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CA: Desert Cop Killer, Units Converging
local area tactical scanner | August 8, 2003

Posted on 08/08/2003 10:46:55 AM PDT by lainie

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To: stumpy
I thought that theory was kinda discredited by its overuse as an excuse? a la Waco.
921 posted on 08/09/2003 8:33:39 AM PDT by lainie
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To: rodeo-mamma
It's crossed my mind, too. By just about all accounts, he was one of the good guys. The only negative stuff I've seen has been related to the city council stuff. Do you know why they disliked him? None of the articles gets into details.
922 posted on 08/09/2003 8:35:35 AM PDT by lainie
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To: lainie
Thanks again lainie, great job!
923 posted on 08/09/2003 8:36:07 AM PDT by jdontom (BacktheBadge)
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To: TechJunkYard
I don't know. Presumably they'll receive the $10,000 reward that was offered this week. I can't imagine the county won't be paying them for the damages.
924 posted on 08/09/2003 8:38:28 AM PDT by lainie
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To: stumpy
Buying or selling? ;) You noticed how quickly the media started calling the property a compound, I'm sure.
925 posted on 08/09/2003 8:40:57 AM PDT by lainie
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To: lainie
No Lainie, the tear gas cannisters generate an enormous amount of heat while generating the gas. The canisters almost always start a fire.

Back in the days that I was with S.E.B. we tried to have the fire dept close by when we used tear gas grenades. There was a type of tear gas round (not nearly as effective) that could be fired at a house, as well as the type of projectile designed to penetrate doors etc. that killed some mexican reporter during one of the East L.A. riots back in late 69/70 that was in a bar that somebody had been shooting out of.

926 posted on 08/09/2003 8:41:59 AM PDT by stumpy
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To: jdontom
No need, I didn't do anything except blab incessantly off & on for 10 hours.
927 posted on 08/09/2003 8:42:05 AM PDT by lainie
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To: stumpy
Well then why the hell do they use them? If they're guaranteed to start structure fires! Or is that the whole point, in last night's case.

And why did the fire start so long after the initial use of gas canisters? I'd have to check the time stamps between "gas has been deployed" and "fire reported" but it doesn't stand out as an immediate chain reaction in my memory.
928 posted on 08/09/2003 8:45:38 AM PDT by lainie
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To: lainie
They use the gas to drive the suspects out of where they are hiding to protect the cops, but apparently nobody has figured out how to make the gas come out of the cannisters without generating heat. As to how long it takes for a fire to start, it would depend on what the cannister landed on. If it landed on a piece of furniture, quick fire. On a tile floor, no fire.

Fired through a window and bouncing around who knows where or on what it would land.

929 posted on 08/09/2003 8:49:18 AM PDT by stumpy
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To: lainie
Yes, the cop does sound like a good guy, perhaps the type who would be a freeper type. It sounds like he had a sense of purpose and was willing to stand up for what he believed in. Last week, just by chance, I went with my sister to look for a lost dog, who was lost about 30 miles from Lake LA. A lady called and said she found a dog that looked like my sister's dog. I went with my sister, since it was at night. The lady was really talking about this cop, in fact, she knew him. This was only the day after he was killed. She said that she was very concerened and she was aware of the problem he was embroiled in with the local politicans. She was so concerned about this that she was linking the killing to the "end of days." At the time, I didn't think to question her why she said that. But obviously, Steve was the type of man who stood up for what he believed in.
930 posted on 08/09/2003 8:51:15 AM PDT by rodeo-mamma
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To: stumpy
They used an LAPD armored vehicle to launch the gas. I saw footage of that mid-afternoon.
931 posted on 08/09/2003 8:51:17 AM PDT by lainie
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To: lainie
I'm a realtor working for the homeowner.
932 posted on 08/09/2003 8:53:08 AM PDT by stumpy
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To: stumpy
Ahh. I looked at a lot of places out there myself last year. Lake LA isn't a bad community, all things considered. Now Llano on the other hand...
933 posted on 08/09/2003 9:22:21 AM PDT by lainie
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To: rodeo-mamma
I talked to a few people this week in passing who knew him or had met him. They said he was nice, well-informed but not intrusive, a regular guy, friendly, professional.
934 posted on 08/09/2003 9:37:56 AM PDT by lainie
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To: stumpy
>>Thats what did the SLA in South Central. <<

Ah yes, the SLA shootout. The event that resulted in LAPD deciding their famous 360 degree tactical deployment might not be the best possible formation after all.

