Messy camp costs troops calls to home (kuwait)

gomemphis.com ^ | 20 APR 03 | By Cox News Service

[KineticKitty]

Messy camp costs troops calls to home

By Cox News Service

April 20, 2003

CAMP UDAIRI, Kuwait - On the eve of Easter, Fort Hood's sons and daughters couldn't call home from this miserable desert outpost because the place has been declared too messy.

The perhaps aptly named "Mayor" Bosse closed the phone tent "until further notice" and created an uproar among thousands of 4th Infantry Division troops waiting here for convoys into Iraq.

Dubbed the mayor because he is in charge of administering the camp, Mayor Bosse is actually Lt. Col. Peter Bosse, a reserve officer from Minneapolis, Minn.

It's not as though this is a scenic site. There is no vegetation - only sand and rocks and tents and tanks and Humvees and soldiers. There are also very few trash cans. Litter consists mostly of empty plastic water bottles.

The trash piles are possible breeding grounds for rodents and fire hazards, Bosse said.

The phone tent opened only a couple of days ago. Lines for a call home are hours long but soldiers willingly wait to hear the voices of loved ones.

Bosse said when the camp is clean, the phone tent will "absolutely" re-open immediately.

"I suspect that will happen soon," said Bosse.

[Darksheare]

He didn't learn from it.
It took me having a death in my family and the Cap calling me a liar, then trying to AWOL me for being at a funeral (Which I was excused for.) to bring things to the attention of the higher ups.
They couldn't figure out why we had such a hard time holding onto troops. (They barred us from transferring to other units to try and 'solve' taht problem.)
So when I had to bury my step-daughter and the Cap pulled his usual crap, he finally got caught 'out there'.
(His exact quote to me was, "Your daughter is, in fact, alive. And even if she wasn't, suck it up and drive on. She didn't mean anything ot you anyway." I can't have any children of my own...)

[Darksheare]

The article also states that there are very few garbage cans.
The LTC in charge could help alieviate the problem by requesting MORE cans. (Probably a stretch in logic for the LTC, I know..)

Logpac comes and gets the bagged trash. But only if they're told to do so by the guy in charge. (At least, that's how they treated my unit.)

So now he's got few garbage cans (not enough for the volume of troops there.) and stuff is piling up.
He's gotta call in for more cans, as well as call Logpac to haul stuff away.
He's also gotta get the people on the detail to change the bags in the cans as aoften as possible. (I'm just citing the solutions for the evident problem the LTC has. If Logpac is operating as I saw them do, then the LTC has to make a call. If he didn't, then it's his problem.)
No, not like hoping teh garbage men come into your home.
More like hoping they pick the bags up off the curb, without paying the bill.
If Logpac doesn't get a call in, they don't haul the stuff away. (But they'll bring in supplies..)
If there are as the article states, few garbage cans, then there is a problem as well.
Where does the LTC expect the troops to put trash?

[Eagle Eye]

Miliary, and civil servants most assurdly can direct contractors, but only within the terms of the contract.

AR 715-9 says the opposite. 'shall not be supervised or directed by military or DA civs...'

And for all the know it alls who are functionally illiterate, I never said that a reservist rank is irrelevant, but that there are federal restrictions in placing reservist in command or supervising regulars.

[Darksheare]

My Captain refused to call a medevac for a soldier in my unit who had a heart attack in the field.
A General or full bird SHOULD have been all over him.
Never happened.
He got away with it.
Somehow he covered his butt.
(Our XO called the medevac behind the Cap's back. The Cap was not a very popular man.)

My old unit had a problem with officers quashing reports of mismanagement.
Our Cpatain liked to shred any paperwork that you had to support your position. Prove it? Not on your life, one 'had to go through the chain of command' and the Cap was as vindictivve as any woman. If you stepped over his head and jumped the chain of command, he'd bring holy hell on you for it.
Our NCO's lost stripes once in awhile for trying to stick up for the troops.
Once they were cowed, no-one tried to stand up to the Cap's abuses of authority. (There's more, ALOT more.)
If no-one gets the word out to anyone in a postion to do something, nothing is done.
It took me having to bury my step-daughter and the Cap pulling his usual crap on me to get the higher ups to notice that there was a problem.

"If the troops were getting all down in the mouth about not getting into the war..."
True enough.
I've seen that too.
But not in my unit.
We were too busy trying to keep afloat.
We hemo'd troops like a sieve, until we were barred from transferring out.
Then we had guys just up and leave.

