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To: Alamo-Girl
Well, I thought you'd be interested. The sheer complexity of the religious ferment in Palestine from 100 BC to 100 AD is fascinating, and what's even more fascinating is how most of it has come to light 2000 years later, with the Dead Sea Scrolls, the Nag Hammadi finds, etc..
2,263 posted on 08/23/2003 10:30:55 AM PDT by Right Wing Professor
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To: Right Wing Professor
Indeed, I am very much interested in ancient texts! Thank you so much for the encouragement!!!

what's even more fascinating is how most of it has come to light 2000 years later, with the Dead Sea Scrolls, the Nag Hammadi finds, etc..

Indeed. The dating of texts in the Dead Sea Scrolls and their accuracy compared to current texts, underscores the faithfulness of the scribes throughout the ages.

Another point that should be made, especially for Fundamentalist Christians following our discussion, concerns this passage:

But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, [even] to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. - Daniel 12:4

Obviously we are in a time of unprecedented knowledge and travel, thus many have been curious whether the hidden text has been revealed to any extent.

Some have proposed that the Bible Code is the hidden text mentioned in Daniel. So far I believe the search has been limited to a simple matrix but there was some talk of looking for any patterns in a holographic. As I recall, Newton suspected there was a code in the Pentateuch.

Still others have mentioned the book of Enoch which was rediscovered in 1773 in Ethopia, further authenticated by fragments found at Quamran, and recently translated. Enoch begins:

The blessing of Enoch; with which he blessed the elect and the righteous who would be present on the day of tribulation at (the time of) the removal of all the ungodly ones. And Enoch, the blessed and righteous man of the Lord, took up (his parable) while his eyes were open and he saw, and said "(This is) a holy vision from the heavens which the angels showed me; and I heard from them everything and I understood. I look not for this generation but for the distant one that is coming. I speak about the elect ones and concerning them. (The Old Testament Pseudepigrapha, Volume I, 1 Enoch)

I really wonder about Enoch as a candidate for several reasons. First, the age and obscure origin of it:

“But the date of the original writing upon which the second century B.C. Qumran copies were based is shrouded in obscurity. It is, in a word, old… “ - Lost Books – the book of Enoch

Secondly, whereas the book of Enoch is mostly a parable it also includes some strange references to astrophysical phenomenon which would not have been known until the far distant future:

That the light of the moon comes from the sun: "Then Uriel showed me another order (concerning) when light is beamed into the moon, from which direction of the bright sun it is beamed." 1 Enoch 78:10

We know that the moon orbits the sun and the sun orbits the Milky Way. It is very strange (to me) that Enoch would say: "They [sun and moon] do not depart from their orbit, neither increase or decrease it; but they keep faith one with another; in accordance with an oath they set and they rise." – 1 Enoch 41:5

That they generate energy: “they do not economize (on energy), for their very essence generates new power.” – 1 Enoch 41:7

That the sun shines even when it is not seen: “And neither does it diminish (in respect to its brightness) not take rest but continue to run day and night. – 1 Enoch 72: 36

And perhaps a reference to supernova: “And I saw another thing regarding lightening: how some stars arise and become lightening and cannot dwell with the rest.” 1 Enoch 44

And then there is a reference to the end of all that there is (and beginning) which sounds like a singularity: in chapter 18 a place with no measure and no content, a pit "where the heavens come together." He records that the angel explained [v. 14] "this is the ultimate end of heaven and earth; it is the prison house for the stars and the powers of heaven…"

I'm still a newbie in the Nag Hammadi corner, so I might find something even better there.

Anyway, just a few thoughts to chew on…

2,266 posted on 08/23/2003 12:35:00 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: Right Wing Professor
The sheer complexity of the religious ferment in Palestine from 100 BC to 100 AD is fascinating, and what's even more fascinating is how most of it has come to light 2000 years later, with the Dead Sea Scrolls, the Nag Hammadi finds, etc..


And you probably therefore know why that text was missing until the Dead sea scrolls were found.

That is an interesting story in itself.

And there are indeed original copies of those documents that exist, but are unavailabel for public consumption have been for the better part of 1500 years.
2,404 posted on 08/24/2003 8:55:54 PM PDT by Aric2000 (If the history of science shows us anything, it is that we get nowhere by labeling our ignorance god)
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