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To: billbears
You may consider Hamilton an equivocator if you like. I don't happen to have a reason to question Hamilton's integrity. I don't understand why you do.

While I consider Madison to be brilliant as affirmed by many historical accounts, I leave it open to the possibility that perhaps he did actually mis-understand Hamilton.

All this reference to Clintonism, and "is," has no historical basis in fact in the context of Hamilton that I am aware of. Can you cite examples of questionable examples of integrity in the context of Hamilton that would have you so glibly, if not carelessly, lump him in with an example of one of the lowest forms of politician in recent American politics?

372 posted on 07/26/2003 6:14:54 PM PDT by Agamemnon
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To: Agamemnon
So long as his colleagues were present his own vote was useless, and he absented himself for some time from the debates after making one remarkable speech (June 18th, 1787). In this he held up the British government as the best model in the world. Though fully conscious that monarchy in America was impossible, he wished to obtain the next best solution in an aristocratic, strongly centralized, coercive, but representative union, with devices to give weight to the influence of class and property. His plan had no chance of success; but though unable to obtain what he wished, he used his great talents to secure the adoption of the Constitution.

While I consider Madison to be brilliant as affirmed by many historical accounts, I leave it open to the possibility that perhaps he did actually mis-understand Hamilton.

I don't. From his own notes

The supreme executive authority of the United States to be vested in a governor, to be elected to serve during good behaviour. His election to be made by electors, chosen by electors, chosen by the people, in the election districts aforesaid. His authorities and functions to be as follows-

To have a negative upon all laws about to be passed, and the execution of all laws passed; to have the entire direction of war, when authorized, or begun; to have, with the advice and approbation of the senate, the power of making all treaties; to have the sole appointment of the heads or chief officers of the departments of finance, war, and foreign affairs; to have the nomination of all other officers, (ambassadors to foreign nations included,) subject to the approbation or rejection of the senate; to have the power of pardoning all offenses, except treason, which he shall not pardon, without the approbation of the senate.

10. All laws of the particular States, contrary to the constitution or laws of the United States, to be utterly void. And the better to prevent such laws being passed, the governor or president of each State shall be appointed by the general government, and shall have a negative upon the laws about to be passed in the State of which he is governor, or president.

Here

Never mind Senators for life (which stinks quite much like the House of Lords) and a Supreme Court for life, this was to be a 'governor' for life as well. So every part of the national government would be for life except for the House of Representatives. On top of that, we have state governors appointed by the national government. This man didn't want a federal system and his own notes portray that fact. He wanted a limited monarchy and this plan along with his speech from June 18, while accepting a true monarchy could never exist, argued for such a government. Hamilton wanted a king and his political grandson, the 16th President, practically gave it to him

Hamilton was no friend of a Republic.

373 posted on 07/26/2003 7:41:08 PM PDT by billbears (Deo Vindice)
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