[Eagle Eye]

It really doesn't matter if they're activated for 48 hours; they're still ACTIVE DUTY. Or do you have a problem understanding what ACTIVATED means?

Maybe you can come here and tell that to the reservists who are activated but not active duty. AGR is Active Guard/Reserve. These guys are active duty, not activated reservist who turn into pumpkins at the 180 day mark. As for there being a lot of Reservists and Guardsmen unaware of their lawful rank, I seriously doubt they suffer from the same delusions as you.

My patience is wearing thin with you, but I promise not to answer in the manner you deserve.

I did not say that the rank was irrelevant, as you state. I said that there were some federal restrictions on command and supervisory assignments for reservist. That is obviously a very hard distinction for many of you to grasp.

[Darksheare]

Well, I myself may actually be guilty of being overly emotional about it. ;-)
I had to deal with a bad officer in my unit. 9I'm out now.)
He was my captain, and he did things that just weren't acceptable at all.
Like it sounded like what was happening at the camp that LTC Bosse is in charge of. "very few garbage cans" "Trash piling up".
Sounded like the LTC neglected to call Logpac to haul the trash away, as well as neglecting to make sure there are enough trash bins for the volume of troops present.
My former Cap did stuff like that, among other things.
I get a case of the agita when I see anything sounding like officers mis-behaving or being neglectful in their duties. (General Shinseki.)

[Eagle Eye]

Congratulations. I'm sure that those base camps weren't hundreds of acres in the desert where the local population simply dumps their trash outside the city limits.

If it were truly a health and welfare situation, the contractor, who deals with the solid waste on base, should be called on it, not the soldiers. And yes, there are contractors there.

[TaRaRaBoomDeAyGoreLostToday!]

Exactly, and if you scroll down to posts above this just posted (and then some more) it is all the Lt. Col's fault.

The article itself 'leads' to blaming, and calls for sympathy for the soldiers that lost the phone tent privilige. If it is a situation that has gotten out of hand with new troops moving in and others out, in peacekeeping standdown conditions, there is time to gripe about garbage.

So you are looking at a 'messy' temp. base camp and you are in charge, what do you do, sit around and whine and blame the huge scene of things, (lots of water being drank and not enough bins) and say the people that are suppose to provide bins/garbage cans are in trouble now, and just sit and watch it compile out of hand. Or, order a way to get it somewhat cleaned up and ensure the living conditions improve via a privilige taken away.

No where does the article state this all happened because the Lt. Col forgot to call a garbage pick-up crew. The article whines and bashes a Lt. Col. with little facts in this public, whiney, embarrassing, civilian wanna be court-martial.

[KineticKitty]

So that's going to be the your running excuse, people were "mean" to him first? uh, ok?

Some members have got way out of hand on this thread, no if ands or buts about it. (but hey people are people) If you don't agree with a member fine, bash him/her alittle bit for good measure, fine. I'm not even giving 1/2 of these members posts a second glance, especially when it starts with "you didn't receive a phone call? Boo Hoo" and at that point it is blindingly clear they did not read my posts, but just went along with the "flow" of posts and joined in to have alittle fun, sheeple style. (And that last opinion shouldn't bother anyone it doesn't apply to, or to anyone that does not condone that type of behavior towards anyone.) Why haven't I been pointing this out over and over? What is the point after 2 times? People see what they want to see, right or wrong. It's nice to see some decent debating going on, but unfortunately it's not much.

So you see if people bashing people's heads in who don't agree with their feelings on this is o.k. Then how is a 0-5 receiving critiques from people really be to bad of a thing? (yah, that was a bit sarcastic)

Someone made a post (somewhere in this thread) along the lines of "peace protestors must be laughing or having fun with this". I would respectfully disagree if they are worried about what other people think. I would wager money it's giving some of the DU members that lurk here a big laugh about how we're suppose to be so tolerant, and how we tote free speech etc etc, and how we debate but "never" attack our own for not having the same belief systems, or even when we have differing opinions or disagreements. Regardless if some wants to believe I am the Anti-Christ or not, This thread certainly wouldn't serve as an example now would it???

