Controversial book on salvation has Catholics and evangelicals asking for clarity

cna ^ | March 24, 2011 | Benjamin Mann

[NYer]

Catholic ping!

[taxcontrol]

I stopped reading at “Bell also speculates....” for two reasons. 1) Prima Scritura and 2) The foolishness of God is greater than the wisdom of men.

[Tax-chick]

It’s funny how we human beings always make the same arguments to God. “It’s not fair!” we say. “I decide what’s fair!” he says. His ways are not our ways, His thoughts are not our thoughts. I like His ways and His thoughts better.

I used to hear a Christian pop song called “God is God, and I am not.”

[BigFinn]

The phrase... falling away... comes to mind.

2 Timothy 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

[DarthVader]

Rob Bell is an apostle of apostasy.

[DarthVader]

Matthew 7:13

Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it.

[Tex Pete]

I heard it said recently that the problem with far too many American Christians is that they expect Christ to closely resemble the person they see in the mirror rather than the other way around.

[CdMGuy]

Who appointed John Michael Talbot, founder of a Franciscan brotherhood, a spokesman for the Catholic Church on matters of faith and morals? If one wants to know the position of the Catholic Church on this matter should one not seek the advice of the Vatican or of a US spokesperson authorized to speak on behalf of the Vatican? In 16 years of Catholic school education, I never once heard a priest, brother or nun ever say that non-Christians could not go to heaven.

[Paved Paradise]

Another false prophet preaching a false message... nothing really new. Just sad at those who are being led astray by this idiot.

[Tax-chick]

The popular press is always more likely to quote a “celebrity” than a scholar. The author could have simply mentioned relevant passages from the Catechism, but he obviously felt that would be less persuasive to his readers than attributing similar content to Mr. Talbot. It’s weird, isn’t it?

[JohnKeble]

I’ve read “Love Wins”, and I’m convinced that he’s teaching universalism, even if he denies it. He may like to dodge questions and write in an ambiguous way, but his logic is clear: he believes everyone will go to heaven.

See my my thorough review on Amazon for more information, and give it Helpful vote if it helped you understand the book better.

[JohnKeble]

I’ve read “Love Wins”, and I’m convinced that he’s teaching universalism, even if he denies it. He may like to dodge questions and write in an ambiguous way, but his logic is clear: he believes everyone will go to heaven.

See my my thorough review on Amazon for more information, and give it Helpful vote if it helped you understand the book better. The review is by Fr. Charles Erlandson.

[Capt. Tom]

In 16 years of Catholic school education, I never once heard a priest, brother or nun ever say that non-Christians could not go to heaven.

Talk to Catholics who are 75 years old or older see what they say.-Tom

[Tax-chick]

My father, a Protestant who is 75 years old, has sometimes had questions about the Catholic Faith. He knew many Catholics growing up in rural Missouri. Some were his close friends, including my “Uncle George” and “Uncle Paul,” and he was even engaged to a Catholic girl, long before he met my mother.

He said the first Catholic he met who could intelligently answer his questions was me. I joined the Church in 1993.

[DannyTN]

There are two ways to heaven.

The first is to be perfect, never sin.

• "Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect." Mat 5:48
• "Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy." 1Pe 1:16
• Jam 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one [point], he is guilty of all.
• Luk 10:25 And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? Luk 10:26 He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? Luk 10:27 And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. Luk 10:28 And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live. Luk 10:29 But he, willing to justify himself, said unto Jesus, And who is my neighbour?
• Mat 19:16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? [there is] none good but one, [that is], God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. Mat 19:18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Mat 19:19 Honour thy father and [thy] mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. Mat 19:20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet? Mat 19:21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go [and] sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come [and] follow me. Mat 19:22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.

The second is to be forgiven.

• Jhn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
• Jhn 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: Jhn 3:15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. Jhn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. Jhn 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. Jhn 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. Jhn 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. Jhn 3:20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. Jhn 3:21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.
• Hbr 9:26 For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.
• Hbr 7:19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope [did]; by the which we draw nigh unto God.
• Hbr 10:1 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, [and] not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.
• Hbr 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.
• Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Oh and the first one doesn't count, because God has already said, none are perfect.

[crosshairs]

The Catholic Church denies the possibility of either post-mortem repentance or a temporary hell, and most Catholic theologians have regarded universal salvation as an impossibility.

So Purgatory IS only a ski resort in Colorado after all. Good to know.

[D-fendr]

Non sequitur much?

:)

[CynicalBear]

>> The Catholic Church accepts this notion as a possibility, in instances where individuals have failed to receive the Gospel message by no fault of their own.<<

If that were true why would we be told to spread the Gospel to “all the world”? Wouldn’t it be cruel if they had never heard the Gospel and would have been saved but we went in and told them and they denied the truth of it? Why in the world would we be told to spread the gospel if they were going to be saved anyway?

[D-fendr]

Hearing the Gospel would be the normal way. The other a possibility...