Posted on 08/27/2010 11:45:13 AM PDT by Hank Kerchief
Jesus saves all sinners who repent
So, is it your position that all those who repent and accept Jesus as Savior are saved?
This is a pretty clear indication that no proof of nihil obstat will be forthcoming. Surprised?
Context, context, context
This is not a scripture telling us not to judge..it is warning us to judge rightly
Mat 7:1 ¶ Judge not, that ye be not judged.
Mat 7:2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
It is a warning to judge correctly...
All through the gospel Christ actually instructs us to judge fruit..and not to be unequally yoked..(requiring us to make a spiritual judgement)
He tells us not to caste pearls before swine..(also requiring a spiritual judgement)
1Cr 6:2 Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?
1Cr 6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
Every time we present the gospel, we are making a judgement that the person NEEDS to hear it
In this case, hearing the words that came from the mouth of Mother Teresa... one can judge if her testimony was one of a Christian
She needed to hear the good news.. she did not need to try to work her way to salvation
I do hope that before her last breath SOMEONE had the courage to tell her..
I have no intention of helping you in your journey down the baloney trail.
Mad Dawg wrote:
“For a millisecond, let’s put down our disputes and magnify the Lord.”
I hadn’t been following the whole Mother Theresa thing on the thread since I did not think it was a profitable line of discussion for anyone. When one starts to introduce persons and personalities into a dispute about Christian doctrine, objectivity is immediately lost ... and man’s ugly nature will soon make itself known in the exchange. In other words, it not only matters who and what is right, but also how one goes about establishing right.
So, let’s put down our silly, superfluous, superficial, sinful disputes and magnify the Lord. But understand well that the Lord is best and most sincerely magnified when His word and will reign supreme and we acknowledge it.
I especially focus on the posts from the cartoon contributor stressing the UFO, Sister Aimee devotion which causes further embarrassment and immediate disclaimers. .The fruits of their efforts makes excellent apologetic material. These ones serve as the magisterium for the evangelical types.
God bless
1 Timothy 6:4 he is puffed up with conceit, he knows nothing; he has a morbid craving for controversy and for disputes about words, which produce envy, dissension, slander, base suspicions,
I don't understand the meaning of "THEN". First I preach, then I love?
And as to our 'making disciples', you would then refudiate the people that say pastors cannot save? (When asked how many people I'd saved, I always said, "None. GOD saves people, not me.") Sure, we use "making disciples" loosely, but sometimes it's good to tighten up the discourse.
Also, I think we end up needing a generous interpretation of "preaching," one which would include those who do not actually talk much but who serve the needy. Not all are preachers in the formal sense, while all have a call and what we Catholics call an "apostolate."
In man's eyes, many people have done wonderful things, among the worlds religions. These things are well and good and are to be encourgaged with the BIG caveat that good works do not achieve salvation.
Once the caveat is made and agreed to, the philosophical problem remains: Does God act for good in the lives of those who do not profess Christ OR Can folks in that class do no good OR can there be a source of good other than God?
Certainly Mother T. should be commended for her work. Did her work earn her a place in heaven? Not according to the scriptures.
Was anyone saying that her work earned her a place in heaven? Who and where?
Was she a true believer? I don't know.
Is there anything working on earth that could give that knowledge?
Can someone believe that Faith and Works merits salvation? Not according to the scripture.
General observation: Language is a soft instrument. It does not keep an edge and must be sharpened often. But it can be very sharp and very effective, but the edge must be tended to.
It seems to me that I can say that I "merited" reaching the upstairs bedroom by walking down the hall, up the stairs, and through the door. But I sure didn't put the bedroom there or give my legs the power (long pause while elderly widower neighbor comes over from across the street to tell me everything that's wrong with the Church today, where was I ...., oh yeah) to climb them and the origin even of the notion to go upstairs is a mystery. So in SOME sense reaching the upstairs bedroom is the "reward" for my works. In any event it is hard to imagine me reaching the Sealy Posturepedic without going through those steps.