You speak about someone that has been "personally attacked" and questioned, if personal attacks were something that moves you emotionally that much, you wouldn't stand for it when it comes to anyone, not just a selected few. I wonder though, when Clinton was our commander and chief and well before any of the allegations against him was proven to be true, how many Freepers stood up and said how unfair it was for people to be personally attacking him, or that their opinions shouldn't be aired here? Or they shouldn't speak of it since they are not at the white house personally, or in the "secret service".

I doubt many did, since most Freepers (thankfully) understand that people do have the right to say what they are thinking, Right or Wrong. But when it comes from a few people who have no problem going beyond debate, (some never actually attempting to debate it) and getting downright nasty about it in attacks, and then getting preachy about others getting "nasty" to begin with, one has to giggle and wonder what to call people who say whatever they want (which is all good) but turn around and imply that others should censor themselves or to shut up.

So your, and a few other FRmembers point is well taken, Everyone should shut up and censor their opinions about this man since of course they don't know him, respect him, understand him etc. All the while your assuming you know everything about members who are in disagreement with you on this down to possibly knowing their motives? ........that in reality you yourself don't even know.

So you'll just have to "suck up" the fact that people have opinions that don't mesh with your own on Free Republic, no matter how much it upsets you, and that some people actually do go into "ignore mode" with other members to keep from stooping to their "level" of debate.

[KineticKitty]

I can understand completely, our last commander is still currently under investigation and for good reason. I learned then, no matter what your rank. No one is perfect, or above scrutiny. I don't "wonder" about folks, unless they start to give me reasons to raise my eyebrows.

[TaRaRaBoomDeAyGoreLostToday!]

I'm not even giving 1/2 of these members posts a second glance, especially when it starts with "you didn't receive a phone call? Boo Hoo" and at that point it is blindingly clear they did not read my posts, but just went along with the "flow" of posts and joined in to have alittle fun, sheeple style.

You are unwarranted in accusing folks of following along/joining in, in disagreement with you, sheeple style. Read your original post...

I am beside myself in anger over this. This has happened even on Easter. There are families that have soldiers at Udairi that still have not heard from their loved one. This is beyond ridiculous. I only heard from my husband an hour ago and just found out about this, only because he had to go to another camp for a bad eye injury that is still not treated. He says that the phones had recently just been "re"hooked-up, but with the rest of 4ID pushing out very soon, how many will have the time to call home with the lines as bad as they get over there? We may never know.

Bosse said when the camp is clean, the phone tent will "absolutely" re-open immediately.

A few other things this article fails to mention is that the phones were kept down over 2 days, AND the soldiers were kept from the PX / Aafes. (where they can buy and obtain other needed supplies, like underarm deodorant, calling cards, envelopes, etc)

Is it any wonder why military families and soldiers feel screwed and unappreciated? They wonder why they have a retention problem? Sorry for the rant folks, but if you know of some way or something that can be done about this, please let me know. < /rant>

THEN, you post...

I'm sure the camp was cleaned up in a hurry. No one was hurt. No problem.

From the beginning, you did not post this thread 'for debate'. You vented and then asked if there was something anyone could do.And yet you state this...

But when it comes from a few people who have no problem going beyond debate, (some never actually attempting to debate it) and getting downright nasty about it in attacks, and then getting preachy about others getting "nasty" to begin with, one has to giggle and wonder what to call people who say whatever they want (which is all good) but turn around and imply that others should censor themselves or to shut up.

So you'll just have to "suck up" the fact that people have opinions that don't mesh with your own on Free Republic, no matter how much it upsets you, and that some people actually do go into "ignore mode" with other members to keep from stooping to their "level" of debate.

You started this thread, in a non debate fashion, and now you are telling folks you will go into 'ignore mode' because you did not get 300 fakey mushy sorry to hear this happened-ignoring facts of a seethingly bashing article of a Lt. Col. that can't defend himself, is embarassing to our military bearing. i tried to kindly state a vent is a vent but you don't seem to realize your playing the victim being attacked role is what is ridiculous.

And please don't even compare my venting of missing absentee ballots as an AD dependent to this thread; that was set-up -contradictory-like- with no real intent of your goal of accomplishment but bashing a Lt. Col. and not understanding why all posts in reply to your thread, did not agree with your contradictions.

The way you posted the thread was questionable and now you are posting because some folks aren't listening to you (not reading your posts) and are having fun bashing or something? You contradicted your own self in venting at first and then saying, no problem...no biggie. This is why I first questioned and asked what this thread would accomplish,what you thought would happen, and possibly your venting could be seen as nothing as whining as it is presented in contradiction from the get go.

