'The Nativity Story' Movie Problematic for Catholics, "Unsuitable" for Young Children

LifeSiteNews.com ^ | 12/4/2006 | John-Henry Westen

[Quix]

Actually, I knew a homosexual who lived in Germany in the US Army . . . most of his partners were priests. I asked him about their supervisors . . . he asserted that they knew and didn't care.

[Quix]

I think prophesy as proclimation could fit but I think the SONS AND DAUGHTERS SHALL PROPHECY is what most Pentecostals etc. understand it to be--supernatural by Holy Spirit prediction about future events as well as spiritual and other inights such as with Annanias and Saphirah etc. (sp?)

[Quix]

Again, I assert that the Word of God is not a collection of text on paper, pixels on a monitor, dye on papyrus or pressure waves (sound). He is alive!
Jesus, The Word of God (John 1, Rev 19) was speaking to those who were physically hearing Him but could not spiritually hear Him (“ears to hear”) in this passage – but these words are recorded for our benefit, so that we will understand the power of God:


But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: - John 10:26-27
Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God. – Matt 22:29

= = = =

INDEED! INDEED! AMEN!

[Blogger]

Yes he did. He wasn't particularly fond of James but included it as Scripture. I too joke that James is one guy I would like to sock in the mouth from time to time because he appears so against the rest of the New Testament. In reality, James, understood rightly, is a wonderful book about how Christians should live. I was discussing it with some friends this very evening in a Bible study. James saw the truth that Christianity isn't vain religion. Rather, it is faith that works.

James 1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed. 26If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain. 27Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

Here, we can see that James sees things no differently than Paul (though I do think Paul was the clearer writer in terms of the ages - I think James' initial audience knew precisely what James was saying to them).

Ephesians 2:8-10
8For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

I think there is this idea that we somehow run from James and embrace only Paul. That is not true. We take Paul and James as BOTH equally authoritative and not contradictory in the least.

It takes Sola Scriptura to understand that though.

[Quix]

I believe God telling Israel that he did not want Kings is a foreshadowing of this as well.

Indeed, that rings true in my Spirit as well!
= = = =

FOR SURE! AND I THINK IT'S A VERY KEY POINT.

Why did God not want Kings?

He considered it an affront--somewhat as He considered it an affront that the Children of Israel were too much fraidy cats to meet person to person with God at the tent of meeting in the wilderness.

God wants INTIMATE ONE ON ONE DIALOGUE WITHOUT INTERMEDIARIES.

Having a King was another form of foisting some man--flawed man--between the troops and God.

It neutered God's OPEN-DOOR-WALK-AGAIN-IN-THE-GARDEN policy, heart's desire--what Christ died for.

And, I think, that's one of the most demonic of the perversions of the Roman edifice that God hates the most. However, lots of other Protesty congregations functionally end up doing the same thing--glorifying man and deferring to man as the professional "God-go-between." The Roman brothers and sisters have no monopoly on the perversion. I'd rather they did--then at least a major portion of Christendom would be relatively free of it. Sadly, they are not.

[Quix]

I agree. It's stunning how the OT is so great in illustrating for us the pitfalls of human behavior and how it separates us from God.
= = = =

INDEED.

[Quix]

I don't doubt that God is supreme; Christ is His Son; came in the flesh; died for my sins; saved my soul etc.

I don't always have confident trust that He is out to do me good in my sense of good in a given situation or category of life events say. Not saying it's a logical flaw on my part--just a real one not yet fully overcome. Sadly.

[Quix]

Amen. Praise God for that.

And Holy Spirit's help in that.

[Quix]

Hmmmm . . .

Wellll, in a sense I believe in Eternal Security. My eternity is secure in Jesus . . .

Still tends to sound like hair splitting, often. But this is not the thread for that--been plenty of threads on that to the nth degree! LOL.

[Quix]

True, true, imho.

Thanks.

[Blogger]

Jesus is the only way we are secure. We'll probably visit this topic again sometime though, I imagine :)

[D-fendr]

that's a very good one!

[Invincibly Ignorant]

How's that Bible code comin' along?

[Quix]

The science and the art of the authentic Bible Codes appear to be progressing at a fairly rapid clip.

I have been planning to post major portions of the latest digest for weeks. Haven't even finished reading it myself.

Plenty of other fish to fry, it seems.

But it remains exceedingly fascinating and a wonderful glimpse at the Majesty and Wonder of God's power and grandeur . . . and at some of the lengths He will go to, to affirm such to us critters.

[Invincibly Ignorant]

I'm happy for ya. :-)

[Quix]

Thanks.

I think.

Not sure when you are satirical and when not.

[Invincibly Ignorant]

Tell ya what. Give us one prophecy of what's going to happen this year. That way you won't have to constantly tell us about all the stuff that happens after the fact. Just one. Give it to us.

[Alamo-Girl]

Thank you oh so very much for sharing your testimony!

Then I -- or rather a small, still Voice within me -- simply said, just rest gently in Jesus' loving arms and He will bring you through this unscathed. Which is exactly what I did, and exactly what He did.

My takeaway, which I've never forgotten: Put all your trust in Jesus Christ and all will be well. For truly as you say, Alamo-Girl: "The life is in Christ, and in Him alone."

