Treason: Horowitz v. Coulter

Mensnewsdaily.com ^ | 7/11/03 | Bruce Walker

[Eva]

I posted a link to a Malmedy article that defended McCarthy on an earlier thread. Don't you find it a touch ironic that the same people who decry the treatment of the Al Qaeda members at camp x-ray, are referring to McCarthy'
s defense of the Nazi rank and file tank soldiers as wrong?

While I don't remember much about the McCarthy era, I know that although my grandfather was investigated as a communist, I never heard the name McCarthy mentioned in connection with it.

[Map Kernow]

also never meant that to suggest that Ann Coulter is part of the religious right

I'm not really sure how one qualifies as a member of the "religious right," but I do know that Ann appears to believe not only in God, but in Christianity---she even gives the Lord an acknowledgement at the start of "Treason." I believe she's Catholic, which is cool, because so am I.

I don't know whether there's any truth to the rumors that Ann has been this or that person's "paramour." However, I do know that people who profess Christianity---be it Catholicism or Presbyterianism---know that sinning, repentance, and divine forgiveness are part of the profession. I also know that Ann has never espoused violation of Christian tenets about sexual morality. Recalling the Lord's challenge in John Chapter 8, I find it hard to believe that a fellow Christian (not to mention at this point a fellow conservative) would try to make an issue of Ann's private conduct on a thread about whether or not her book "Treason" is factually accurate or stylistically appropriate.

I respectfully disagree with your point. I think Ann is incontrovertibly "right," and I will warmly credit her religious profession. For me then, Ann is part of the "religious right," and one of its most precious members.

[First Amendment]

Could you again post the link to the article concerning McCarthy's defense of the German soldiers here, too? So those of us here could read it?

[Endeavor]

You fruitloop, this subject is exhausted, don't you think? If not, then go read this: http://www.publicbroadcasting.net/wxxi/news.newsmain?action=article&ARTICLE_ID=520052

It's a perfect explanation why some of us conservatives have a problem with "Treason."

[Eva]

Here is a link to the article describing McCarthy's role in the Malmedy incedent.

[DPB101]

A dumb and I mean dumb article from the Los Angeles Times. Pure Bob Scheer.

"Liberals published Chamber's book so liberals are good people...see?...see?...see?"...geezzz....

The useful idiot who wrote that hadn't read Coulter's book either. If he did, he would know why the GOP finally gave up and that doesn't mean McCarthy was what liberals claim he was.

[savagesusie]

I think David Horowitz owes Ann an apology and a retraction of his statements. He has slipped up on more than one occasion lately and I am a Horowitz fan! He was wrong about the Log Cabin Republicans which was odd also...don't know who has him on a chain lately. Chris Matthews is always a rude, deceiving person, so his comments were expected.

[First Amendment]

Wow - I just read the article, it was very saddening. And increased my respect for Tailgunner Joe.

[nopardons]

Thanks for the ping and the links, some of which DPB101 has already posted as threads/ to threads.

Unlike many, I've always known the difference between truth and propaganda about this stuff. It's taken a very long time; but, now, with Ann's book, the facts and truth will out. Everyone, who reads this book, should be compelled to tell evereyone he or she knows and spread the word. Most have been living in the fog of duplicity and lies;now that fog needs to be cleared blown away.

[Grampa Dave]

If our nation's soul, morality and compass of doing what is right is destroyed or killed, we have lost the war.

This is why for years I have called what we are in each day a Cultural War. The left wing maggots started it a couple of decades ago. We are just waking up to what they have done to our nation and us.

We don't have ABCNNBCBS on our side to get our side of the cultural war out to the rest of America. At least 90% of the print media/mediots in America are life long card carrying rat.

We have conservative talk radio, FNC, a few conservative newspapers, the internet and Free Republic to get the truth out to our side and the rest of the nation.

[Eva]

I think the fact that Rabinowitz used the Malmedy tragedy to smear McCarthy once more, should make everyone on Free Republic re-evaluate their opinion of this woman. She made one good decision, to defend Juanita Brodderick, that's about it.

[conservatism_IS_compassion]

On Feb. 9, 1950, McCarthy gave a speech claiming that 57 known communists were harbored in the State Department. Subsequently, at various times, he raised the number to 81, 205 or "a lot." At no point did he offer any evidence for his charge -- let alone put names next to those numbers.

In fact, there may well have been subversives in the State Department, but McCarthy's allegation was about as helpful as proclaiming that there are criminals in Los Angeles.

"may well have been". This, from a writer who brags that everyone knows Hiss was guilty as sin. And Hiss was right there at Roosevelt's elbow! But it wasn't only Hiss; commies were working with and for each other in the FDR and Truman Administrations as thick as thieves. The point is not that FDR and Truman weren't careful enough to check that infiltration; the point is that the Democrats didn't even think ill of Stalin or his acolytes in their midst.

We know that because of Venona, but Venona was basically a "rogue" operation run by patriots in the Army against Truman's directions. It was secret from POTUS--and practically everyone else--for the very good reason that telling Truman about commies got you on his excrement list. He like as not would hand your report to someone you had just told him was a paid Soviet agent, and order him to deal with it.