Here is an example

Someone made a post (somewhere in this thread) along the lines of "peace protestors must be laughing or having fun with this". I would respectfully disagree if they are worried about what other people think. I would wager money it's giving some of the DU members that lurk here a big laugh about how we're suppose to be so tolerant, and how we tote free speech etc etc, and how we debate but "never" attack our own for not having the same belief systems, or even when we have differing opinions or disagreements. Regardless if some wants to believe I am the Anti-Christ or not, This thread certainly wouldn't serve as an example now would it???

I did not read anywhere where anyone demonized you to this far-stretched notion of anti-christ. You, have dramatized this out of hand. What the poster I think, meant was that peace protesters will take glee in the fact of a soldiers wife whining publically over such a trivial issue utilizing the anti-war, leftists stance of 'the blame game' and whining. Venting is one thing but for the love of God go re-read your original contradictory post, you asked for help to 'do something about this. This is very immature, I am sorry.

[Delta 21]

Dont you even think about soiling my latrine!
I wanna call my Mommy one of these days!

[TaRaRaBoomDeAyGoreLostToday!]

Messy camp costs troops calls to home

By Cox News Service

April 20, 2003

CAMP UDAIRI, Kuwait - On the eve of Easter, Fort Hood's sons and daughters couldn't call home from this miserable desert outpost because the place has been declared too messy."

_____________________________________________________________________________________

I am truly sorry i do not mean to attack nor be mean and maybe you don;t realize what your thread looks like. But I feel anyone even remotely associated with the military would shutter at the first paragraph of the whining of the "miserable desert outpost."

What angers me is I don't think this is how any of the troops are. They are not whiners!!! And yet you post the article and back the liberal news service and join in the whining and then get mellow dramatic when folks are outraged and don't coddle you?!

The very first paragraph of the article you posted, of what I immediately perceive as the whiney liberal media is not the military I know and love as my own family.Bottom line truth:dependent whiners get their spouses in trouble, I have seen this over and over.

[FirstTomato]

TaRaRa, and everyone! stop dumping on her! I posted a comment at first, encouraging her to save her anger for more important things. But later it dawned on me that her husband is sick, and she is naturally worried!

We should have a little compassion, and know that for people who wait, all things connected to their loved ones, seem important and are important.

I know that KineticKitty doesn't really need me to defend her, she's doing a fine job of doing it herself. But I will, anyway!

SO STOP RAGGING ON KINETIC KITTY. HER HUBBY IS IN THE MIDDLE EAST DOING HIS DUTY (AND HE HAS AN INJURY) AND SHE IS VERY WORRIED. IF SHE NEEDS TO VENT AND GET ANGRY WHAT'S IT TO YOU? THE MILITARY WON'T FALL APART BECAUSE SHE IS ANGRY.

So shut up already. Unless you have something nice to say to her.

[flyer182]

Negative is about they only way you know how to react. Since trash was piling up wouldn't it be the reason the LtCol decided that the standards were being ignored. No " Oh gee, I am a LtCol who forgot to coordinate the Logpac, make the troops pay so no one notices" What happens when the guys who haul the trash show up and it is spread all over the place? But you have the all knowing eye. I will now leave you to your bitter complaining about picking up trash.

[sit-rep]

I can understand why you have this "edge" now. Well, all I can say is some guys have all the luck!

SR

[Tailback]

Infantry isn't fit to clean out a cav troopers latrine. That being said, how did those infantry guys get to the middle east, did they swim? Oh, they rode in planes? How are they transported to landstuhl after they play bulletstopper? Oh, they ride in planes?

All these stories of how tough infantry is just masks the fact that your GT score is too low to be a cook in the AF. Keep repeating those ridiculous comments to yourself and eventually you might believe them, but I've seen both side of the coin and I know better.

[NFOShekky]

"I said that there were some federal restrictions on command and supervisory assignments for reservist. That is obviously a very hard distinction for many of you to grasp."

Can you give us the Fed. Regulation number or Code section that you are referring to?

[flyer182]

You sound a trifle defensive concerning the manliness of your chosen service. nothing wrong with being in the AF. If you can't be a warrior, be a warrior supporter.

[Darksheare]

We were PRAYING that our previous Captain could return...