The guys out front shot. The rounds went through the house, which resulted in the guys out back returning fire. The house kept shooting at them long after the occupants had ceased fire. Most of the injuries to the troops were due to friendly fire.

They don't make 'em like that anymore....
935 posted on 08/09/2003 10:22:23 AM PDT by ArmstedFragg
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Inferno destroys hideout
Confessed killer of deputy may be dead
This story appeared in the Antelope Valley Press on Saturday, August 9, 2003.

By HEATHER LAKE and WILLIAM P. WARFORD
Valley Press Staff Writers

LAKE LOS ANGELES - An armored Sheriff's Department posse fired hundreds of rounds, used a battering ram and tear gas grenades, apparently triggering an inferno at a ramshackle desert building complex Friday night where the confessed killer of Deputy Stephen Sorensen was barricaded.

Shortly after midnight today, a body believed to be that of Donald Charles Kueck, 52, was found in the debris of one of the structures, weapon at his side. A ranking Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department official at the scene said authorities believed the gunman was inside the one of four structure when it went up in flames shortly after 8 p.m. Friday.

After having cell phone contact with the suspect, they heard nothing further from him in the hours after the fire erupted.

"We are not going in until this fire extinguishes itself," Mike Soderberg, the department's chief of detectives, said late Friday night. "Every building's on fire. He couldn't run without us seeing him."

The fire leveled a house, a garage and two sheds. It blazed out of control because firefighters could not approach structures that might hold an armed assailant. When the garage ignited, Kueck bolted, racing to a shed. Soon after, the shed burst into flames.

The posse of about 200 peace officers laid siege to the desert building complex where the man suspected of killing Sorensen was holed up. The gunman traded shots with deputies during the evening until the Los Angeles Police Department ramming vehicle assaulted the complex.

Soderberg said deputies lobbed incendiary grenades, battling a "formidable adversary" they believed was armed with an assault rifle and ready to fight to the death.

"His actions tonight certainly tells us his mind-set," Soderberg said. "This guy's a desert rat. He's eluded us for six days."

Earlier in the day, Los Angeles County Sheriff Leroy D. Baca said the suspect would be taken "dead or alive." The suspect was located Friday in the desert dwelling on Palmdale Boulevard near 185th Street East after the owner of the home, a longtime friend of Kueck's, tipped off authorities.

Kueck was spotted in the morning and surrounded by officers who had been searching for him for six days, since the Saturday killing of Sorensen, who was shot during a trespassing investigation in Llano.

The siege on the suspect's hideout followed by a day the funeral for Sorensen, which was attended by 3,000 people, including hundreds of public safety officers.

Notified of the desert siege, Baca flew by helicopter from the Los Angeles basin to the scene about 18 miles east of Palmdale.

According to Baca, Kueck alerted those hunting for him, either accidentally or on purpose, by pressing a button on Sorensen's radio around noon. The gunman apparently took the radio and Sorensen's service weapon in the aftermath of the deputy's killing. When reached by sheriff's negotiators around 3 p.m., Kueck admitted killing Sorensen, Baca said.

The suspect also reportedly advised officers that he killed Sorensen because he would not tolerate an intrusion by a police officer.

In the days since the deputy's killing, it's been learned that whoever killed Sorensen bound the lawman's body to a vehicle and dragged it.

"By his own words, … no cop would come on his property and tell him what to do, and if a cop tried to come on his property, he would kill him," Baca said Friday during a news conference near the scene.

"Though he has fulfilled his promise and tragically ended the life of a great human being and a great deputy sheriff … now it's his turn to face his reality, and we want him to come down alive," the sheriff said.

Still, "We're down to what is known commonly in our business as, 'We will take him dead or alive,' " Baca said.

