Posted on 07/24/2003 1:55:39 PM PDT by Mr.Atos
I was just lisening to Medved debating Creationism with Athiests on the air. I found it interesting that while Medved argued his side quite effectively from the standpoint of faith, his opponents resorted to condescension and beliitled him with statements like, "when it rains, is that God crying?" I was reminded of the best (at least most amusing)debate that I have ever heard on the subject of Creationism vs Evolution, albeit a fictional setting. It occurred on the show, Friends of all places between the characters Pheobe (The Hippy) and Ross (The Paleontologist). It went like this...
Pheebs: Okay...it's very faint, but I can still sense him in the building...GO INTO THE LIGHT MR. HECKLES!!
Ross: Whoa, whoa, whoa. What, uh, you don't believe in evolution? Pheebs: Nah. Not really. Ross: You don't believe in evolution? Pheebs: I don't know. It's just, ya know, monkeys, Darwin, ya know, it's a, it's a nice story. I just think it's a little too easy.
Ross: Uh, excuse me. Evolution is not for you to buy, Phoebe. Evolution is scientific fact. Like, like, the air we breathe, like gravity... Pheebs: Uh, okay, don't get me started on gravity.
Ross: You uh, you don't believe in gravity? Pheebs: Well, it's not so much that ya know, like I don't *believe* in it, ya know. It's just...I don't know. Lately I get the feeling that I'm not so much being pulled down, as I am being pushed.
Ross: How can you NOT BELIEVE in evolution? Pheebs: [shrugs] I unh-huh...Look at this funky shirt!!
Ross: Well, there ya go. Pheebs: Huh. So now, the REAL question is: who put those fossils there, and why...?
Ross: OPPOSABLE THUMBS!! Without evolution, how do YOU explain OPPOSABLE THUMBS?!? Pheebs: Maybe the overlords needed them to steer their spacecrafts!
Pheebs: Uh-oh! Scary Scientist Man!
Pheebs: Okay, Ross? Could you just open your mind like, *this* much?? Okay? Now wasn't there a time when the brightest minds in the world believed that the Earth was flat? And up until what, like, fifty years ago, you all thought the atom was the smallest thing, until you split it open, and this like, whole mess o' crap came out! Now, are you telling me that you are so unbelievably arrogant that you can't admit that there's a teeny, tiny possibility that you could be wrong about this?!?
Pheebs: I can't believe you caved. Ross: What? Pheebs: You just ABANDONED your whole belief system! I mean, before, I didn't agree with you, but at least I respected you. Ross: But uh.. Pheebs: Yeah...how...how are you gonna go in to work tomorrow? How...how are you gonna face the other science guys? How...how are you gonna face yourself? Oh! [Ross runs away dejected] Pheebs: That was fun. So who's hungry?
I think we have a general agreement to not call something a "lie" unless there can be shown an intent to deceive.
IMHO, every post should be taken as having been made in good faith unless it can be shown that there was an intent to misrepresent or spin the facts. Honest people can disagree on their interpretation of the facts, but intentional misrepresentation fouls the discussion.
Can disruptors do no wrong in your eyes simply because they profess to be Christians while acting as hooligans?
Actually, we evolved. ;^)
Vade, there have always been "squeaky wheels" on the forum - that is to be expected. But when the most staid and respected posters here join the fray, become vindictive and start using tactics they would have never previously considered, something is wrong.
Yes that was me. I asked him what problems he had with the evidence for evolution. His responses were several jokes with references to homosexuality and a jpg of Darwin getting zapped by Donald Rumsfeld (apparently with a tazer). Since then I simply ignored him.
But why take our word for it? ALS already admitted his only purpose here is to disrupt.
Ya know, I've been posting on these crevo threads for more than four years now, and it has only been in the last couple of months that there has been such disruption going on -- and that seems to correspond to about the time you and ALS joined in. Prior to this we may have seen a handful of posts pulled per year. Nearly every crevo post in the last couple of months has been pulled (I think a half dozen survive, and we usually average at least a dozen such threads a month).
Disruption and name-calling is never a good thing - even when it's done by an evo like you.
That's my point. You are still the pot trying to call the kettle black.
Indeed. And I see nothing wrong with that. It's a debate tactic. The thing that angers me and fuels my fire, is that, myself, nor ALS, show ANYONE here less respect than we ourselves are given. If I don't get respect...I'll rarely offer any in return....If I don't GIVE someone respect, I don't EXPECT to get any back...UNLIKE so many evolutionists here. Cobalt is a perfect example. She attacked ME (for NO reason) and then became indignant when I bit her back. It's the exact thing I see here in these last 50 posts or so. I see attackers crying victimhood.
Really? You've seen me respond with 200 posts of garbage in a single night simply to be disruptive? You've seen me hound people, bash their Catholicism, and imply that they are homosexuals, solely to disrupt threads and get them pulled? You've seen me spam advertisements time and again after Jim has asked us not to do that?
Well, have you? If not, can you tell the difference? Is deliberately disrupting a thread okay if you agree with the side that's doing it?
I've always wondered about these Lurkers. Are there really people who sit around and read ther people's slanging matches, without joining in?
VadeRetro is right that most of more egregious threads have been pulled. I have a copy of ALS's little 'are you a professor' campaign, which contradicts what he wrote in his pseudoapology.
I've seen instances where you have initiated the name-calling, et al. Take some responsibility for your own behavior.
I do not believe this position is tenable, A-G. Given that BB has called for the "naming of names" in post 193, and you have apparently signed on to this in your post 270, I fear that it would appear hypocritical of you to complain broadly on the one hand, while not meeting your own standard of airing specific grievances on the other. Bring specific accusations to the table, A-G, and let those involved step up to defend themselves, or drop the broad hints about particular instances and the theatrical sighs lamenting the decline of the Republic.
We have disagreed in the past, A-G, but, I think, on generally reasonable and even friendly terms. And on those same terms, I am here to tell you that you simply cannot have it both ways. Name names, or begone.
Threads started being pulled as fast as they were made in early June. Jim Rob was threatening to ban the crevo threads and all regular players thereon in June. Threads have been regularly dumped full of graphic chaff and trash talk pollution since June.
A-G's first clue was within the last week.
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