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While I agree with this rich liberal that the people of Iraq (and most of the rest of the third world) are not ready for democracy, one little thing about this opinion annoys me. Namely, these same folks agitate for uncontrolled third world immigration to the West. My question is this: If these folks can't run a civil society in their home country, why on earth do we think that they will help us to maintain one in the West once they flood to the US and Europe?

Clearly, we need to rethink our immigration policies across the Western world. If the Muslims can't run Baghdad, why does anyone think that they'll be able to run London?

If these folks can't run a civil society in their home country, why on earth do we think that they will help us to maintain one in the West once they flood to the US and Europe?

Wow, that is a really good point. I'd like to ask some of these people a question like this, but you know they never answer, they say, "Look, ..." and go off on some talking points that aren't even related to the question.

I've gotten to where, when I ask someone a pointed question, if they begin their answer with a sigh and "Look," I know there's no point in even staying around.

While there are plenty of countries that are socially and culturally unprepared for a Western-style democracy, I don't believe Iraq is one of those countries.

If these folks can't run a civil society in their home country, why on earth do we think that they will help us to maintain one in the West once they flood to the US and Europe?

A very good question!!!

WOW! You must really be mad at daddy.

"While I agree with this rich liberal that the people of Iraq (and most of the rest of the third world) are not ready for democracy,..."

-Saddam an dthe Baathists had the same view. Their- and your own- small minded arrogance matches that of that buffoon Rocekfeller and also reveals your own ignorance, as well. The Iraqis are just as deserving of life under a free political and economic system as you, me, and EVERYONE else is. We- i.e. ALL HUMANS- have been endowed the right to live in freedom by our Creator regardless whether or not you publicly acknowledge Him or try to deny his existence or even ridicule, persecute, and/or execute his children. Read, the American Constitution, and the Federalist Papers and join a prayer group. It will change your life for the better. (Before you respond to the suggestion, just try it first you owe yourself and your family at least that much.)

"one little thing about this opinion annoys me. Namely, these same folks agitate for uncontrolled third world immigration to the West."

-OF COURSE THEY DO! If you were treated as a slave in your country and you had even one ounce of self-respect you would also "agitate" to either overthrow the regime enslaving you or more easily- leave and go to a country where you could live and raise your family in freedom and dignity. As more and more countries join the 21st century with free political and economic systems, the need for people to emigrate to the West will also diminish.

"If these folks can't run a civil society in their home country..."

-What do you mean by "these folks"? HOW can honest, ethical individuals "run" a civil society when the societies they flee from are NOT civil and are currently "run" by sociopaths with armed thugs to carry out their whims over the populace?

"why on earth do we think that they will help us to maintain one in the West once they flood to the US and Europe?"

If you have the interest in LEARNING, you will see the United States was founded and has been maintaining a civil society by the very types of people you apparently despise.

"we need to rethink our immigration policies across the Western world..."

-YOU need to start THINKING. It would also be MOST helpful if Canada simply took care of just a few things like securing its border with us, stopped subsidizing private businesses, stopped rewarding that other embarassment of human history- Castro- and handed over individuals who have violated US laws and/or are planning to harm American citizens and their property.

"If the Muslims can't run Baghdad, why does anyone think that they'll be able to run London? "

-Such racist assertions are tiresome. Just out of curiousity, why do you hate Muslims? The overwhelming majority in EVERY country are decent, productive citizens. Here in the US, they have made tremendous contributions to American society as beautiful, hardworking, law-abiding citizens- a vital part of America's wonderful mosaic that makes her a shining example to the world as a viable alternative to anarchy and tyranny. (No, I am not a Muslim but I- like all true FREEPERS respect all honest, hardworking, compassionate individuals without regard to what their personal religious beliefs might be. It might do you some good to change your attitude and follow the US example too.) Good Luck to you.