Posted on 11/14/2007 8:28:07 AM PST by fortcollins
What of the books redacted by the Church throughout the centuries? Are they still part of the Bible, but we just don’t care much for them?
..and that is why mormonism is not Christianity.
It was all a giant scam!
Which is not surprising considering that Joseph Smith was a convicted con man.
Another thought that came to my mind was that I am watching a replay of the very forces (admittedly a milder form) that murdered Joseph Smith and drove the Mormons into the wilderness back in the mid nineteenth century. Where is the good will, forgiveness, and tolerance that is supposed to be the hallmark of Christianity?
And finally, the thought came to me that I am seeing the demise of the Republican party. The Clinton machine is quietly (all constituencies working in relative harmony) laying the foundation for a win in ‘08. If they win in ‘08 it will dramatically change this country more strongly into the direction of amoral, highly taxed, big government socialism. But here we are in one gigantic display of ignorance and intolerance. “Your ancestors were more evil than my ancestors.” “Your doctrine is not as pure as my doctrine.” “Your leaders were whores.” “No, your leaders are the anti-Christ.”
Where to begin?
I think I will go for a walk and enjoy the beautiful day.
“Joseph Smith was a convicted con man.”
Stop trying to muddy the water with facts, OK, Bub?
When Joseph Smith was murdered, did he not also murder two men and wound another in the gunfire exchange?
Why would such a Christ-like figure need a gun anyway?
Thanks! I hadn’d read that.
I am a Mason but not a Mormon, I can vouch for the accuracy of the Masonic rituals described in your link and if Mormon’s use the same, they were taken directly from Masonry. Free Masons however do not claim to be a religion.
Concur. Despite what many on this forum claim, Masonry is not a religion, but expects the members to be active and productive members of their respective religions.
Mark 12:18 And there came to him the Sadducees, who say there is no resurrection; and they asked him, saying: 19 Master, Moses wrote unto us, that if any man's brother die, and leave his wife behind him, and leave no children, his brother should take his wife, and raise up seed to his brother. 20 Now there were seven brethren; and the first took a wife, and died leaving no issue. 21 And the second took her, and died: and neither did he leave any issue. And the third in like manner. 22 And the seven all took her in like manner; and did not leave issue. Last of all the woman also died. 23 In the resurrection therefore, when they shall rise again, whose wife shall she be of them? for the seven had her to wife. 24 And Jesus answering, saith to them: Do ye not therefore err, because you know not the scriptures, nor the power of God? 25 For when they shall rise again from the dead, they shall neither marry, nor be married, but are as the angels in heaven. 26 And as concerning the dead that they rise again, have you not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spoke to him, saying: I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? 27 He is not the God of the dead, but of the living. You therefore do greatly err.
Game. Set. Match. Christians and Mormons are not in one accord.
“His supposed Egyptian scrolls that he found in Pennsylvania that he interpreted to say a tribe of Israelis came to America in 600 BC “ Yes, but he hadn’t envisioned DNA. I have an excellent DVD about how they conducted DNS tests to totally debunk this fantasy. Science has proven that the DNA of the Semetic tribes is vastly different than hat of those tribes they claim migrated to the Americas. The conclusion is that it is impossible. The Mormon church is having a very difficult time circumventing this “inconveniet truth” as they claim that their book is infallable and more reliable than the Bible.
“Mormonism is based on the ramblings of one man, just like Islam, they are just more peaceful aside from the few massacres they have had.” Like in the Sudan?
Yes the Catholic church accepts other Christian baptism who were baptized in the name of the father,son,and holy spirit.
And your anger betrays you. As if your anti-Mormon sources with their typically sloppy scholarship and accursation-making is somehow more sound than the historical contextualizing and reasoning of LDS scholars, which I notice you make no attempt to answer directly.
As for Clayton’s journal, second hand testimony would never stand up in a court of law, it is heresay. Clayton could well have been speculating and espousing his own opinion. That is backed up by the fact there is no 1st hand comment by JS authenticating the plates. When you have that, then you’ve got something. But there is no comment authenticating these from JS himself. If this were a court, the case would have been thrown out long ago.
Also, the plates left Nauvoo quickly, with no offer nor intent to buy them as happened with the Abraham scrolls. If JS thought them authentic, why was he uninterested in them, why was there no translation of them, why no comment by him whatsoever? You can’t answer.
The fact is, you NEED to believe this incident despite a complete lack of evidence it is real. You just have to believe the Church is false to justify the lifestyle you prefer to lead. You apostates are all alike. And you claim I’m an apologist, as if you’re not one for a position that a guilty conscience requires you to take.
Now let’s hear some factual refutation of the facts I’ve presented including this article, http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/response/history/kinderhook.htm#ensign
I suggest you read and pray about the Book of Mormon. I defy you to show that an uneducated farm boy could have produced that in a matter of 3 months. And what of the testimony of 3 witnesses who were shown the plates by an angel? What of the 11 who saw and handled them? These are things you need to consider and pray about, not the lies spread by people threatened by the growth of the LDS Church which threatens their livelyhood.
I really have nothing more to say to you. Anger and hatred such as what you express have no place in a discussion on faith. If it’s what drives you, then it tells me what spirit you’re operating under. Any further reply by you will not be read by me, so save your time. You just spout the Mormon hater line which I’ve heard a million times over. To continue to entertain it is a waste of energy by me.
Which books are those?
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