Posted on 08/27/2010 11:45:13 AM PDT by Hank Kerchief
the funny part is the number of non-Catholics here who have repeatedly said Catholics worship satan, idols, are going to hell, blah, blah, blah...... It works both ways sunshine.
Some loon, liar, and genuinely misinformed "expert" has informed me that the correct Latin to English translation of "alter" is "the second", "the other one".
Wadaya know! I just used the Google Translator and it translates "alter" to "the other".
You have your work cut out for you.
PS. I added a few non-Catholics to your list. I'm certain you inadvertantly left them off.
ping to #8822
Again, does scripture say it? and if so, then it’s valid. Believing scripture is one thing, believing the opinions of men are another. “sunshine”, yes, I’m happy to bring some into your jaded little life
ping to #8822
We shall know them by their fruits, or anti-Catholic is as anti-Catholic does. Either way its pretty obvious.
> “the ones who believe that they’re saved, for instance, based upon what?”
.
Only a Catholic could have such a question!
Based on the promises in God’s word, and the assurance that the Holy Spirit gives us.
Terms used by the Catholic Church mean what the Catholic Church says they mean. Its called contextual. Since we all know what a firm theological grounding Google translators have the only thing you proved is how gullible some can be when they so desperately want to prove something that isn't.
Now, Professor, I suggest you actually study the Latin Vulgate and Catholic theology to understand both. I'm not saying you have to believe any of it, but at least you will get your definitions right enough to hold an intelligent conversation.
I really haven't understood what the deal was, "in persona Christe" means "in the person of Christ", "alter Christe" means practically the same thing. To go to the extreme and define it beyond how the Church intends it though is wrong, but that's never stopped anyone before.
Priests (indeed all Christians) are to conform themselves to Christ. Priests are to do what Christ did in a somewhat more profound manner than the slogan WWJD. Our High Priest is Jesus Christ, He is the priest, He is the sacrifice Who offers and is offered to His Father.
Who ya gonna trust? Some poster or Google Translator and those Merriam-Webster folks?
RSV - Ignatius Edition
2 Corinthians 2:10 Any one whom you forgive, I also forgive. What I have forgiven, if I have forgiven anything, has been for your sake in the presence of Christ,
"...presence of Christ."
Underlining!? That’s getting pretty close to hubris, you know.
Yeah, that’s interesting:
New International Version (©1984)
If you forgive anyone, I also forgive him. And what I have forgiven—if there was anything to forgive—I have forgiven in the sight of Christ for your sake,
New Living Translation (©2007)
When you forgive this man, I forgive him, too. And when I forgive whatever needs to be forgiven, I do so with Christ’s authority for your benefit,
English Standard Version (©2001)
Anyone whom you forgive, I also forgive. Indeed, what I have forgiven, if I have forgiven anything, has been for your sake in the presence of Christ,
New American Standard Bible (©1995)
But one whom you forgive anything, I forgive also; for indeed what I have forgiven, if I have forgiven anything, I did it for your sakes in the presence of Christ,
International Standard Version (©2008)
When you forgive someone, I do, too. Indeed, what I have forgiven-if there was anything to forgive-I did in the presence of the Messiah for your benefit,
GOD’S WORD® Translation (©1995)
If you forgive someone, so do I. Indeed, what I have forgiven, if I have forgiven anything, I did in the presence of Christ for your benefit.
King James Bible
To whom ye forgive any thing, I [forgive] also: for if I forgave any thing, to whom I forgave [it], for your sakes [forgave I it] in the person of Christ;
American King James Version
To whom you forgive any thing, I forgive also: for if I forgave any thing, to whom I forgave it, for your sakes forgave I it in the person of Christ;
American Standard Version
But to whom ye forgive anything, I forgive also: for what I also have forgiven, if I have forgiven anything, for your sakes have I forgiven it in the presence of Christ;
Bible in Basic English
But if you give forgiveness to anyone, I do the same: for if I have given forgiveness for anything, I have done it because of you, in the person of Christ;
Douay-Rheims Bible
And to whom you have pardoned any thing, I also. For, what I have pardoned, if I have pardoned any thing, for your sakes have I done it in the person of Christ.
Darby Bible Translation
But to whom ye forgive anything, I also; for I also, what I have forgiven, if I have forgiven anything, it is for your sakes in the person of Christ;
English Revised Version
But to whom ye forgive anything, I forgive also: for what I also have forgiven, if I have forgiven anything, for your sakes have I forgiven it in the person of Christ;
Webster’s Bible Translation
To whom ye forgive any thing, I forgive also: for if I forgave any thing, to whom I forgave it, for your sakes I forgave it, in the person of Christ;
Weymouth New Testament
When you forgive a man an offence I also forgive it; for in fact what I have forgiven, if I have forgiven anything, has always been for your sakes in the presence of Christ,
World English Bible
Now I also forgive whomever you forgive anything. For if indeed I have forgiven anything, I have forgiven that one for your sakes in the presence of Christ,
Young’s Literal Translation
And to whom ye forgive anything — I also; for I also, if I have forgiven anything, to whom I have forgiven it, because of you — in the person of Christ — I forgive it,
I just don’t subscribe to your interpretation. That’s what all of this comes down to. Much the same way that Pentecostals don’t interpret things the same way as Presbyterians don’t interpret things the same way as Church of Christ don’t interpret things the same way as Non-Denominational and so on ad nauseaum. Except on Reformation Sunday.
Sadly, we do not have the "original" manuscripts. In any event they would then have to be translated into the vernacular in, to a large extent, a "best guess" basis.
To those of us to whom English is the first language we'll have to settle on the English language version.
(Many Catholics are not aware that Latin is far removed from the "original" language.)
Hey, here is a novel idea, why don't we check with the Church and see what it says about what it teaches? Naw, on second thought that would be too easy and wouldn't give the desired answer.......... Let's just keep making things up just to bait the Catholics, because we all know we have to talk our way into heaven and lying is just talk with a Calvinist spin, isn't it?.......Do I hear an "Amen!"?
Isn't Christ omnipresent? What about Matthew 18:20; "For where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst."
Wow, you guys never tire of departing from the doctrine of the Trinity, do you? I had had glimpses of non Trinitarian heresy before, but they have really come out on this thread. Ummm, are there any other non Christian beliefs that you guys wish to parade out here?
Guessing or if you have a source of
There are at least 33,000 points of disagreement or there wouldn't need to be 33,000 denominations, give or take.
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