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To: A.J.Armitage
And that whole thing about common decent from Abraham is also irrelivant, right?

Correct. There is no such thing as a "Jewish race". I was not born Jewish, but I am a Jew. I am not unusual, either.

Although most non-Jews may not realize it, people have been converting to Judaism for centuries. The classic example is Ruth the Moabite, a beloved Jewish matriarch and ancestor of King David, who was not born Jewish, but became a Jew by self-declaration and keeping God's laws:

"For wherever you go, I will go. Where you stay I will stay. Your people will be my people and your God will be my God." (Ruth 1:16)

There have been many periods in the history of the Jewish people where thousands of "gentiles" converted to Judaism and became Jews almost en masse, and they have been welcomed as a blessing. Frankly, I sometimes wonder how much of a blessing I myself might be to the Jewish people (dubious, at best :^), but I am proud to be Jewish, and that has everything to do with my people, not my race.

The notion of "Jewish ethnic purity" being some sort of goal of Judaism is a fallacy.

It is true that observant Jews want their sons and daughters to marry Jews, but race has nothing to do with it. Preserving the incredibly rich and ancient heritage, faith, teachings, philosophies, language and legacy of the Jewish people has everything to do with it.

This is not unique to Judaism, either. I know a few Catholics who don't want their daughters to marry non-Catholics. Does that make them racists?

143 posted on 08/27/2003 10:01:04 PM PDT by Imal (The World According to Imal: http://imal.blogspot.com)
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To: Imal
Correct. There is no such thing as a "Jewish race". I was not born Jewish, but I am a Jew. I am not unusual, either.

And you'll be expected to marry another Jew, right? I suppose you could marry another convert. Would your kids all marry converts? If you really follow the Jewish religion, eventually all your descendants will also be descendants of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. The same can't be said of, say, Catholicism. If you're a faithful Catholic and marry another Catholic, regardless of whether she's a convert or not, you won't join a (very) extended family by doing so.

The notion of "Jewish ethnic purity" being some sort of goal of Judaism is a fallacy.

Did I say anything like that? If that was a goal, the identity of the father would matter too. I know it doesn't.

This is not unique to Judaism, either. I know a few Catholics who don't want their daughters to marry non-Catholics. Does that make them racists?

1) I never accused Jews of being racist. My interest here is defending some of my brothers in Christ from false accusations.

2) There was never a Catholic homeland from which the Catholic diasporia spread, which includes all Catholics except a few converts, which converts generally merge into the original population in a few generations.

199 posted on 08/28/2003 8:51:09 AM PDT by A.J.Armitage
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To: Imal
There is no such thing as a "Jewish race". I was not born Jewish, but I am a Jew.

The word Jews has two meanings - one is religion and another is a nation ("race").

Same way with Armenians - there is an Armenian Church and Armenian nation. Still after you convert to Armenian Christinity you can marry with an Amermenian, absorb Armenian culture and in the way you will become the part of Armenian ethnic community.

Sometimes it is hard to distinguish ethnicity and religion but many Jews are atheists, especially in Israel and they see themselves as very Jewish.

204 posted on 08/28/2003 9:00:36 AM PDT by A. Pole
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