to have lost the point.
If people such as Copeland deduce they are "little gods" because they have the "faith of God", then that is their own peculiar interpretation, outside of Scripture. We certainly have other Scriptures that adequately disprove such an UN-orthodox belief. And that really IS the special quality of believing the Bible is our rule of faith. Accepting sola Scriptura essentially means that all truth claims for the Christian faith must be measured BY Scripture. It does NOT mean that there are no other resources available to a Christian who seeks to understand his faith - including those gifted to the church in the forms of teachers, pastors, etc. Believing in the sufficiency of God's word places these people as subordinate to the scriptures and not the other way around as some religions do.
See post 1005.
It sure is HD.
"..denial of the Trinity.."
Who did that? because if that's one of the interesting things you find out then it's no wonder this thread has gone the way it's gone.
The flesh is glorying in much of this thread...just saying
I mentioned that there were two different Greek words that were translated as "free will". And, yes, Strong's DOES relate the word to free will:
authairetos
adjective
1) voluntary, of free choice, of one's own accord http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=G830&t=KJV
Thayer's Lexicon help says:
That they are not used in terms of salvation, is beside the point as the discussion has been about there being any free will by man. I wanted to respond to the false, in my view, assertion that "nowhere in the Bible is free will mentioned" and to counter the disparagement, again in my view, of those who hold to the doctrine of sola Scriptura. We have already seen comments on this thread that mock SS and who point to the disagreements going on here between non-Catholics to demonstrate its failure. I don't agree with them that SS is to blame for conflicting doctrines among Christians.
How I define salvation is no different than what the Bible says - it is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ and not by works. I have no desire to argue predestination versus free will as I have already noted I believe the truth is in the realm that our present finite minds can only get a glimpse. I know that without faith it is impossible to please God and he that comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him (Heb. 11:6).
I hope you have a blessed day.
Seeing that this thread (d)evolved into a discussion over Calvinism and Armenianism - areas many Christians view as genuinely interesting but not rising to the level of essential salvific dogma - it is sad that fellow believers feel they must criticize and demean each other just because they disagree on the subject. God saw fit to leave certain areas hazy in Scripture. While on other essential topics, He leaves no room over which to quibble. Why He did this, we can only guess, but perhaps one reason is to teach us to love each other as Christ loves us - and He continues to even when we stray from His path. We can love and respect each other and still not agree on everything. On essentials - unity; non-essentials - liberty, on all things - charity.
Would you like me to post where someone won't admit to the Trinity? Same thing.
So is the Westminster Confession sound doctrine? Way back somewhere on this thread you stated that it was too long to read.
Well, Hebrews 6 states the following:
2) faith toward God
3) baptisms
4) laying on of hands
5) resurrection of the dead
6) eternal judgment
Mat_16:12 Then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.
Mar_1:22 And they were astonished at his doctrine: for he taught them as one that had authority, and not as the scribes.
Joh_7:16 Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.
And, contrary to what people may think about the love of God, God is very concerned that we preach sound doctrine. He does not like it when we say things that are not true about Him.
1 Corinthians 2:2 For I determined not to know anything among you, except Jesus Christ, and him crucified.
Where does all the anger for those who choose not to identify with todays denominations come from? Christ didnt establish separate denominations or separate bodies of Christ. The apostles didnt teach to follow one of them in one town and another one of them in a different town. Paul said it well in his letter to the Corinthians.
1 Corinthians 3: 3 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ.
2 I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
3 For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?
4 For while one saith, I am of Paul; and another, I am of Apollos; are ye not carnal?
5 Who then is Paul, and who is Apollos, but ministers by whom ye believed, even as the Lord gave to every man?
6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.
7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.
8 Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour.
9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
Division in the body of Christ is not from God. Identifying with one denomination or another isnt what Christ or the apostles taught. Paul called that type of idea carnal and not spiritual.
The need to pigeonhole people into one denominational belief system or another is indeed carnal. And its not something new as can be seen in Pauls letter to the Corinthians. Whats the point of demanding that believers identify with one denomination or another? To somehow understand what someone believes? That doesnt work too well. In fact its rather dangerous. Especially as the end times draw nearer. I can go through each denomination and find beliefs that conflict with scripture. The idea of identifying with different denominations would be one of them as we can see in the example of the Corinthians.
Do all Calvinists believe that homosexual orientation is not a sin as stated in the FAQs about Calvin College, LGBT Students and Homosexuality.? I would hope not. Do all Lutherans believe that homosexuals can be ordained as ministers? Again, I would hope not. How about Methodists? Do all Methodists believe that homosexuals should be included in participation of the sacraments and programs? Those are just some examples of the error of pigeonholing.
No where in scripture is there teaching of the separation of believers into different denominations, sects, or belief systems. The body of Christ is universal and acceptance of Jesus as Lord and Savior is how someone becomes part of the body of Christ or the church. Membership in a denomination or organization doesnt do that. Identifying oneself as a Methodist, Calvinist, Catholic, or any other affiliation isnt an indication of being saved nor is it necessarily an indication of ones beliefs. It is however an indication of a carnal mind as seen in Pauls letter to the Corinthians.
Are you followers of Calvin, Luther, the Pope, Wesley, or some other teacher? Or are you followers of Christ? Do you hold the writings of men as Gods word or scripture which was truly inspired by the Holy Spirit?
Are you carnally minded or Spiritually minded?
Please do. I know of no one who has posted to this thread that has denied believing in the trinity. In fact most all that I know of have posted scripture showing proof of the trinity.
I dont know nor do I care. My beliefs arent based on the Westminster Confession. They are based on scripture. If someone believes they must confess the Westminster Confession, or any other confession, thats their choice. My salvation is not base on whether I confess anything other than a belief and reliance on the Lord Jesus Christ and Him crucified. Its His blood that covers me not some denominational statement.
Tell me. Which ones are needed for salvation?
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