Far too generous on immigration

SAN DIEGO UNION-TRIBUNE ^ | September 7, 2003 | Joseph Perkins

[moehoward]

Anyone unaware of the "Center for Immigration Studies" really owes it to themselves to read-up.

LINK (about CIS)

vikingcelt :
"It's refreshing to see Americans doing those jobs...you know...those jobs that "Americans just won't do." That's why I now know that that particular line of BS is a lie. Everything is working just fine here and it's Americans doing all the work."

Amen brother. I just finished a 7 month remodel. What do you know, we didn't need a single Illegal Alien on the job. Every nail, every plant, every drop of paint, earned a local American citizen his pay.

 

[Mr. Mojo]

Hanson, a scholar of ancient Rome and Greece, was aptly described as "a classicist." [Pelosi's aid] De Jesus somehow interpreted that to mean that the author had a white "classist" bias against immigrants.

His misinterpretation might've had something to do with the fact that DeJesus didn't take anything in college other than victimology classes.

[Rabid Dog]

I have a good friend who is a major, major agricultural grower in Ventura County. He says flat out with no equivocation that if there were no illegals the crops would not be picked and he would be out of business. Now why should I not listen to him? He's in the business, has been for three generations, sits on all the major ag boards and knows the industry.

I have an illegal friend in the constuction business. He gets $10.00 per hour working on government jobs. His boss charges the government $35.00 an hour for his work. His boss makes $25.00 an hour off his back. Who is the bad guy?

My illegal friend also pays $4,000 a year in taxes with his illegal social security card which he doesn't get reiumbused for (which he would he if was legal). Hundreds of millions of tax dollars are being collected this way yet I have never once seen it mentioned.

My illegal friend is seeing an American citizen who is a second generation welfare recipient. She is a product of public education, dropped out, doesn't have a job and doesn't think she needs one. My illegal friend works six days a week. She collects welfare for a child she had with another American citizen.

There are two sides to the story and no easy answer. I think the burden should be put on employers. Quit hiring them. Right now the attitude is just show me the papers (they could care less if they are fake - they aren't responsible for verifying authenticity and don't). The illegals know that and the employers know that.

[Rabid Dog]

Excellent point about providing a "built-in" excuse. The systems are sick and rather than address it, they are blaming the illegals. Total scapegoat mentality.

[Rabid Dog]

Thanks for the link. I read what they had on the webpage. I would like to know who the people are that are behind the organization. I'll do a google search later on today.

[daviddennis]

What really puzzles me is that they are providing scapegoats for people who we normally oppose, and for good reason!

We're talking about educrats who don't teach, police who'd rather write parking tickets than solve crimes, and a welfare system that thrives on incompetence!

Why should we give these people protection?

Drives me nuts.

D

[LibertyAndJusticeForAll]

Both Republicans and Democrats are ignoring the problem. The Republicans are told by business to look the other way because business likes paying low wages and no taxes.
Democrats like illegals because they vote early and often. Ask Bob Dornan of Orange county who lost to Loretta Sanchez. He proved there was voter fraud by illegals being recruited by certain latino groups but was ignored.

I'm sorry, but your friend the grower is guilty of the crime of hiring illegals. He could find Americans to do the work, but he would be forced to pay more. We would be forced to pay more for our fruits and veggies and I would gladly pay more if it meant that high-school, college students and low-skilled Americans were working. These are the people who did this work before and they will do it again if paid decent wages in decent working conditions.
Anyone hiring illegals should be reported, this is a crime.

Americans are a very generous people. Our sacrifices and generosity have helped many people in many nations through fighting for their liberty and billions in foreign aid.

When our own citizens are seeking employment, but unable to find it because of the huge influx of illegals, then a line must be drawn where foreign aid ends and taking care of our own begins.

[LibertyAndJusticeForAll]

Two more points.

By not protecting our border, we leave an avenue for terrorists to enter our country wide open.

By encouraging and allowing illegals into our country the Mexican government can continue in its corruption. Mexico is a country of great national resources. There is no reason that it is not a prosperous country. They have no middle-class because every administration has been corrupt.
The Mexican government works very hard to keep the borders open. That way we pay for their welfare programs and they can continue with a broken, corrupt system of governing.

[vikingcelt]

Well that certainly is an interesting perspective. I actually didn't know that there are NO Americans who can fix cars. Harvesting crops is a bit more problematical but I happen to think that Americans who are unemployed will do anything to pay their rent and put food on the table and that includes harvesting crops. Heck when I was growing up in the Central Valley in California the people who worked in the fields were mostly white people. I, myself, worked in the fields and in the packing sheds. I would do it now if I had too but at my age I probably don't have the strength or the stamina. But at a younger age when I had a daughter to support by myself, I would have done ANYTHING to provide for her. I do not think that other Americans are so different from myself in that regard.

"It is not the immigrant's fault that our systems are broke." Oh really??? What about public schools, what about the health care system, what about housing? You actually don't think that millions of people who should not be here do not put an incredible strain on all of that?
"We shouldn't be punishing them for our failings." Well perhaps not but it seems to me that they are certainly contributing to the failings and there is one FACT that stands out above all others: they broke the rules of our country by coming here illegally...but then you don't seem to think that the rule of law is important.

[daviddennis]

Realistically, a lot of the problem is that we are not reproducing at a high rate, so there are fewer young people to work in the fields than before. As you say, you are now disinclined to work the fields. Somebody has to, and it's not going to be me, that's for darn sure.

I certainly don't see "native" poor people begging for these jobs.

Of course there are some Americans who want car repair jobs, but it looks like we have a lot more car repair jobs than Americans who want them. Who picks up the slack? Nobody, or someone starving from Mexico who really needs the work?

Our schools and our health care system were broke BEFORE illegals became an issue. Sure, illegals don't help the problem, but nor did they cause it. It was there long before they started coming en masse, and it will still be there if we hire the Bechtel Corporation to build a giant 50 foot tall steel fence on the border.

D

[Rabid Dog]

He's totally aware he is breaking the law - but he is asking for documentation per the law and it is being provided. He knows the people he hires are illegal - but his butt is covered. And to do any more than ask to see the appropriate documentation would be a violation of their civil liberties and you know the ACLU would be all over it.

I figure that if illegals weren't hired, the ag industry would probably have to pay about 50% for the stuff to be picked and handled. I expect produce prices would double - I'm not sure how that would fly. Right now a good picker can make up to $100 a day but the work is grueling. Which works out to about $11.00 per hour - not bad pay for a high school kid. And nobody is stopping them from applying.

I expect the scenario would be the same for constuction. Costs would double due to labor. What would that do to construction industry or the housing market?

Its a tough situation and I certainly see and live both sides. I just don't like seeing the illegals get bashed for being a small part of a much bigger problem.

[Rabid Dog]

That's reminds me of an interesting fact from the Mexican perspective. Smuggling people into American is a billion dollar industry for Mexico - second only to drugs. The going rate for a coyote is $1500.00. Mexico has no incentive to stop smuggling people over - too many pockets are being lined.

[4.1O dana super trac pak]

This may help:http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/971418/posts?page=81#81

[4.1O dana super trac pak]

BUMP