Throughout the afternoon, officers attempted to communicate with Kueck via Sorensen's radio and asked him to call his daughter on the telephone.

Around 6 p.m., at least one shot was heard, and deputies undertook a radio roll call to make sure no one had been hit.

Shortly afterward, authorities began using a Los Angeles Police Department ramming vehicle called "the Bear" to penetrate some of the building walls where Kueck was believed to be hiding.

Except for the approach of the LAPD vehicle, the suspect kept officers at bay with a .223 caliber assault rifle and other weapons, possibly including two of Sorensen's own guns.

That assault rifle had the power to penetrate deputies' protective vests, vehicle doors and building walls, Baca said.

"We're dealing with someone who can inflict harm from a great distance," he said.

Based on information obtained from informants earlier in the week, it was believed that Kueck had been going without medication needed for an unspecified ailment.

By 5 p.m., the suspect was believed to be tired and in pain. Soderberg said the suspect's emotions ran up and down the scale during their communications.

More shots were heard at about 7:30 p.m., and officers on the scene were waiting for the arrival of a bulldozer.

Officers have been seeking Kueck since finding Sorensen's body near 210th Street East and Avenue T-8 on Aug. 2.

A community deputy in Lake Los Angeles, Sorensen was helping to plan the annual parade for the Lake L.A. Days Festival when he left to investigate the trespassing call. About 11:30 a.m. he called his station to report he was going to the scene - a Llano residence with a trailer and outbuildings.

In the aftermath of Sorensen's killing, deputies searching the desert investigated a trailer, believed to be Kueck's, where they found an assortment of chemicals, some used in the manufacture of methamphetamine.

Deputies don't know much about the incident Sorensen was investigating. The trespass call was not reported into the sheriff's station, but Sorensen probably saw something suspicious or was told by some person in the community about the trespasser, county Under Sheriff William Stonich said Sunday.

At 12:12 p.m. - 30 minutes after Sorensen called to say where he was heading - a neighbor called the Palmdale Sheriff's Station and reported that he heard "approximately a half-dozen gunshots" in the area, Stonich said. Lancaster and Palmdale deputies raced to Llano searching for Sorensen.

Sorensen came to the Antelope Valley from El Segundo more than a decade ago, seeking a new way of life in a rural atmosphere. His supervisor, Capt. Carl Deeley, said Sorensen also understood that his job was more than enforcing the law in suburban tract areas. His duties included an area of the desert known as a home to outlaws and drug labs.

Thursday, more than 3,000 mourners packed the pews of Lancaster Baptist Church to bid goodbye to the first deputy slain in the Valley in more than a decade. The last, Richard B. Hammack, was killed during a drug raid in 1992.

Among those in attendance at the service were Gov. Gray Davis; Los Angeles County supervisors Michael D. Antonovich, Zev Yaroslavsky and Don Knabe; and Assemblywoman Sharon Runner, R-Lancaster. Also in attendance were District Attorney Steve Cooley, Los Angeles Police Department Chief William Bratton, Los Angeles County Fire Department and California Highway Patrol officials and the city leadership of Lancaster and Palmdale.

Valley Press Staff Writer Bob Wilson contributed to this report.

936 posted on 08/09/2003 10:40:53 AM PDT by lainie
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937 posted on 08/09/2003 10:42:41 AM PDT by lainie
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Thinking back, the property was reported to have a "guest house." I think that might be the source of the confusion on the house-burning question.
938 posted on 08/09/2003 10:45:04 AM PDT by lainie
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To: lainie
Morning! I had to get off the computer last night, so I missed the rest. I guess Kueck finally learned to use the radio and was able to give them a detailed confession?

I wonder if homeowners insurance will cover all the property damage?
939 posted on 08/09/2003 11:10:18 AM PDT by TheSpottedOwl (California is in death throes. If you can't keep her alive...get out of the way!)
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To: TheSpottedOwl
As I understood it, he was on a cell phone with homicide and with his daughter at some point. I don't know if the insurance will cover it but I'd assume the county will. They inflicted the damage.
940 posted on 08/09/2003 11:17:42 AM PDT by lainie
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