You have been cowed by the big lie into thinking that defending McCarthy is beyond the pale. The truth is that defending Truman and Roosevelt belongs in that category; FDR was dying to get us into WWII against 80% public disapproval. Why? A couple of hints:

FDR's first diplomatic move as POTUS was to recognize the USSR.

FDR had the Navy harassing the Atlantic U-boats "throughout the summer of 1941." (The New Dealers' War, Thomas Fleming)

Hitler invaded the USSR on June 22, 1941.

Liberals have to blacken McCarthy's name to obfuscate that record, and much worse. Ann calls it 50 years of treason, but 50 years ago some Republicans were calling the FDR/HST Administrations "twenty years of treason" and would have been shocked to learn how right they actually were.

If the relation between the Bush Administration and al Qaeda were remotely similar to that between the FDR Administration and Stalin, you would hesitate not an instant in demanding the impeachment of the president and the vice president. Not an instant.

[conservatism_IS_compassion]

the same people who decry the treatment of the Al Qaeda members at camp x-ray, are referring to McCarthy' s defense of the Nazi rank and file tank soldiers as wrong

"Ironic" indeed. And McCarthy was criticized for having a gay assistant, now a resume enhancement.

It would indeed be sweet if Ann got McCarthy a posthumous Presidential Medal of Freedom from Bush. Then we'd know that the treason was broken. But that would mean that the Democratic Party was shattered.

[MEG33]

bump

[HISSKGB]

I was appalled when I read your link. How could these people be allowed to violate every standard of human decency and justice? Those who whitewashed torture and injustice at Nuremberg and Dachau must be woefully ignorant or viscious liars.

[Eva]

Frankly, I read more about the author of the article for the firs time last night and was a little distressed, myself. I wasn't sure what I was reading, but it seems that she may have some connection to those who denied the holocaust. Is that what you think, also?

I tried to do more research on her and came up empty.

[Eva]

I have to add, that some of the research that I did on the Malmedy attack, did support her conclusions on this incedent, though. The soldiers were simply young, rank and file members of a tank division who were given orders to fire on enemy soldiers in the path of their forward movement. The POW group was decimated before they could take cover or escape. A unit of SS then searched the scene, killing survivors and pursing the few who briefly escaped. The soldiers that McCarthy defended were not the SS. (This came from an Army Mortuary site) By today's standards, a death sentece for rank and file tank operators would be very extreme.

[Eva]

I re-read some of the other material on the author's web-site and I now have some doubts about this woman. I think that she bears further investigation before we take her side of the story as accurate.

[Map Kernow]

You fruitloop, this subject is exhausted, don't you think? If not, then go read this: http://www.publicbroadcasting.net/wxxi/news.newsmain?action=article&ARTICLE_ID=520052

It's a perfect explanation why some of us conservatives have a problem with "Treason."

An article by James Pinkerton? The man who insists that the Republican Party abandon its pro-life position every chance he gets? Oh, yeah: rock-solid "conservative."

Leaving aside his girlie man ad hominem jibes at Ann ("Terminatrix," etc.), Pinkerton's slimeball article attacks Ann's book with two alleged points. First, he takes issue with Ann's assertion that Whittaker Chambers, a genuine hero who exposed communist penetration of the Federal government before McCarthy, "continues to be dismissed, if not despised." Pinkerton retorts that Chambers "is not forgotten," that his book Witness is "still in print," and that the "MTV Generation" can go snap up their own copies. Wow, some point to score against Ann! Just like the kind of nit-picking trivialities and non-sequiturs you find on websites purporting to "expose" Ann's "factual errors." I challenge Pinkerton or anyone else to find where Chambers is mentioned, much less mentioned favorably, in American history school textbooks. Chambers is in fact "dismissed and despised" by our academic and media elites, for telling the truth.

Pinkerton's second point simply takes him back to the well-worn leftist liturgy about "McCarthyism." Pinkerton cites McCarthy's "Original Sin" of the Wheeling WVA speech citing 57 communists in the State Department, blaming him for NOT giving out the names of the alleged Reds, and condemning Ann for praising McCarthy's refusal to disclose---hmm, I thought one of the "evils of McCarthyism" was the disclosure of names. Pinkerton gamely concedes that "there may well have been subversives in the State Department" [!!!!!!], but that that was no excuse for McCarthy raising the subject. After all, McCarthy went so far as to "slander" the Army and "World War II hero" George C. Marshall, and made the "architecture of containment" being laid down by that anti-communist stalwart Harry Truman more difficult, etc. etc. Straight from the left-wing playbook.

Thanks for the link, Count Chocula. Reading Pinkerton's slimy prose just boosted my faith in Ann.

[Map Kernow]

I re-read some of the other material on the author's web-site and I now have some doubts about this woman. I think that she bears further investigation before we take her side of the story as accurate.

You don't mention the author's name---you know that was one of Joe McCarthy's "sins"---do you mean Freda Utley? What exactly are your doubts? That she's a "Holocaust denier"? Could you provide us with a cite, please? And while you're at it, maybe you can provide us with a reason why your "doubts" now mean Rabinowitz' revival of an ancient smear against McCarthy must be credited. Please be more specific, unless your object is simply to conduct your own little smear.