Posted on 11/11/2007 7:19:28 AM PST by shrinkermd
“Your points just don’t align with the main points in the article, which is the hypocrisy of the enabling bishops,”
good point.
These threads typically devolve into arguments regarding homosexuality - the causes of the scandal - celibacy...etc.
But that isn’t the main point of the article.
I don’t like to agree with liberal newspapers who enjoy bashing the Church, but unfortunately this article does a good job of showing how this one man does not “GET IT”.
And he isn’t just any man - he’s going to be head of the US Conference of Bishops, and that is a very sad thing.
“Semantics aside- does anyone think homosexual/pedophile Bishops, Archbishops etc want to really purge the Church of their kind?”
no...but the worse offenders are slowly but surely coming upon their 75th yr when they are required to hand their resignation to the pope, who can decide whether or not to accept it.
It will be a very good sign it we see the pope accepting these resignations the first time they are drafted.
I suspect most believers in faith through Christ do not understand the extent of perversity to which homosexuality fully extends.
IMHO, the larger risk is that the homosexuality and pedophilia being reported is merely the more easily reported, less perverse issues of a deeper evil underlying the problem.
I agree with your point of view. In the parish where I lived as a non-Catholic, some of the priests partied and drank and drove fancy cars, and the older housewives of the parish cleaned the rectory, did their laundry and cooking, and waited upon them. This sort of anti-ascetic privilege was baffling to me. Being a "dry" Protestant, I couldn't fathom the drinking among priests. Alcohol and lowered inhibitions are inextricably linked, to say nothing of the bad effects of the migration away from a truly pious prayer life.
So, they were the "Nerds"?
You'd find many similar "weirdos" in an engineering school. The priesthood is nerd-friendly in some respects, since it partly relies upon the mastery all sorts of arcane information. Where secular nerds try to learn Elvish or Klingon and explain the ways the Star Trek canon fits together, priests are immersed in dead languages and Biblical Studies.
Unlike the engineers, the priest-nerds get put in situations where normally only extroverts are expected. I'd guess the dissonance you feel is largely a result of moving from an extrovert-dominated Christian tradition to one where even the academic types get placed in public view.
No, actually it is also a violation of the canons. The secular state may well prosecute the crime, and if the bishop learns of it from the victim, rather than the perpetrator in the context of a confession, he has a duty to turn the criminous clerk over to the state. He also has a duty to depose the priest, which is not something the state can do.
You’re both right, the most precise number, according to the U.S. Bishops’ own reports, is 81 percent.
I don’t care what they say about you, Dumb Ox, that is an insightful post!
I was just gently pointing out that marriage isn’t a cure all for sex abuse scandals. The protestants have their share as well, even though they don’t like to admit it.
My experience with Catholic Priests has mainly occurred in Illinois and Florida.
Prior to becoming a Catholic, I was a consultant to one of the larger Florida diocese and frequently met with all of the priests of that diocese. That's probably where I first noticed that Catholic priests were very "different" than Protestant ministers. My experience as a Catholic has confirmed what I thought then.
My view of Priests isn't helped by the fact that the Bishop of my diocese is quite obviously a corrupt, practicing homosexual. He was exposed by the local newspaper several years ago. The Pastor of my parish is also quite light in the loafers.
Maybe there's a Diocese somewhere full of "regular" guys, but I haven't seen it.
If you are a life-long Catholic, you probably won't see what I see. My wife is a cradle-Catholic, and she doesn't see it until I point it out.
However, I would think that most folks who have experienced a life-time of Protestant ministers before becoming Catholic would notice a difference.
As I have pointed out to others, if you are a life-long Catholic and have had little exposure to Protestant ministers, it doesn't surprise me that you don't see what I see.
FWIW, IMO:
Cincinnati, OH is a mixed bag. Baltimore, MD is a mixed bag. Washington, DC is pretty good. Arlington, VA is very good. Wheeling/Charleston, WV is pretty good. Richmond, VA is mostly flaky. Upstate New York (Albany?) is flake city.
I'm referring to the apparent "normalcy" of the priests I've met in these locations. Also, some orders are much more "manly" than others. Also, FWIW, protestant ministers tend to strike me as plastic and overcompensating. Again, IMO, and based on fairly limited experience.
There's more than a little truth in that statement.
Even though Catholic Priests are a little weird, they're really nice guys for the most part. Protestant ministers do seem a little phony at times.
I actually prefer the company of Catholic Priests than Protestant ministers. Catholic Priests seem more real. I like that they drink, smoke and curse. :-) Protestant ministers seem to feel that they have to maintain a holider than thou attitude.
My wife, who is a cradle-Catholic, is very turned off by most Protestant ministers because they tend to be dramatic and theatrical at times.
LOL! Probably was.
In school, there are basically three groups: the Geeks, the Cool Kids and the In-Betweens (neither Geeks or cool but the majority).
At the risk of overly simplifying things, from what I've seen, Catholic Priests are 60% Geeks, 35% In-Betweens and 5% Cool Kids. Those 5% Cool Kids really work their butts off representing Priests on TV. :-)
Protestant ministers are 10% Geeks, 20% Cool Kids and 70% In-Betweens.
That's a significant difference. We need more In-Betweens.
Obviously, my percentages are very subjective, but I think they reflect the overall reality of the situation.
I think we are kidding ourselves to deny that Celibacy isn't at least partially responsible for the difference and for the difficulty in recruiting Priests.
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