On the other hand, the reward is so disproportionately huge in comparison with the 'effort' while, as I say, though the effort is somehow mine, I can take no credit for it. I might as well try to take credit for the color of my baby-blues.
So the good works which He has prepared for me to walk in seem to have some process, some benefit, some goal and result. But logically prior and of overwhelming importance is the grace which set me on that path, and and for which also I can take no credit.
Moses says, "The LORD will fight for you, and you have only to keep still." I say that keeping still is not so easy.
Still, it is all grace, and to forget that is to forget everything of importance.
Yes, I get verbose sometimes.
This is precisely why I have stopped communicating with, as I refer to him, old veggie. Rather than participate in an exchange of ideas all you will get is criticisms, observations, citations from dubious websites, and a demand for information without reciprocity. It isn't worth the bother.
There are only so many contexts that can support I believe all gods can save
The Spanish Inquisition et al.
Weren’t some Catholics just complaining about quotes of Mother Teresa’s being taken out of context?
How Christlike of them.
Yep....LOL
MD, I assume that you can present us with the proper context . Otherwise this accusation is unfounded and borders on slander
The theological incoherence and spiritual peril of the position held against Mother Teresa is increasingly apparent. Now she is in hell (and now this is a judgment permitted to mortal men), because on the basis of dishonestly excerpted and assembled quotes and a spiritual aridity which is, as I said, Dominically and Scripturally described as a sign of blessedness a case can be made that she had the wrong opinions about Jesus.
Because some Protestants give themselves airs over their good works, they cannot imagine someone who really thinks and feels that even good works are graces, that merit is a gift. Because some Protestants think that when Jesus says "Take up your cross daily," one should feel more ebullient, jolly, and confident than Jesus evidently felt in His crucifixion they conclude from Mother Teresa's desolation, NOT that she was blessed with chastisement and privileged to bear in her heart the marks of Jesus (cf. Gal 6:17), but that she was not given grace.
It is, indeed, consistent with the "snow on a dung hill" notion that God's imputation is somehow impotent to effect real change. This image, whatever it may be intended to mean, suggests that justification is superficial. I mean, work the metaphor! I can enjoy being in heaven and others can enjoy my presence only because my essential nature is dusted with something which looks clean. As long as heaven is too cold for snow to melt, my stench and foul appearance will be concealed. Is this really a suitable metaphor for blessedness?
Our Lord insists that we must carry a cross, that we must die daily. St Paul repeatedly asserts that to be in Christ is to die and to be reborn. Yet when some observe that dreadful and gracious promise coming true, they think it means an absence of grace and faith. But this desolation is their evidence!
Claims are made of a right and duty of spiritual discernment, while the burning way of dross is thought to be not a refinement but a curse.
The Lord is a demanding spouse. He finds us at the curb or in the alley. He insists on washing and clothing us, on having us sleep in unfamiliar beds rather than our vermin infested bundle of rags.
He is a demanding healer. He pokes and prods, debrides, disinfects, and stretches us until we feel our limbs must spring from their sockets.
He is an exigent shepherd, putting us in awkward positions to trim our rotted hooves down to the blood. He runs us through the chutes, and drenches and vaccinates us. And we are tempted by terror when all around us is good and loving care.
He is a stern general who insists his troops be trained and strong and ready, and who means to make them so.
The unchaste and dirty mock. Those lying in their sickness turn away from those being healed. The wild animals with their parasites and short lives scorn the cared-for sheep. Those who do most of their fighting in bars or in their homes belittle the warriors.
The blind claim to see, and so their guilt remains.
MD - there is no need to defend your posting. You eloquently and passionately stated your position with absolute clarity. When the words of Christ and the works of Mother Teresa are misinterpreted no amount of defense will satisfy them.
SOMETIMES
THE COMPULSION TO BE SOOOOOOOOOOO BLAZINGLY WRONG
IS FUNNY.
KEEP IT UP!
It helps paint the fitting absurdities on the RC position.
Have you not read my posts? Text and link are there.
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