Beautiful! That is exactly the way it should end - and will - for His beloved sheep. He will never leave us or forsake us. (Hebrews 13:5)

[kosta50]

Most protestant denominations I'm familiar with would deny believers never sin after they've received eternal life and initial saving faith in Christ

On this very thread (I don't want to mention any names) a Reformed Protestant Freeper basically said that if one sins he is not a Christian. So, in part I was reacting to that statement, which seemed rather incredulous.

Rather, while they remain in fellowship with God, they are dead to sin or separated from the penalty of sin

I am not sure I understand the terminology here, or the concept for that matter. But I think this is different than what +Paul is saying in Rom 6. He says rather definitively that those who have been Baptized (accepted Christ as their Savior) are dead to sin and sin no more.

I have also been told by Protestants on this Forum that (1) the elect cannot fall away because (2) God won't let them. From the way you are stating it, I get the impression that we determine if we are going to stay "in fellowship" with God and not the other way around.

Trouble is, we are not dealing with a 'Protestant doctrine' but with individual Protestants who believe, let's be brutally honest, whatever they want to believe, or whatever they think the indwelling Spirit leads the to believe.

As such, a coherent general discussion regarding doctrine or theology is severely limited, as there will always be another Protestant who is likely to disagree with the first one.

[Alamo-Girl]

Why would demons bother with such a person, AG? Doesn't this person already belong to them?

Physically hearing the word is not enough, the ones Christ is speaking to below were physically hearing Him, but they were not spiritually hearing Him. They did not understand:

But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: - John 10:26-27

And concerning the demons, part of what they do is to take away what Christ has said. But that only happens when the hearer didn’t “get it” in the first place (emphasis mine):

And he spake many things unto them in parables, saying, Behold, a sower went forth to sow; And when he sowed, some [seeds] fell by the way side, and the fowls came and devoured them up: Some fell upon stony places, where they had not much earth: and forthwith they sprung up, because they had no deepness of earth: And when the sun was up, they were scorched; and because they had no root, they withered away. And some fell among thorns; and the thorns sprung up, and choked them: But other fell into good ground, and brought forth fruit, some an hundredfold, some sixtyfold, some thirtyfold. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear. – Matt 13:3-9

Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower. When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth [it] not, then cometh the wicked [one], and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side. But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it; Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended. He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful. But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth [it]; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty. – Matt 13:18-23

You continued:

Are demons God's agents of Evil to mankind? Put another way, is God the creator of Evil?

To answer your questions here I must make a strict delineation between the leading I have in the Spirit and my own musings. First, the leading I have in the Spirit is to leave the devil alone, God will deal with him:

Likewise also these [filthy] dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities. Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee. But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves. Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core. – Jude 1:8-11

As for the musings which ring true in the Spirit:

First, is the Jewish interpretation that the reason there was a beginning at all was that God the Father wanted to reveal Himself.

In the beginning – regardless of cosmology (cyclic, inflationary, epkyrotic, multi-world, multi-verse, imaginary time, hesitating, etc.) all that exists is God Himself. Space and time do not exist, neither does causality. In the absence of time, events cannot occur. In the absence of space, things cannot exist. Without space/time there is no energy, no matter, no thing at all. Only existence exists, i.e. God.

IOW, the beginning (both physical and spiritual) was a willful act of God the Creator. (First Cause) Which is to say there is nothing of which anything can be made but God Himself. Reality is God's will and unknowable in its fullness.

But God is Light and in Him there is no darkness at all. He is good and not evil. So I meditated and prayed why this is so.

In response to that prayer, I now have peace in the spirit with this understanding: God has revealed Himself by contrast. How would we know light if we had never seen darkness? Good if we had never seen evil? Sickness v. health, courage v. fear, right v. wrong – and so on.

And so there was a Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil right there in the Garden of Eden for Adam to see, to observe – but not to feed on, not to make a part of himself. But we know how that ended up.

Once Adam fed on the knowledge of good and evil, it became a part of himself and he was hopelessly stained red. No matter how much white was added to him, he could never be more than another shade of pink. He had to be born again, which is exactly what Christ made possible by His own body and blood!

Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool. – Isaiah 1:18

Because of Christ, Adamic men can return home, to where they belonged in the first place.

You see, it was never “about” this heaven and earth – from the beginning, it has always been about the next heaven and earth – God and His family and those to whom He has revealed Himself and with whom He will always live.

I take it you understand Christians to be in a state of perfect theosis, in other words, that they have arrived at a likeness of God to such an extent that demons not only do not trouble them, they flee from them?

All along I’ve spoken of the “walk.” The Christian is justified from the very moment he first believes. Thereafter, he works out his own salvation becoming sanctified in Christ.

Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. – Philippians 2:12

But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin. – 1 John 1:1

That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. For to be carnally minded [is] death; but to be spiritually minded [is] life and peace. – Romans 8:4-6

Nevertheless we are still His sheep, whether we are just taking baby steps or whether we’re at the end and have only that burning desire to weigh anchor from this life and go home. So yes, from the moment we first believe – no matter how immature we might be in our understanding – we belong to Jesus Christ and no one but no one – whether mortal man or demon or circumstances of life will ever separate us from Him.

For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. – Romans 8:38-39

Oh the demons will try to snatch us away from Him, but they cannot succeed.

And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any [man] pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave [them] me, is greater than all; and no [man] is able to pluck [them] out of my Father's hand. – John 10:28-29