Posted on 10/21/2006 4:52:03 AM PDT by NYer
Were you there the night I had to explain to the troll that St. Paul wrote First and Second Timothy?
It was funny and sad at the same time.
I didn't say Rome wasn't mentioned in Revelation - it comes a little later :) Have you ever wondered why Paul writes to the Church at Rome instead of Peter?
Yes, Alan, it's me, Zuriel.
All this talk of cowardice, my, my.
You want to go by dates and tradition, instead of doctrine? Your organization's own 'tradition' is basically an almost constant revamping of your church's doctrinal beliefs.
**If you belong to "Pentecostal Gospel," your religion is one of the hundreds of new sects founded by men in the last 100 years.**
I, like you, claim to trace my church back to Pentecost, but yours does not obey Peter's command to baptize in the name of Jesus.
Now, because of your style of posting, I will reply in like fashion.
**If you are a Roman Catholic, you know that your religion was founded in the year 33 by Our Lord Jesus Christ.**
Alan, you and a multitude of others, really underestimate Satan, big time.
Also known as Lucifer, he said, "..I will be like the most High". He and his angels waged war (no small feat) in heaven. He lost.
In the OT, Satan wasted no time in countering God's righteousness with something 'better' to Eve. He offered counterfiets to the Lord's Law. Note how worshippers of Baal performed animal sacrifices.
While the devil uses almost countless ways of attacking God's creation, Satan still wants to be like the most High. He is also transformed into an angel of light, and his ministers into ministers of righteousness.
Therefore it is no small thing that Satan would, within hours of the birth of the church of Jesus Christ, move into counterfiet mode, and take center stage.
Remember, the devil is transformed into an angel of light, so nothing that would appear to be 'Christian' is off limits for laying claim to:
Satan welcomes scripture, remember, he's been twisting it since tricking Eve. So he would make no hesitation to taking credit for helping the people have access to it.
Satan welcomes religious leaders. He can manipulate them with the good ol' tried and true 'pride of life' tricks.
Satan has no problem with crosses being displayed, or church buildings built in the shape of one.
But.........
let one sinner see that Peter taught repentant souls to be baptized in the name of JESUS for the remission of sins, and that sets the devil on edge like nothing else. The fact that people fight this command of Peter, saying "it's not important", or "it's not done in the name of Jesus" is proof of rejecting the original Apostolic message.
Yes, I believe the devil has had a 'christian' church counterfiet, front and center, with plenty of ritual and visual aides since the days of the apostles, for they warned of such being present even then.
I can present this with a good many scripture references for you tomorrow night, for now is bedtime.
Exactly where did it specifically say the thirty pieces of silver? Nice try, but Zecharias fits it better.
Big stretch. Huge.
You're adding to the text the meaning you want to find there.
You replied, "Those outside Catholicism have far more issues than just the keys. I am no defender of Protestantism, but they are spot on when it comes to salvation through grace alone.
If Catholics are right about the authority of the Magesterium, then non-Catholics do not have the authority to determine which doctrines are orthodox (i.e. "spot on") and which are heterodox. My point is that the issue of the authority of the Magesterium is fundamental to all the rest. They all stand or fall on this.
-A8
Yes, they would and have done so. Contrary to what you may believe, all Catholics do NOT hate Protestants and all Protestants do not hate Catholics, nor do both "live" to disagree with the other. There's too much "Father's business" to be about doing. Instead of working so hard to further the divide between us, why don't you find some common ground and and work towards mending the rifts that exist so we can work together? Do you honestly think you are promoting the Gospel or defending the faith with your posts? Please don't delude yourself.
FJ, the most painstaking translation I know of is the New American Standard Bible. It relates this passage as follows:
Obey your leaders and submit to their authority. They keep watch over you as men who must give an account. Obey them so that their work will be a joy, not a burden, for that would be of no advantage to you.
This refers to the fact that any organization must have leadership and compliance. It is not about anyone being of higher spiritual presence or glory, among the Lord's faithful.
Here is Peter's point of view, on the subject (1 Peter 5):
1 Therefore, I exhort the elders among you, as your fellow elder and witness of the sufferings of Christ, and a partaker also of the glory that is to be revealed, 2 shepherd the flock of God among you, exercising oversight not under compulsion, but voluntarily, according to the will of God; and not for sordid gain, but with eagerness; 3 nor yet as lording it over those allotted to your charge, but proving to be (I)examples to the flock. 4 And when the Chief Shepherd appears, you will receive the unfading (L)crown of glory.
No, I wasn't. When was that?
Isn't this, as Yogi said, de ja vu all over again?
The argument from silence is a fallacy.
-A8
July, as I recall. I laughed at first, but then it was mostly pity.
It was a thread much like this one. I wish I had the link handy...I suspect I'll go digging for it later in the week.
"Do you honestly think you are promoting the Gospel or defending the faith with your posts?"
First I want clarification on what "separation" means.
Secondly, I only search for the truth.
-A8
Well, I don't go by the NASB as it is Protestant first of all and secondly I think that these modern translations are a mess. People are putting all kinds of language in the Bible that wasn't meant to be there and it can the total dynamics of some aspects of Scripture.
# 707 will be my last post to you on this matter. I consider you unlearned in matters of doctrine and the faith and I will not "cast my pearls before swine", so to speak. May God bless you in spite of your bigotry and ignorance and may His mercy be renewed upon you when the sun rises again.
Separated from full communion with the one, holy, catholic and apostolic Church.
-A8
Oops! I meant change the dynamics of Scripture.
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