Catholicism & Capital Punishment

First Things ^ | April 2001 | Avery Cardinal Dulles

[Conservative Coulter Fan]

Capital Punishment and Christianity

God and the Death Penalty

Matthew 7:1 & Capital Punishment ("Judge not??)

John 8:3-11 & Capital Punishment

Biblical Verses on Capital Punishment

Matthew 5:43-48 & Capital Punishment

Paul 12:14-19 & Capital Punishment

God's Justice and Ours [Antonin Scalia on capital punishment]

[murphE]

PING

[NYer]

Catholic Ping - please freepmail me if you want on/off this list

[eastsider]

In the Old Testament the Mosaic Law specifies no less than thirty–six capital offenses calling for execution by stoning, burning, decapitation, or strangulation. Included in the list are idolatry, magic, blasphemy, violation of the sabbath, murder, adultery, bestiality, pederasty, and incest.

Color me cynical, but the omission of same-sex sodomy from a list of OT capital offenses is too PC for my taste.

[eastsider]

In light of all this it seems safe to conclude that the death penalty is not in itself a violation of the right to life.

Bump.

[Conservative Coulter Fan]

You know, I was wondering why he omitted that too!

[sinkspur]

Oh for heaven's sake!! You ARE cynical!

[eastsider]

And I even LIKE Dulles : )

[Coeur de Lion]

Isn't same-sex sodomy a little redundant? As for me, pederasty will do just as well.

[siunevada]

It is an effective but rarely, if ever, a necessary means of defending society against the criminal.

Mmmmm. Don't know if I agree with that assertion. It also has to be stated that it is a sentence that is imposed only rarely.

[Romulus]

An innocent oversight, I'm sure.

Relevant comment: two weeks ago, a jury in this state freed a man convicted of murder one, sentenced to life. Based on dodgy, 40-year-old testimony, his charge was reduced to manslaughter or some such. He was armed with handgun and knife, shot three people in the course of a robbery, the third of whom he also knifed in the throat. She alone died. This killing resulted in his life sentence (how he escaped the death penalty I can't imagine). A model prisoner, his cause for parole became popular with liberal reformers. With his charge reduced last week, he was released for time served.

Now here's my point. I do not like the death penalty, and have tried hard to hear the Church's pleas that in this day it's no longer necessary because society has the means to ensure human life-long incarceration for heinous offenders. With the release of Wilbert Rideau, this whole argument is blown away. Though the liberal great and good got their pet convict freed, they have greatly increased the chances that future juries will pass over the option (now evidently fraudulent) to call for "life in prison", instead going straight to death.

[eastsider]

I checked with Thomas Aquinas' Summa Theologica, and found his definition of sodomy:

Thirdly, by copulation with an undue sex, male with male, or female with female, as the Apostle states (Rm. 1:27): and this is called the "vice of sodomy."

So, yes, thank you, same-sex sodomy is indeed redundant. Good catch.

As for pederasty, my objection to Cardinal Dulles' omission of sodomy has to be read in the context of the recent scandal concerning clerical sexual abuse, the majority of which occurred with post-, not pre-pubescent minors. So pederasty doesn't quite work for me.

[eastsider]

I do not favor capital punishment to the extent that it is supported by revenge or blood lust, though I readily admit that revenge is often my gut reaction to certain crimes, especially those involving children. I support it precisely because I agree that, contrary to the Church's premise, modern society cannot guarantee life sentences.

[Coeur de Lion]

Agreed, though I disagree with your dictionary definition of the word rather than the older definition of the word which is: carnal affections between men and young boys. That's the typical expression that male homosexuality takes on and if the PC press had used that term rather than pedophilia, most people would've had to look it up and the general public would've realized "the bill of goods" that the proponents of "it just a sexual-orientation" continue to try to sell us.

[St.Chuck]

Interesting article.

I was surprised that the Cardinal didn't reference John 8:3-11 ( the woman in adultery ) when citing scripture.

It's interesting that Cardinal Dulles points out that it is religious believers that are most supportive of the death penalty, when one might assume that religionists, particularly Christians, would be more favorable to applications of mercy than in retribution. I also think it interesting that conservatives, those most inclined to limit the power of the state, seem to be more in favor of granting the state the ultimate power over individuals.

I think the reference to Romans 13 is problematic for Christian conservatives as well. It would be interesting to have Cardinal Dulles, or even Paul himself explain how obedience to secular authority is the proper course of action in the instances, and examples in history are legion, when that authority was truly evil. It would appear to be a condemnation, as well, of those in history who have defied authority, including our very own founding fathers.

By giving in to a perverse spirit of vindictiveness or a morbid attraction to the gruesome, the courts contribute to the degradation of the culture, replicating the worst features of the Roman Empire in its period of decline.

Here, Cardinal Dulles makes a keen observation. The bloodlust of death penalty proponents is painfully obvious in most publicized cases and seems to be the motivating factor that undermines any attempt to attain a proper good. Instead, it inculcates the vice of revenge, which is diametrically opposed to Our Lord's insistence to turn one's cheek, give up the cloak when one's coat is taken, go two miles when forced to go one. It ignores Christian magnanimity and instead attempts to impose an exact and precise equality, an Old Testament solution that was revoked by Our Lord, and even an attempt to create an instant kharma.

I think that Cardinal Dulles is wise to oppose the death penalty and I respect his desire to, by example, obey the magesterium of the church.

In light of the word of God, and thus of faith, life—all human life—is sacred and untouchable. No matter how heinous the crimes . . . [the criminal] does not lose his fundamental right to life, for it is primordial, inviolable, and inalienable, and thus comes under the power of no one whatsoever.

Cardinal Dulles calls this a tempting simplicity, and perhaps that is its appeal for me, but it also seems so Christian, so American, so conservative, and so descriptive of a pro-life mentality, that its rejection would be unfathomable.

Thanks for the good post.

[Conservative Coulter Fan]

Well, I can say that I was forced to debate that for hours at group called [Global Affairs] and of course there are a lot of liberal members and also a number of members from Europe. They wouldn't accept the etymology of the word, which as we all know comes from Bible and the story about Sodom and its destruction by God.

[Conservative Coulter Fan]

Could you help ease my concern over the abuse scandal, because I'm outraged that the Church would have priests who publicly advocated the very things Nambla has advocated and I find myself in disbelief that the Church would tolerate such people.

But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea. -Matthew 18:6

[Conservative Coulter Fan]

As for the 'woman taken in adultery' - see my post here at Free Republic - John 8:3-11 & Capital Punishment

[Conservative Coulter Fan]

"One can understand his words as referring only to lawfully constituted authority, or even only to lawfully constituted authority that rules justly. But the core of his message is that government—however you want to limit that concept—derives its moral authority from God. It is the “minister of God” with powers to “revenge,” to “execute wrath,” including even wrath by the sword (which is unmistakably a reference to the death penalty)." -Justice Antonin Scalia, God's Justice and Ours [Scalia on Capital Punishment]

[Conservative Coulter Fan]

I’m troubled by the concept you put forth regarding revenge, because it seems the public is demanding justice. So are we going to label a call or justice a call for retribution? To often I see in highly publicized cases the exat opposite,such as the just execution of a murderer for his crme in 1981 (spent over 20 years on death row and had already been convicte of another murder on top of he two he was given the death sentene for) and the execution was protested by 300 people. Too often I see people protesting justice.