Biology textbook hearings prompt science disputes [Texas]

Knight Ridder Newspapers ^ | 08 July 2003 | MATT FRAZIER

[Virginia-American]

We agree, creationism cannot be tested...neither can evolution.

False. Every time a fossil is dug up, it is a test of evolution, in the sense that it has the potential to disprove it. (eg, a precambrian rabbit). So far, it's never happened.

[Stultis]

And, adding to that, why did God created two teleomeres -- usually only found at the ends of chromosomes, where they function, among other things, to prevent "unraveling" -- arranged head to head in the middle of one human chrosmosome, in exactly the right place to correspond with two ape chromosomes, making it appear that a fusion event had occurred in the human lineage. God also created an extra centromere -- usually only one per chromosome -- again exactly where it "needed" to be if the single human chromosome had fused from two, as in the apes.

Seriously, HalfFull, why would God separately create specific, diagnostic, and otherwise piddling and unnecessary details in human and ape chromosomes for no discernable reason but to make it look like two ape chromosomes had fused into one human chromosome?

For more on the apparent chromosome fusion:

http://www.gate.net/~rwms/EvoEvidence.html (Click on "Comparison of the Human and Great Ape Chromosomes as Evidence for Common Ancestry" in the second paragraph of the introduction.)

And for more telltale evidence of shared ancestry between and humans, from a different mutational event on a different chromosome, try this:

A Translocation Between Man and Chimpanzee Chromosomes

[JesseShurun]

do you love me, now that I can dance? placemarker

[ALS]

"Maybe it's this, that my suspicion is that God seems to increase the evidence as disbelief increases"

I know this to be a reality. Unfortunately for evoids, they exclude themselves from testability.

[NewLand]

Slow night...I just installed a new wireless network...finally, everything is working jody tody!

Have a great weekend. My family comes home tomorrow afternoon, which means my FR time will be reduced...but thats fine. I miss my girls like crazy.

[ALS]

Girls are wunnerful proof that random chance couldn't of dunnit

[<1/1,000,000th%]

Did it ever occur to you to ask yourself how many Christians are fundamentalist creationists?

Is it possible that your definition of Christian is faulty?

I think that creationist/ID'ers learn science in publik school. That's why they tend to see it in opposition to faith. After I started lurking here I bumped into a lot of these folks in my work place. I think they were unable to evaluate this stuff on their own because their understanding of science is so poor. (Carbon 14 is made from carbon 12 by sunlight?)

I also believe that people who push creationism/ID as science are doing it to make money. The creationist industry is measured in the billions of dollars. They fragment the Christian community to make a living. Just follow the money.

[Virginia-American]

Thanks! interesting links.

[ALS]

What a pile of crock. Click the pic above for a clue.

[JesseShurun]

In a little cafe,
just the other side of the border
She was just sitting there
givin' me looks that made my mouth water
So I started walking her way
She belonged to bad man, Bill Clinton
Then I heard the guitar player say
"Vamoose, Hillary's on her way"
Then I knew, yes I knew I should run for president
But then I heard Janet Reno say, yeah
Come a little bit closer
You're my kind of man
So evolved, doncha know, and so strong
Evolve a little bit closer
I'm all alone in the protoplasm
And the night is so long
Then the music stopped
When I looked the cafe was empty
Then I heard Darwin say
Man you know you're in trouble plenty"
So I dropped my big banana gene from my hand
And through the dimensional window I ran
And as I rode away
I could hear Hillary say to Reno yeah
Come a little bit closer
You're my kind of evolved hunk of man
So big and so strong, you burn up babies
Come a little bit closer
I'm all alone
And the night is so long
BR BRLa la-la-la la-la BRLa la-la-la la-la BRHo ho la-la BRLa la la-la BR BR

[<1/1,000,000th%]

Nice links! It's always easier with pictures.

[ALS]

Looks like anutter Put Up Yer Dukes original!

[Alamo-Girl]

Thank you so much for your post and your encouragements!

I have no idea how you even set up a time coordinate for an omnipresent Deity.

Looking at the purpose of the Genesis account, the first phrase, "In the beginning, God created..." the clear indication to me is that the space/time coordinate we ought to use to understand the Genesis account is the point at which time takes hold, at the inception, at the Big Bang.

If you use the space/time coordinate for the Genesis account, you come up with 6-7 elapsed days accounting for 15 billion years from our space/time coordinate looking back.

IOW, if God sent you a message in the physical realm, at the beginning of Day 1 you would have received it 8 billion years later, from your space/time coordinate.

For Lurkers, this has to do with the inflationary model. When we see today light from a star 12 billion light years away, that same star would be very close to where our star would be formed, 12 billion years ago in the expansion of the universe. So why did it take so long to get here? Because space/time is created as the universe expands.

These charts might help:

Relativistic line of sight

Space/time Map of the Universe

From the Schroeder article:

(In case you want to know, this exponential rate of expansion has a specific number averaged at 10 to the 12th power. That is in fact the temperature of quark confinement, when matter freezes out of the energy: 10.9 times 10 to the 12th power Kelvin degrees divided by (or the ratio to) the temperature of the universe today, 2.73 degrees. That's the initial ratio which changes exponentially as the universe expands.)

[Alamo-Girl]

Thanks for the heads up to the dancing Reno!

[JesseShurun]

gender is arbitrary, choose one. So sayith Ellen Dargenesis

[js1138]

and strata do occasionally get folded up sideways and upside down as mountains form...

This little bit of three deminsional puzzle solving has been known for over two hundred years -- long before Darwin.

[ALS]

For an in-depth view of Alamo-Girl's Wonderful Works!

"Origins" & "Evolution Through The Back Door"

click the pic!

[js1138]

that is precisely why logical positivism died the death it deserved...

Interesting post...

[JesseShurun]

Bill Clinton quote: "Why yes, I believe in evolution. The VRWC which hates Hillary and the Waco-ey Christian fundamentalists who voted for Ronald Reagan, want you to think that Hillary, when we put her into office, will be prejudiced against them. I assure you, she will persecute them to the letter of the law, and when the Law, fails, she will make it up."

[Alamo-Girl]

Thank you so very much for the encouragements and for linking to the articles! Hugs!!!