Wolfowitz in Skopje – What Next for Macedonia?

antiwar.com ^ | May 20, 2003 | Christopher Deliso

[Diocletian of Spalato]

He floats between HQ in Sarajevo and Bihac on certain occasions......I'll be cruising through Bihac around the 16th of July.

[wonders]

And stop this silly names stuff -- you know there's a link to them as well as I do -- I simply didn't bookmark that link, although I'm sure someone on the FR Balkan threads did and all we have to do is wait for them to post it. I remember reading it some time ago and recognising names of people I found alive and well. That link isn't my basis for estimating the number killed, anyway. My basis has to do with more reliable indicators. And those indicators aren't published on the Web, so I freely admit my own numbers can be set for purposes of discussion here. We rely on sources like the NYT here, don't we?

Can you provide a link listing killed Croats? Well, I don't ask you to... I know there were murdered Croats as well...

You fellas just WOULD kill one 'nother (in Scarlet O'Hara accent). We did too, in our own Civil War a few generations ago. Neither war was decent or pretty, whatever the hype.

[wonders]

rolling hills of Kentucky

Tennessee, actually. No matter, Kentucky or Tennessee, we make fine whiskey!

[Diocletian of Spalato]

Wonders, are you seriously suggesting that we killed 5,000 to 7,000 Serbs in cold blood during Oluja? C'mon! That's as ridiculous as the Jihadi sites that say that 10,000 Muslims were murdered around Srebrenica.

Some people died during the first 96 hours of action....that happens in war. Some 400-500 were murdered after the 4th was already in Bosnia and the MUP was in charge.

Don't look to Gotovina, look to Markac.

[PiP PiP Cherrio]

I'll be there 12 days later, in Sanski Most/Novi Grad district, may tip my toe on the border of the RSK/RS...

I am moving up my PiP by a week, as the distance is a few hundred kilometers shorter than I anticipated. Gives more time roaming around...:)) Should try to stay another two weeks or push your trip back a bit.

[Diocletian of Spalato]

Can't do it...too many people from here and from Australia will be in Dalmacija around the same time...although it'd be good to meet up for a beer in Banja Luka....I've got an invite from a certain Col. Vukosavljevic to come for a drink or two.....he was under Gvero in the VRS in the West against Dudakovic.

[PiP PiP Cherrio]

Heck, the only invite outside of Beograd I had last time were from Albanians on the Serb/Kosovo ZOS, and that was because they thought I was a Serb Muslim with a twangy southern accent.

I didnt get a chance to look up or "hook up" with Maia from HP. Wanted to check out her fathers (Indianac) kafana, see if it was there and if the AK holes were still in the ceiling...:) YU Pivo can not be beat, mix that in with either Cevapi or Karajdevo as a meal- prijatno!

[Diocletian of Spalato]

Prijatno!

[PiP PiP Cherrio]

Are you heading into Green Bosnia? Zenica, etc...

[Diocletian of Spalato]

Bugojno and Travnik for sure as they're only a little over an hour and a half east of Livno. I wanna see what's going on. Travnik is infested with Jihadist thinking.

[PiP PiP Cherrio]

Leave the raghead wearing behind, unless you blend in... take a pic of you in the mosque doing some psuedo-islam praying...be sure to take your shoes off before entering the mosque...and to wash your feet, its a muslim thang!

[Diocletian of Spalato]

Never! :)

[PiP PiP Cherrio]

hey, i tried to play muslim in Novi Pazar, but I went to "service" too late. as I was removing my shoes, the guys were walking out...staring at me as my friend walked away--laughing...:)

[dennisw]

That's a lot of illegal Islamic immigration to a country that's not very rich like Western Europe or the USA. It all comes back to explosive Muslim demographics. Demographics provide half the reason for Jihad...... more land, more "living room"(liebensraum) is need by the Muslims.

[getoffmylawn]

No matter, Kentucky or Tennessee, we make fine whiskey!

Oh wow. There you were cruising along, eloquently informing us of your thoughtful observations drenched in integrity, and you have to go and make a comment like that. Everyone must know that only the Irish know how to make fine whiskey ;-)

[Hoplite]

If you're interested in obtaining knowledge about the dissolution of Yugoslavia, which, again, is a prerequisite for discussions like we're having here, then read a book.

Silber and Little's Yugoslavia: Death of a Nation would be a good place to start.

If you're really interested, most libraries contain microfiches of newspaper and periodicals from the time, which is very helpful in getting a picture of how events were unfolding and the perception of those events as they happened - The Economist had fairly decent weekly coverage of the area during the time frame in question, and would be a good place for you to start if you choose to follow that route.

Lastly, if what you see on the web, notably here on FR, cannot be verified independently (by you, looking at alternate sources), rate the reliability of that information accordingly.

[inquest]

I guess non-recognition leaving us to the mercy of the JNA with the examples of Vukovar and Vocin would have been a better option?

How would non-recognition have "left you to the mercy" of anyone? Did recognition somehow cast a magic veil of protection around your people? As far as I can see, it only inflamed the situation in Bosnia, and led to ethnic cleansing of Serbs in the Krajina.

[Hoplite]

If you're not going to talk to me, as you've resolved to do, please refrain from mentioning me in your posts, or, at a minimum, have the decency to refrain from misrepresenting my position - that would work for the both of us, I think.

[inquest]

Now really, you can't state in your own words why it was so necessary for us to stand side by side with Croatia as they went about their dirty business? At long last this is what the whole discussion comes down to? Here's a book, read it?

You've solidly proven that you're not here to elucidate or to inform, but to attack in the most childish way, in a pitiful attempt to intimidate others into silence. I don't know what your angle is, or why you have such a strong allergy to open discussion on this subject, and frankly I don't care. But you can just keep it up all you want - you'll only continue to blatantly expose yourself for what you are.

[Hoplite]

Veritas

As it states, not a definitive listing, but the number and time frame are informative.