Kingdom of Heaven - Movie on the Crusades: Will it Rewrite History?

Channel 4 ^ | 2005 | n/a

[Corin Stormhands]

The Inquisition, what a show.
The Inquisition, here we go.
We know you're wishin' that we'd go away!
So all you Muslims and you Jews
We got big news for all of yous:
You'd better change your point of views TODAY!
'Cause the Inquisition's here and it's here to stay!

[big'ol_freeper]

Yes, I know my second link was about the Inquisition...if you go back to my post I said that the Crusades was just one of the black legends used by Protestants to attack the Catholic Church. The Inquisition is another.

[ksen]

Well, I promise not to use the Crusades against the Catholic church.

[ksen]

I understand that the modern day head of the inquisition, Cardinal Ratzinger (Head of the Office of the Propagation of the Faith), is in the lead in early betting on who becomes the next Pope.

[mike182d]

Thank you for that link on the Inquisition. I had never seen it in that light. Excellent work, my friend. :-)

[Corin Stormhands]

Unless it's quoted in a Mel Brooks movie, I probably wouldn't know.

[siunevada]

...was created by the Protestants to attack the Church.

Oh please.....

What? You didn't realize you were responsible for all that? Sure! We Latin Catholics are perfectly innocent.

Well. Except for that whole 'ignoring the pope and slaughtering the Eastern Catholics in Constantinople' thing. That hasn't worked out so well. And the Jews and Catholics in Syria and Lebanon and Jerusalem. Yeah, hmmmm, okay, maybe things did get out of control.

[RobbyS]

People ignore the plain fact that the Arabs spread their faith by the sword, that they were the aggressors. In some cases. such as in Egypt, Christians were initially welcoming to the Muslims, because they hated the government of Constantinople. But as time wore on , they found themselves an oppressed, in somewhat the same position of the Irish under British rule. In the 11th Century, the situation in the Levant grew much worse under the Seljuk Turks, who were much more intolerant than the Arabs. It was they who triggered the First Crusade, because they cut off pilgrimages to the Holy Land and threatened Constantinople, the largest Christian city in the world.

[mike182d]

People ignore the plain fact that the Arabs spread their faith by the sword, that they were the aggressors. In some cases. such as in Egypt, Christians were initially welcoming to the Muslims, because they hated the government of Constantinople.

Shhhh! That there's dangerous thinking nowadays...

[topcat54]

From the NR Online article:

"Now at last the scholars have made their report, an 800-page tome that was unveiled at a press conference in Rome on Tuesday. Its most startling conclusion is that the Inquisition was not so bad after all."

Yeah, right. By Vatican "scholars" from Vatican sources. I'm surprised they didn't just come out and say the protestants got what they deserved.

[dangus]

>> however, I cannot think of a bad movie to date that had Ed Norton in it... <<

Well, Norton was very good in it, but there was a truly terrible movie with Richard Gere, wherein Norton kills a priest.

[mike182d]

Yeah, right. By Vatican "scholars" from Vatican sources. I'm surprised they didn't just come out and say the protestants got what they deserved.

Like it or not, the Vatican contains an incredible wealth of history from over the past 2000 years (as it is one of the longest lasting institutions in existence today, surviving the rise and fall of various nations). Just because its in the Vatican doesn't make it irrelevant or "biased."

[Nauta]

Ping!

[mike182d]

Well....yeah, that movie was pretty sketchy. I know what you're talking about but I can't remember the name. Ed Norton was really good though - a schizophrenic if I'm not mistaken.

[Corin Stormhands]

Primal Fear

[siunevada]

I never knew Martin Luther felt that way about the Crusades, although it does say that he changed his mind when Austria was overrun.

Ego usque ad mortem luctor adversus Turcas et Turcarum Deum," Martin Luther wrote. "I will always struggle to the death against the Turks and the god of the Turks."

He seems pretty convinced on the day he wrote that. Bold words.

[dangus]

>>>> "Now at last the scholars have made their report, an 800-page tome that was unveiled at a press conference in Rome on Tuesday. Its most startling conclusion is that the Inquisition was not so bad after all."

>>Yeah, right. By Vatican "scholars" from Vatican sources. I'm surprised they didn't just come out and say the protestants got what they deserved.

Umm... topcat, you do know that the Inquisition was applied to Moslims, don't you?

[annalex]

modern day head of the inquisition, Cardinal Ratzinger

... did a great disservice to the Church by not revitalizing the Holy Inquisition when it was sorely needed to root out pederasty among priests. Maybe his successor will do better.

[dangus]

That's the one.

Ed Norton is in my estimation the best and most underrated younger actor. And he ain't so "younger" anymore. But he plays roles that are challenging but un-PC, so he gets neither the blockbusters nor the critic's adulation.

Other Ed Norton movies I've seen:
Rounders: Sketchy topic, but excellent character studies. ** 1/2
Keeping The Faith: A Jew and a Catholic join respective clergies and fall in love with the same woman. MUCH better than it sounds. ***
The Italian Job: I prefer it to Ocean's 11. ***1/2
American History X: Brutally honest exposition of the causes and effects of racism. Ouch. ****

Ed Norton hits I haven't seen:
Fight Club
Red Dragon
Frida (Marxist hagiography)
The People vs. Larry Flynt

[dangus]

... besides, the Vatican sources were the records kept by the Vatican. Should we believe rumor-mongering among illiterate peasantry, "histories" by those who weren't present, or the official records? If the records are contradictory, or don't square with other documents, then scholars will note that. But I dare say that the Catholic CHurch knows better what it did than the crafters of legend in distant England.